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Posted on 03/10/2004 9:37:27 PM PST by malakhi
| Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams |
Here's another one:
Romans 5:18-19
"Therefore as (so "in the same way") by the offence of one judgment came upon all men (surely you take that to mean ALL?) to condemnation; even so (!!) by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life."
Please don't tell me that you have a contextual way that "all men" here is not the "all men" from earlier in the same verse? Especially with the "as" and "even so"?
Moving on to 19:
"For as (again - "in the same way") by one man's disobedience many were made sinners, so by the obedience of one shall many (but not ALL?) be made righteous."
So "tickets purchased for ALL" but only "many" redeem them.
The "free gift" is there for ALL. Only some are "made righteous".
Maybe, could be, possibly. ;)
The bible . Who were the primary audience of Jesus ?
Mt.10:5-6 "These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel."
It was not until later in His ministry that Christ sent the apostles to all the lost .Mt.28:19 "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost."
They believed that has an exclusive relationship with God. I'd say, rather, that Jews, being under the covenant of Sinai, have a different relationship with God. Plenty of examples in the Hebrew scriptures of non-Jews having a relationship with God.
They would walk miles around the mountain rather than come in contact with the 1/2 Jews (Samaritians )
Who ? After the nation was formed , and the Law given who did God have a "special relationship" with ? If we read the OT we see that the Jewish nation came out of Egypt a "mixed multitude" There were non hebrew Jews , If we look in all but one occasion God dealt solely with and for the Nation of Israel
They hated the Samartians and the Gentiles. ALL Jews hated ALL Samaritans and ALL Gentiles? Sweeping generalization alert.
Nope Historic. That was why it was such a shock when Jesus went on the Mountain and spoke to the Samaritan woman , and why a Samaritan man was used in the teaching of who is your brother.
And, of course, "love your neighbor" comes from Leviticus. Its not original to Jesus.
For those of us that believe that Jesus IS God and that He is the word of God incarnate..that would be no surprise
The word Kosmos to the Jew listening to that phrase would hear that God loved those that were not Jews too. What makes you think that Jews thought/think that God doesn't love gentiles?
They were Idolators What did God say about Idolaters? What had God told them to do to the nations they conquered?
That was a thought that the Jews did not want to hear, they had lost their "special" stand with God.
Please don't pretend to speak for "the Jews". What you are saying is not what Jews think, but rather what your particular theological interpretation suggests that Jews must think.
The gentiles and the Samaritans were unclean . They ate forbidden meats and took part in Pagan idol worship.They did not have the God of Israel , So the thought that theses unclean people could be saved by the God of Israel was unthinkable. They had become a legalist nation. Read Naham
The Assyrians had destroyed the ten tribes of Israel in the north and had brought in foreign peoples to settle there and mingle with what Israelites were left .That co mingling made them semi-pagan (Samaritans )who came to be despised by faithful Jews.
Nahum prophecies of doom and the destruction of the chief enemy of Judah and Jerusalem.
This prophecy is secular and political. There are no threats against his own people and the name of Yahweh is mentioned twice (2:13; 3:5). The prophet sees that the fall of Nineveh proves the principle of Israelite belief that the Lord will eventually punish the wicked and those who oppress others.
When we read the epistles and acts we see the constant teaching that in Christ there is no jew or Gentile. This was not restated over and over for nothing. There was a strong spiritual, and political divide between the Jews and the rest of the world. It was a divide placed there by God in His laws and His miracles
No
John 14
13 And whatsoever ye shall ask in my name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
Isaiah 42
8 I am YHWH, that is My name; and My glory will I not give to another, neither My praise to graven images.
ROFLOL!!! :o)
Three Eastern European Jews named Berel, Cherel, and Shmerel were talking about moving to the US.Berel says "when I move to America, I'm going to have to change my name.
They won't call me Berel anymore; they'll call me Buck."
Cherel says "when I move to America, I'll also have to change my name.
They'll won't call me call me Cherel anymore; they'll call me Chuck."
Then Shmerel says..... "I'm not moving".
Is it? What makes you say this?
The bible . Who were the primary audience of Jesus ?
The discussion was concerning John 3:16. I thought it odd that you considered this "a message to the Jews" rather than universal.
If we look in all but one occasion God dealt solely with and for the Nation of Israel
Are you really trying to assert that, prior to Jesus, gentiles did not have a relationship with God?
Nope Historic.
Nope, Sweeping Generalization. You can no more make broad claims about "the Jews" than I can about "the Christians".
They were Idolators
You think that all gentiles were idolators?
The gentiles and the Samaritans were unclean . They ate forbidden meats and took part in Pagan idol worship.
Not all of the gentiles did. And the Samaritans certainly didn't.
That co mingling made them semi-pagan (Samaritans )who came to be despised by faithful Jews.
The Samaritans were monotheist. The enmity between Jews and Samaritans was because of Samaritan efforts to prevent the rebuilding of Jerusalem and the temple, not because the Samaritans were idolators. The "holy book" of Samaritans is the Torah, the five books of Moses.
When we read the epistles and acts we see the constant teaching that in Christ there is no jew or Gentile.
Neither man nor woman, either. Which might suggest that this was meant figuratively.
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