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'Oldest star chart' found
BBC NEWS ^ | Tuesday, 21 January, 2003, 10:50 GMT | By Dr David Whitehouse

Posted on 01/21/2003 3:26:34 PM PST by vannrox


'Oldest star chart' found



The oldest image of a star pattern, that of the famous constellation of Orion, has been recognised on an ivory tablet some 32,500 years old.

The tiny sliver of mammoth tusk contains a carving of a man-like figure with arms and legs outstretched in the same pose as the stars of Orion.

The claim is made by Dr Michael Rappenglueck, formerly of the University of Munich, who is already renowned for his pioneering work locating star charts painted on the walls of prehistoric caves.

The tablet also contains mysterious notches, carved on its sides and on its back. These could be a primitive "pregnancy calendar", designed to estimate when a pregnant woman will give birth.

Man-like figure

It was found in 1979 in a cave in the Ach Valley in the Alb-Danube region of Germany. Carbon dating of bone ash deposits found next to the tablet suggest it is between 32,500 and 38,000 years old, making it one of the oldest representations of a man ever found.

It was left behind by the mysterious Aurignacian people about whom we know next to nothing save that they moved into Europe from the east supplanting the indigenous Neanderthals.

The ivory tablet is small, measuring only 38 x 14 x 4 millimetres, but from the notches carved into its edges archaeologists believe that it was made that size and is not a fragment of something bigger.

On one side of the tablet is the man-like being with his legs apart and arms raised. Between his legs hangs what could be a sword and his waist is narrow. His left leg is shorter than his right one.

Rappenglueck has found other evidence

From what is speculated about the myths of these ancient peoples before the dawn of history, archaeologists have suggested that the man-like figure could be praying or dancing, or be a half-man, half- cat, or a divine being.

But Michael Rappenglueck thinks it is a drawing of the constellation of Orion that is nowadays, and was perhaps also 32,000 years ago, called the hunter.

The proportions of the man correspond to the pattern of stars that comprise Orion, especially its slim waist - which corresponds to its famous belt of three stars and the left "leg" of the constellation being shorter.

The "sword" on the ivory tablet also corresponds to a famous and well-know feature that can be seen in Orion.

There are also other indications that Dr Rappenglueck may be correct.

The stars were in slightly different positions 32,000 years ago because they are moving across the sky at different speeds and in different directions, a phenomenon called "proper motion".

Dr Rappenglueck allowed for this effect by using a computer program to wind back the sky and found evidence for a particular star in Orion that was in a different place all those years ago.

Human gestation period

The tablet may also be a pregnancy calendar.

There are 86 notches on the tablet, a number that has two special meanings.

First, it is the number of days that must be subtracted from a year to equal the average number of days of a human gestation. This is no coincidence, says Dr Rappenglueck.

It is also the number of days that one of Orion's two prominent stars, Betelguese, is visible. To ancient man, this might have linked human fertility with the gods in the sky.

Orion is one of the most striking constellations. The Ancient Egyptians identified it with their god Osiris and it has a special significance for many cultures throughout history throughout the world.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: ancient; archaeoastronomy; archaeology; bigdipper; bone; chart; ggg; godsgravesglyphs; history; notch; past; space; star
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Very Interesting.
1 posted on 01/21/2003 3:26:34 PM PST by vannrox
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2 posted on 01/21/2003 3:28:38 PM PST by Support Free Republic (Your support keeps Free Republic going strong!)
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To: vannrox
That's not a star chart.

That's the first Sylvester Stallone movie and those are arrow notches on the back.
3 posted on 01/21/2003 3:29:18 PM PST by DannyTN
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To: vannrox
I'm unconvinced.

Any representation of the constellation would have some indication of the three stars of the belt, plus the sword.

These publicity-hounds are forgetting that just because we think of it as a hunter, doesn't mean that other cultures would. Moreover, many stars move noticeably over tens of thousands of years (I'm unsure about Orion, but I recall that the Big Dipper looked quite different a couple tens of thousands of years ago.)
4 posted on 01/21/2003 3:41:22 PM PST by Atlas Sneezed
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To: Beelzebubba
Wow, & I thought I was old!
5 posted on 01/21/2003 3:45:12 PM PST by norraad
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To: vannrox
Bump
6 posted on 01/21/2003 3:46:16 PM PST by Fiddlstix (Tag Line Service Center: FREE Tag Line with Every Monthly Donation to FR. Get Yours. Inquire Within)
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To: vannrox
Between his legs hangs what could be a sword

Hmm, now what else could possibly be hanging between his legs?

Sounds like ancient man sure had a lot of useless time on his hands. And why does every artifact from olden days always have to be interpreted as involving religious rites? Maybe in 32,000 years scientists will interpret Britney Spears Pepsi ads as being demented rituals to the moon goddess. Or wait, are they?

