Calico: A 200,000-year Old Site In The Americas?

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[blam]

Calico: A 200,000-year old site in the Americas?

New World archaeological sites inferred to be even slightly older than the 11.5 ka Clovis complexes have been controversial; so claims for a 200 ka site in North America have heretofore been treated with substantial disdain. But the acceptance of Monte Verde and Diring may soon change that.

The classic "ancient site" in the New World is "Calico," located in the Central Mojave Desert of California (Shlemon and Budinger, 1990). Two issues have dogged acceptance of Calico by mainstream archaeologists: (1) the authenticity of the artifacts; are they truly the product of human manufacture, or merely naturally produced "geofacts?" and (2) the obvious pre-Clovis age of the deposits (see, for example, lengthy discussions in Leakey and others, 1968; Haynes, 1973; Bryan, 1978; Taylor and Payen, 1975; Carter, 1980; Meighen, 1983; Patterson, 1983; and Budinger and Simpson, 1985).

Thought to be about 200 ka old, the deeply buried chert and chalcedony tools of Calico are usually dismissed as being artifacts. However, if shown to respected Old World archaeologists, many Calico assemblages are readily described as typical Paleolithic implements. Regardless, when told that the ancient tools come from the New World, these same archaeologists then often reject their original interpretation! So much for unbiased reasoning in science! Nevertheless, although it will take time, the pre-Clovis Monte Verde site in Chile and the 260 ka Diring site in Siberia may well provide a "stepping stone" for mainstream archaeological acceptance of the Calico site.

[gleeaikin]

Some years ago I was talking with a woman archeologist in a bar. She told me about a site in California that was around 200 to 300,000 years old but was being rejected by the scientific establishment. I wonder whatever happened to that site.

[blam]

I don't know. George Carter was convinced it was this old.

His book, Earlier Than You Think is a good read.

"His geologist's background and unending curiosity allowed him to see evidence where others' untrained eyes saw only a few broken rocks. The book is filled with charming anecdotes about archaeological digs Carter has worked on and infuriating tales about how the establishment has sought to quiet him. Although he did not personally work on it, the Calico site in California is included for reference and is the only site in North America that famed archaeologist Dr. Louis Leakey supervised"

Carter got so pissed that archaeologists wouldn't listen to him that he got a (I believe) PhD in archaeology. Still they didn't listen.

[little jeremiah]

“Forbidden Archeology” has a lot of info about stuff like that. Can’t cite anything ‘cause I’m too tired to go find the book and look stuff up. But it has a lot.

[SunkenCiv]

I liked what I read of that book, but it’s enormous.

http://www.mcremo.com/museum.htm

[little jeremiah]

He published a sort of condensed version, the same basics but not so many footnotes and scholarly stuff; I think it’s called “The Hidden History of the Human Race” - I’m moving what I laughingly call my “office” so my books are upstairs right now.

[SunkenCiv]

I think that one is around also, but, uh, can’t prove it. :’o

[1010RD]

Wow, just found this from your link. That’s fascinating and if the 200K dating holds it certainly upends a lot of other ‘theories’.

[blam]

"That’s fascinating and if the 200K dating holds it certainly upends a lot of other ‘theories’. "

Yes...we have much to learn.

I think big suprises are to be found in South America.

[blam]

"That’s fascinating and if the 200K dating holds it certainly upends a lot of other ‘theories’. "

Yes...we have much to learn.

I think big suprises are to be found in South America.

[SunkenCiv]

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[Theophilus]

The more anceint a thng is the more interesting it tends to be. And “facts” tend to survive based upon how interesting they are rather than how true or provable they are.

[blam]

Boy...You sure found an old one.

Happy Memorial Day.

[ThanhPhero]

Caucasian, "white" people can and do become quite "red" in skin color after prolonged exposure to the sun, particularly in the middle of North America. I've seen it happen to nearly all male Swedes, for instance, after they've farmed many years. knew a fellow on the fishing docks who was pale skinned with yellow head hair,p>When I was young I knew a fellow on the fishing docks who, in winter, was pale skinned with receding yellow hair big bushy yellow eyebrows and longish curly body hair, also yellow. He had prominent brow ridges and we all called him Apeman. In the summer after a couple of months on the Gulf in only a pair of shorts he was colored dark bronze red and all that hair was purest white. He was a strange looking fellow. He was a southern boy, of course, named Bobby Joe.

[blam]

"He was a southern boy, of course, named Bobby Joe. "

My brother was a Southern boy too...named Billy Joe. He was an excellent line-backer.

[JimSEA]

Just like there has been a revolution in paleontology during the last sixty years because we are learning what to look for and where, I think your non conforming archaeological finds are because we are now willing to look for them. Excellent posts.

[cloudmountain]

I’ve been to Calico, Arizona. Famous ghost town.

[PIF]

I thought Monte Verde was in Chile ... is this a different one with the same name?

Or are you referring to a site off Cuba which was reportedly found by some Russian woman doing sonar readings some years back, and who claimed there were structures down 100 ftm or so with copper roofs?

[blam]

I didn't call the site off Cuba, Monte Verde.

There are two different sites covered...one in Cuba, which I can't find any info on, and the other in Chile, Tom Dillehay

[PIF]

Sorry don’t mean to be argumentative.
You said:

Yup. Archaeology/anthropology in the Americas are already in revolt. Monte Verde broke the mold....and if the underwater site (2200 ft) off the coast of Cuba proves to be human, the flood gates are open. (World history will be rewritten)

Which I read as meaning a site in Cuba. Now as you have claified it: you were talking about two different sites.

The one in Cuba waters was featured on the old Art Bell Show and his Coast to Coast web site. There were some pictures and a blurb or two and there was some speculation, I believe, that the Mich. Upper Peninsula ancient copper mines had something to do with the site, but I never learned anything more. That’s all I know.

Have or do you subscribe to Ancient American? I did for a while - was some really interesting stuff printed.

[blam]

"Have or do you subscribe to Ancient American? I did for a while - was some really interesting stuff printed."

I did for a little while. They are guilty of faking things and then pretending to find them in ancient places,etc. It's all phony. They guy who owns/runs it changed his name because he is an ex-Nazi leader. Read here, Frank Collin