If Berg succeeds, can we sic him after the rest of the politicians that aren't natural born citizens? Like Bob Menendez?
Posted on 07/03/2008 4:35:19 PM PDT by SE Mom
Jay McKinnon, a self-described Department of Homeland Security-trained document specialist, has implicated himself in the production of fraudulent Hawaii birth certificate images similar to the one endorsed as genuine by the Barack Obama campaign, and appearing on the same blog entry where the supposedly authentic document appears.
The evidence of forgery and manipulation of images of official documents, triggered by Israel Insider's revelation of the collection of Hawaii birth certificate images on the Photobucket site and the detective work of independent investigative journalists and imaging professionals in the three weeks since the publication of the images, implicate the Daily Kos, an extreme left blog site, and the Obama campaign, in misleading the public with official-looking but manipulated document images of doubtful provenance.
The perceived unreliability of the image has provoked petitions and widespread demands for Obama to submit for objective inspection the paper versions of the "birth certificate" he claimed in his book Dreams from My Father was in his possession, as well as the paper version of the Certificate of Live Birth for which the image on the Daily Kos and the Obama "Fight the Smears" website was supposedly generated.
Without a valid birth certificate, Obama cannot prove he fulfills the "natural born citizen" requirement of the Constitution, throwing into doubt his eligibility to run for President.
McKinnon, who says he is 25-30 years old, operates a website called OpenDNA.com and uses the OpenDNA screen name on various web sites and blogs, including his comments and diary on The Daily Kos. In recent years he has divided his time between Long Beach, California and Vancouver, British Columbia. He is a Democratic political activist, frequent contributor to the left wing Daily Kos blog, and a fervent Barack Obama supporter.
(Excerpt) Read more at web.israelinsider.com ...
You’re welcome, Candor7. Nadar predicts Hil will be Obamba’s VP; check this out.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2064660/posts
It is drawn according the the hospital records of the birth, and proof of US citizenship of at least one of the parents, and a valid marriage certificate in the case where one parent is not a US citizen.
This would have been the case with McCain.
Interesting, indeed.
Ooooo, you used the R word! Naughty, naughty.
If Berg succeeds, can we sic him after the rest of the politicians that aren't natural born citizens? Like Bob Menendez?
The natural born requirement applies to the President and Vice-President only. The Senate and House just have to be citizens.
That may be true; but Menendez has falsified his date of birth.
Olson's participation in this dance so far has been purely as a political advocate--here were his arguments; I can make the arguments for McCain as well as Olson can, but the bottom line is that he was born as a citizen of a foreign government, subject to the sovereignty of another government, and he flunks the Constitutional test.
Your analysis of juris soli also wouldn't fly as real legal analysis (I assume you are not a lawyer)--offspring of an alien who are born in the U S are not subject to the sovereignty of the foreign power at birth.
Your analysis of the practical power of Congress to address the issue is all very interesting but there is no real legal authority and no basis on which to predict how a Constitutional crisis would play out. But there isn't any doubt that once it is determined that a majority of the Electors, elected in November are Obama electors, there will be a Constitutional crisis when the facts surface. Assuming the Dems control Congress, they might be satisfied with President Biden.
As to the ultimate issue with respect to Obama--there is no doubt that he was born in Kenya. A look at the record of what he has done over the last four or five years on the subject just doesn't leave any room for doubt. The so called Birth Certificate, even if real (and it is a photoshoped fraud in its present condition), doesn't say anything on the subject--all of the states issue birth certificates to people who were not born in that state; that is one of the reasons a birth certificate is in poor repute as an identification document.
A certificate of the state of actual birth records would have more credibility--complete with a copy of the footprint; Obama hasn't released that document and isn't going to. Whatever it says supports the finding that he was born in Kenya.
Proof of what?
Of any mismatch between the CoLB in the latest FactCheck photos and the older images of the CoLB from KOS and FTS.
They're all posted here.
I haven’t seen such images.
*
Olson's participation in this dance so far has been purely as a political advocate-As the former Solicitor General and a distinguished conservative I doubt he lets court pleadings turn into political documents under his name. Please address his legal arguments presented in court rather than just his credibility.
... he flunks the Constitutional test.By one of the untested theories of the meaning of this vague constitutional test.
I assume you are not a lawyerI never said I was. That's one of the reasons I post so many pointers to credible references (ie. the law, the State Department, court cases, ...).
Please destroy my arguments with lawyerly precision, including some pointers to legal authorities.
Your analysis of juris soli also wouldn't fly as real legal analysis (I assume you are not a lawyer)--offspring of an alien who are born in the U S are not subject to the sovereignty of the foreign power at birth.The State Department disagrees with you. See this note on dual citizenship from their website.
