Posted on 07/25/2010 3:35:08 AM PDT by GonzoII
Evangelical Protestants are taught to recruit Catholics by exploiting their lack of Bible knowledge, but use Scripture out of context to make Catholic beliefs look flawed.
This is the claim of Catholic apologist Steve Ray, in Perth from the United States of America earlier this month as part of a national tour. Mr Ray used to take on this role.
“We were trained to evangelise Catholics – we believed you are not saved, that you are going to hell as you follow the Pope instead of Jesus, you pray to Mary instead of God, you have tradition instead of Scripture, you thought you got saved by doing good works instead of by faith in Jesus,” he told about 60 people on Thursday, 8 July, at Trinity College, East Perth.
“It was our job to get you saved and become real Bible Christians. This is what Evangelicals think – most of them, even in Australia.”
He said that he was taught the right questions to ask and memorised up to 15 verses that “were good to use with Catholics”.
Mr Ray, married to Janet for 33 years with four children, said he and his wife went from being “anti-Catholic Baptists” to “crossing an uncrossable chasm and becoming Catholics”.
The Rays were not alone. They opened their home for two years to people seeking to discuss their differences with Catholics and explained why they converted, “even if people hated Catholics”.
In that time, Mr Ray said over 200 people joined the Catholic Church.
Addressing several key issues that cause the at-times vicious divide, especially in the United States, between Protestants and Catholics, Mr Ray said he achieved “great success” by asking carefully selected questions and backing them up with isolated Scripture quotes.
(Excerpt) Read more at therecord.com.au ...
More and more people are returning to Catholicism as some other Church’s are turning to the practice’s of suborning their religions to deviant sexual acts, or accepting women as Priests.
Some things I consider basic . They brag on their reading the Bible ,but they appear to pick and choose their passage’s. My knowledge of the Bible is not extensive,but I do believe I understand why Sodom and Gomorrah were destroyed.
They are very brave people to admit what they used to do.
Venturer I agree to a point. However, the Catholic church has been growing around the would. My wife converted to the faith from Buddhism. Our son is in the Seminary. That biggest growth in the church is in Africa and Southamerica and USA. We have seen an explosion since the church changed the instruction of Revolution Theology in Most Semiaries around the would. Most of the grow is since the 1970’s. You will find that since the Vatican reviewed the seminary and got their teachings and behavior in line. Now there is an explosion of vocations.
"Crossing the Tiber" http://www.amazon.com/Crossing-Tiber-Evangelical-Protestants-Historical/dp/0898705770/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1280057368&sr=8-1
"Upon the Rock" http://www.amazon.com/Upon-This-Rock-Scripture-Apologetics/dp/0898707234/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1280057368&sr=8-2
Both of which helped me to find my way back ionto the Catholic Church
For the life of me I cannot see why the Church allowed themselves to get in the position of hiding deviant Priests and eturning them to parish’s to practice more of their deviancy.
I am simply glad to see they are taking steps to stop it.
I have noticed that we are getting some youger priests, and the seminarian we have at our Church this summer seems a fine young man who will be a great asset to the Church.
Oh. THIS is going to be a nice friendly thread ....
If anybody needs me, I’ll be in the bombshelter in the basement.
I’m reminded of the relations between the faiths in the small town where I grew up.
It was over 50 years ago. I was raised United Methodist, we didn’t call ourselves “evangelicals”, we were simply “Methodist”. Jewelry, makeup and dancing were all works of the devil - until the preacher’s kids hit their teenage years, then it was acceptable. There was little agreement between Protestant religions, and none between Protestant and Catholic. Our church looked down on the Presbyterians, we believed in free will, the Presbyterians believed in 100% complete predestination - to the point that we were nothing but puppets and God was pulling our strings. Baptists believed only full immersion was true baptism. We took our religion seriously and it was the cause of a number of after school fights. Protestants were taught that Catholics were idol worshippers, after all - they had statues (idols) in their church and actually prayed to (or through) them.
The bickering was why I left the Church as soon as I was old enough to assert independence.
When we moved back a dozen years ago some things had not changed. It wasn’t as wide spread as before, but the small church beside our house was very “old line”. They didn’t claim affiliation with any denomination, considering themselves independent Christians. The big thing that shocked me was their attitude toward education. Less was better. My wife was welcome and given the job of childcare during services. I have a bachelor’s degree and it was made clear I wasn’t welcome.