7 posted on 01/21/2003 5:00:50 PM PST by KellyAdmirer
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To: KellyAdmirer
demented rituals to the moon goddess. Or wait, are they?

Ya got the demented part right, at least

8 posted on 01/21/2003 5:09:14 PM PST by Ace's Dad
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To: KellyAdmirer
On one side of the tablet is the man-like being with his legs apart and arms raised. Between his legs hangs what could be a sword and his waist is narrow. His left leg is shorter than his right one.

Ah..right. Yes, that's a sword, or are you happy to see me?

9 posted on 01/21/2003 5:16:41 PM PST by WL-law
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To: KellyAdmirer
On one side of the tablet is the man-like being with his legs apart and arms raised. Between his legs hangs what could be a sword and his waist is narrow. His left leg is shorter than his right one.

Ah..right. Yes, that's a sword, or are you happy to see me?

10 posted on 01/21/2003 5:17:20 PM PST by WL-law
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To: blam
Ping
11 posted on 01/21/2003 5:23:14 PM PST by Bohemund
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To: Bohemund
Thanks for the Ping. Already posted here
12 posted on 01/21/2003 5:27:01 PM PST by blam
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To: Beelzebubba
I couldn't find any movies of the proper motion of stars in Orion, but here's a page which shows the stars in the Big Dipper moving.

link

13 posted on 01/21/2003 5:29:16 PM PST by KarlInOhio (Tagline.txt not found. Abort, Retry, Fail?)
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To: blam
"Oldest Star Chart"

Hell, that ain't Orion. That is a carving of Mick Jaeger, the oldest star on the charts!

14 posted on 01/21/2003 5:29:34 PM PST by FastCoyote
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To: KellyAdmirer
in 32,000 years scientists will interpret Britney Spears Pepsi ads as being demented rituals to the moon goddess

In 32,000 years the religion of the "moon goddess" may be the only thing left.

15 posted on 01/21/2003 5:36:33 PM PST by struwwelpeter
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To: Beelzebubba
These publicity-hounds are forgetting that just because we think of it as a hunter, doesn't mean that other cultures would. Moreover, many stars move noticeably over tens of thousands of years

Mammoth tusks grow on mammoths, and mammoths don't exactly grow on a farm. He did take proper motion into consideration.

16 posted on 01/21/2003 5:37:57 PM PST by AndrewC
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To: vannrox; Beelzebubba; KellyAdmirer; blam; AndrewC; happygrl; pabianice; aristeides; ...
When all you have is a hammer, everything begins to look like a nail. When all you have are star charts, everything begins to look like stars. This "scientist's" theory has more holes in it than an Iraqi Republican Guard tank.

Dr Rappenglueck says:   "[86] is the number of days that must be subtracted from a year to equal the average number of days of a human gestation."

Baloney. Normal human gestation is 263-266 days, meaning that the number of notches should have been 99-102 not 86 if the good doctors interpretation were correct.

Dr Rappenglueck says:   "[86] is also the number of days that one of Orion's two prominent stars, Betelguese, is visible."

Baloney. If we neglect twilight, Betelguese would be visible for about 180 days per year. When considering the effect of twilight, there are three standards that could be used: Civil, Nautical and Astronomical twilight. Astronomical is the most rigorous of these and is defined as where the sun is 18º below the horizon. Subtracting 18º from both horizons means that Betelguese is visible for 146 days per year, not the 86 days that the doctor claims.

Dr Rappenglueck says:   "The 'sword' on the ivory tablet also corresponds to a famous and well-know feature that can be seen in Orion."

Baloney. No metal working = no swords and the Bronze Age was still 30,000 years in the future. Moreover, the concept that the stars in question in Orion might represent a sword is entirely a cultural presumption and it begs credibility to presume that two independent cultures would interpret the various star patterns the same way (especially when they didn't have swords).

Dr Rappenglueck says:   "Dr Rappenglueck allowed for this effect by using a computer program to wind back the sky."

Baloney. If the Orion constellation had matched an overlay of the figure on the ivory carving, you can bet your bottom dollar that would be photo number one in this article. Or at the very least, the good doctor would have claimed that it had matched up. 32,000 years equals a hell of a lot of proper motion and the shape of the Orion constellation would more likely correspond to road kill than a standing man with a "sword".

Typical BBC crap.

Regards,

--Boot Hill

17 posted on 01/21/2003 8:16:36 PM PST by Boot Hill (Ctrl) (Alt) (del)
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To: vannrox
'Oldest star chart' found...it wasn't under Hillarys' coat was it ?????????
18 posted on 01/21/2003 8:58:42 PM PST by exmoor
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To: norraad
ROFL!

(I should have said that I recall READING that the stars looked different eons ago.)
19 posted on 01/22/2003 6:20:22 AM PST by Atlas Sneezed
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To: KarlInOhio
Orion? You mean this guy?


20 posted on 01/22/2003 12:26:45 PM PST by far sider
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