Persons may have dual nationality by automatic operation of different laws rather than by choice.Your argument as to why a citizen born abroad fails the test is that the defect follows him into his presidency. This issue applies to citizens born in the US with dual citizenship as well....
The U.S. Government recognizes that dual nationality exists but does not encourage it as a matter of policy because of the problems it may cause. Claims of other countries on dual national U.S. citizens may conflict with U.S. law, and dual nationality may limit U.S. Government efforts to assist citizens abroad.
...
However, dual nationals owe allegiance to both the United States and the foreign country. They are required to obey the laws of both countries. Either country has the right to enforce its laws, particularly if the person later travels there.
...
Information on losing foreign citizenship can be obtained from the foreign country's embassy and consulates in the United States.
But there isn't any doubt that once it is determined that a majority of the Electors, elected in November are Obama electors, there will be a Constitutional crisis when the facts surface.If he was proven to have been born in Kenya there is no doubt we would have a constitutional "crisis" on our hands. The Constitution lays out the procedures for dealing with it.
As to the ultimate issue with respect to Obama--there is no doubt that he was born in Kenya. A look at the record of what he has done over the last four or five years on the subject just doesn't leave any room for doubt.We disagree here but it is a judgment call. I'll continue to concede that if he was born in Kenya he is toast (is that a proper legal term? lol).
You didn't address the point that the courts cannot remove a president. How do challenges to his eligibility get into discovery? There is no remedy the court can offer. I don't want to assume that the lack of a response means you agree with me.
The bottom line is in my judgment this is a political issue for the voters and Congress to decide. The courts aren't given a role. I think we agree on that though I not 100% sure.
... complete with a copy of the footprint ...I can picture having him give a footprint to match. lol
Could you make a few smaller images of key parts of the new FactCheck CoLB overlaid on the oldest KOS image?
“Highway 61 Revisited, see post above.”
Holy crap!!!!
However, a WND investigation has found that at least part of Berg's lawsuit relies on discredited claims.This is a poorly worded sentence. I grouped it in bold the way I interpret it but left the rest to avoid self serving quotes...
The lawsuit claims Barack Obama's eligibility is questionable on several grounds, including the allegation that he was born in Kenya to parents unable to automatically grant him American citizenship, that his Hawaii birth certificate is a forgery – a now discredited claim – that he was made a citizen of Indonesia as a child and that he retained foreign citizenship into adulthood without recording an oath of allegiance to regain any theoretical American citizenship.
In short, the suit claims Obama was not born an American citizen; lost any hypothetical American citizenship he had as a child (Editor's note: This point is not supported by U.S. citizenship law);I hope they plan on publishing the names and qualifications of these experts. It doesn't say if they had the actual document or scans.A separate WND investigation into Obama's birth certificate utilizing forgery experts also found the document to be authentic.
The investigation also revealed methods used by some of the bloggers to determine the document was fake involved forgeries, in that a few bloggers added text and images to the certificate scan that weren't originally there.It would be nice to know which bloggers added text. That's a pretty serious charge that should be substantiated. Which bloggers did this?
The claim could not be verified by WND inquiries to Hawaiian hospitals, since state law bars the hospitals from releasing medical records to the public. ...It's the law folks. See earlier links.However, there doesn't seem to be any evidence Ann Dunham expatriated. Also, consulting citizenship experts contend that if Obama indeed obtained Indonesian citizenship, it simply would not have been recognized by the U.S., but the presidential candidate would retain his American citizenship.
A WND investigation could not find any proof Obama used an Indonesian passport to travel to Pakistan. However, WND noted that Pakistan in 1981 was under military rule and that it was difficult for U.S. citizens to travel to the country without assistance – meaning, it would have been easier to enter Pakistan on an Indonesian passport.But it doesn't matter because a dual national (if he was one) using his foreign passport (if he had one) is not grounds for losing American citizenship.
I wouldn't take WND's word for anything, but it would be nice to see the actual evidence they have collected.
And as you said -- who is accused of adding text and images?
We know that there were a number of joke images where text and images were added.
marked 2 read
Your excerpts of the WND piece are nothing, and you know it.I have a hard time buying anything that WND says. I thought that was clear from my comments. The story was very sloppy. I had not seen their comments before today though. If they have evidence they should just put it out and not hint at it.
WND definitely shouldn't claim a blogger doctored images without naming the blogger and providing some proof. They made the claim in such a way as to cast suspicion on everyone who has dealt with the images. Really unfair.
My question is though, why is Corsi's employer raining on this parade? Especially after he tried to bring it into the MSM.
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