Bible studies are very much promoted in the Catholic Church now and have been for a few decades.
[“We were trained to evangelise Catholics – we believed you are not saved, that you are going to hell as you follow the Pope instead of Jesus, you pray to Mary instead of God, you have tradition instead of Scripture, you thought you got saved by doing good works instead of by faith in Jesus,” he told about 60 people on Thursday, 8 July, at Trinity College, East Perth.]
Mary was not crucified for our sins, died and buried and risen from the grave on the third day for our salvation and she was not the mother of God, she was the mother of the body of Jesus, a virgin, and was the handmaiden of the Lord but a sinner saved by grace through faith in the God of Israel. And the popes office was created by the church at Babylon(Rome), a religious order that persecuted Jews and Bible believing Christians throuhout the centuries and is in fact the largest cult group that God will destroy during the 7 year tribulation with all false religious groups.
First,all religions can believe but they will but those who do not believe the gospel of salvation as stated clearly in I Corinthians 15: 1-4 are not saved no matter what they belive or do if they do not believe this particular gospel of the Father concerning His Son Jesus Christ our Lord and Saviour. They have a legal right in America to believe as they will but the gospel is clear and cult religions including Roman Catholicism is not the gospel of the Scriputure. I was never trained to evangelize Christians by the Body of Christ, I was instructed by the Scriptures to preach the salvation gospel of Jesus Christ to all the world baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Ghost. The gospel of salvation is;
1 Corinthians 15
1Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
This must be accepted by grace through faith without works as good works are vain for savation without faith in God’s Word in the Scriptures.
Ephesians 2:
4But God, who is rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us,
5Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
6And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
7That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
8For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9Not of works, lest any man should boast.
10For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
11Wherefore remember, that ye being in time past Gentiles in the flesh, who are called Uncircumcision by that which is called the Circumcision in the flesh made by hands;
And Catholics do beleive they are saved by good works and not just fatih alone and therefore they can not be saved if they trust themselves or Mary or the pope or whatsoever they believe. There is a lot of mysticism and fables and secret knowledge in their church and they worship Mary and the saints and angels, all condemned by God’s Word.
The truth will set you free.
Hang in there!
As usual, sometimes, there’s no accounting for taste.
Who said she was. Source? She indeed suffered with Christ beneath the cross.
And she is the Mother of God.
Lk 1: 43"And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? "
Lk 1: 43"And whence is this to me, that the mother of my Lord should come to me? "
This highlights another problem with Catholicism - it's sloppy approach to theology.
Saying that Mary is the "mother of God" confuses the Persons of the Trinity, and comes dangerously close to a Sabellian-like heresy with regards to the Trinity.
I was in a similar position to you. For me it was 20 years but I stay in the church going to Mass but still felt it was wrong and not going to confession telling myself I could confess myself (a priest actually said that!). I always remembered my confirmation when the Bishop slaps you on the face it is to keep you from turning away form the Church and I could not ever do a clean break. Then I had a revelation and started reading old Catholic books. I said ok the Catholic church is correct and I went to confession and it felt like the weight of the world lifted off me. Now I try to go at least once a month and when I can every 2 weeks and sometimes once a week. Every time I go I feel the sins taken from me. Go to confession remember what you can and what you can not do not worry about it all your sins will be forgiven
Now you can go to the parish priest to do this unless you did something very public in condemning the Church then you may then have to go to the Bishop. The priest will tell you
and the priest is not going to yell at you either!
How do you know that Sabellianism is heresy?
[’And she is the Mother of God.’]
God preexisted the earth, Mary was a daughter of the race of Adam and therefore did not pre exist the earth. Jesus the Christ did pre exist the heavens and the earth and created all of the heavens and the earth according to the Scriputes.
12Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
13Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
14In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
15Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
16For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
18And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
19For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
20And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
21And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled
22In the body of his flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:
23If ye continue in the faith grounded and settled, and be not moved away from the hope of the gospel, which ye have heard, and which was preached to every creature which is under heaven; whereof I Paul am made a minister;
Because it's version of the Trinity is not that which is revealed in the Bible.
In much the same way, the pope in 2008 taught a counterfeit false version of the Trinity, as well (Google video on right hand side).
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.