Emergency Preparedness….Top Post-Collapse Barter Items And Trade Skills

randysright.wordpress.com ^ | 6/11/11 | randyedye

[Kartographer]

In today’s “modern” globalist economy, we have relied upon centralized and highly manipulated trade, forced interdependency, senseless and undisciplined consumption, endless debt creation, welfare addiction, and the erosion of quality, as a means to sustain a system that ultimately is DESIGNED to erode our freedoms not to mention our ability to effectively take care of ourselves. We have been infantized by our financial environment. In the near future, those who wish to live beyond a meager staple of government handouts (if any are even given) will be required to make a 180 degree reversal from their current lifestyle of dependency and immediate gratification towards one of self sufficiency, personal entrepreneurship, quality trade, and a mindset of necessity, rather than unfounded excess.

This means that each and every one of us will not only be driven to form barter networks outside the designated confines of the mainstream, we will have to become active producers within those networks. Each and every one of us will need to discover practical goods and skills that will be in high demand regardless of economic conditions. Being that our society has all but forgotten how this kind of trade works, let’s examine a short list of items as well as proficiencies that are sure to be highly sought after as the collapse progresses…

[freedumb2003]

Because really mean doesn't win. Knowledge and logistics wins.

But look what happened. We are already in a war world where every day is a battle to hang on to what is in place. And you think I haven't studied up on those tactics? And won't use them with my overwhelming force of greedy and borderline insane soldiers, armed to the teeth with the provisions we took from the nearby military bases while you were hunkering down planting seeds? One Hellfire from my stolen drones and your compound is toast. You think I can't get geeks to join when I tell them they will rule the world and have all the chicks they want?

It is fun to imagine, but it just isn't a scenario that a rational person needs to plan for.

The world isn't going back to the medieval days -- Mad Max won't be the situation and if it is, the OP and follow up posts aren't going to be any help.

Self-reliance is a good supplemental idea and may be of help in some disasters. But as a plan for "after the collapse" it is pointless.

[freedumb2003]

What is the opposite of a survivalist?

A realist.

[JRandomFreeper]

Well, if living in the 18th Century works for you,

I would have done well in the 18th century, but I, like you, like electricity, so I can make it, from scratch, down to mining copper ores and smelting them. Refrigeration isn't that hard either. Real men today are responsible for creating stuff like that. And study to know how to do it.

Feeling so inadequate that you had to come on a 'survivalist' thread to belittle folks that have skills? And then threaten to over-run them with mutant-biker-zombies?

Give me a break and sniff the manure you are shovelling.

/johnny

[freedumb2003]

Give me a break and sniff the manure you are shovelling (sic)

Like I said, FR has become an angry place.

Neither the OP nor the follow-up posts are useful for a collapse that has an almost zero % chance of happening.

That doesn't mean I don't respect your skills. All my posts have been both respectful and admiring of gardening, hunting and what have you.

My only issue has been they will be of limited value in a "post collapse" world that just ain't gonna happen. Think about it. It wouldn't just be the USA -- it would be the WHOLE WORLD (else the Chicoms would just walk in and take over, like Red Dawn) to be thrown back 3+ centuries.

And, as I indicated my latter posts, the ability to feed oneself will be the least of your worries in such a world.

[reformedliberal]

For most garden produce, the prevalent disease where I live is usually fungal. It may be different in an arid climate.

Last week, I had a few tomato plants that hadn’t been planted. They had been through a week of rainy weather, crowded into a small area. They developed leaf spot. I went here: http://www.ghorganics.com/page15.html and tried the vinegar/water spray they suggested. It worked.

If we get a week of rain at the wrong time, blossom end rot will attack the tomatoes. So, I keep a large spray bottle of Rot Stop around. I don’t always have time to run into town to get what I might need.

I think most gardeners are not planting row crops. Likely everyone has a roto-tiller or a cultivator. I have a antique cultivator that is good for going between sweet corn rows, but most gardens are weeded by hand, especially if they are mulched. And of course our gardens are harvested by hand. Even the commercial medium-sized($1.5M) organic vegetable operations hand harvest. I am pretty certain the really large vegetable farms do, as well. We have migrant labor around here and the fields are contracted to Libby or Green Giant, et al. Corn and beans are mechanically harvested, of course.

As for mites and other insects, I haven’t tried these, but I will if I have to: http://www.ghorganics.com/page9.html
I do keep pyrethrins (sp?) around, though. I have taken out aphids on indoor plants with soapy water and a forceful spray, but the little buggers can fly, so insecticide is useful if you don’t have Chinese Lady Beetles, which we do, at least outside.

We have the Foxfire books. They are interesting and helpful.
Thomas Sherry, a disaster emergency specialist, has written a couple of fascinating books positing an earthquake in the Spokane area. He covers a lot of organizing and improvising in the context of the novel that is very educational.

I think preppers should be encouraged. It takes years of trial and error and study to become even minimally self-sufficient, so the sooner people begin, the better. In my area, people are beginning to collate lists of people with skills. It helps everyone and the local economy. It also makes everyone become aware that they will need _something_ with which to trade. If some folks have money or precious metals, that’s great for the skilled people who will need that for taxes and medicine and energy.

People are frightened. I am hearing this fear from wealthy professionals who are beginning to doubt if money will help them survive. I know successful business people who are learning how to can. Every anecdotal tale of hardship and collapse I have read included someone saying they should have stored twice the amount of food that they did, as well as diversify into other currencies or precious metals. An extra pair of good boots or a warm coat or some propane stashed away against the time when every penny is needed to keep warm or buy gas to get to work is simply prudent in a collapsing economy. No one is confident in anything and none of us can control anything except ourselves.

[combat_boots]

“And, as I indicated my latter posts, the ability to feed oneself will be the least of your worries in such a world.”

People are looking to problem solve, ask for expertise, chat and vent here. Threads like this are of interest to those who want information they can use to DO something and to prepare. Naysaying does not help. At all.

Everyone knows that there may be a whole world of hurt before this situation is over. Doing what they can do now doesn’t hurt anyone.

If you see something positive to put in, do it. What would YOU do now? What helpful advice can you give to people who want some? You know....people in apartments, grandparents with cancer-ridden children who are caring for their own grandchildren, people out of work or close to it, and so forth?

In 2008, a woman posted on here for help with recipes. She was having to feed a family of 4 on tortillas and beans every day, and she was struggling with how to keep her young children eating. She wanted help. And do you know what? People gave her some ideas. But, I haven’t seen her here for a long time.

Then there was a young doc who was beside himself with worry. He was just establishing himself and was upset with what his prospects were in the US. He notified people that he was packing up and going to Panama to be part of a boutique medical vacation practice for whoever could afford it, so that he could practice medicine and make money/pay for the student loans. You know what? We haven’t heard from him for a long time, either.

There are relatives and posters who have died, yes. Some of them in combat from the wars going on right now. Some post from Iraq and Afghanistan.

And there are those who played a crucial part in exposing the treason and murders that are the Clinton cimes and body count, the real number of which we may never know. And a some of those folks are gone or have left FR, at least a couple because their families were afraid for them.

It’s more than politics, now. It’s personal. Threads like this give people a chance to think about what they can really do in this environment, and how they can defend and protect what they have. What is your advice to help such people?

I am serious.

[freedumb2003]

>>What is your advice to help such people?<<

Don’t waste your efforts on scenarios that won’t happen. Concentrate on the sets of probable scenarios.

Mad Max ain’t gonna happen. You are much better advised in getting technological skills and/or keeping your skill set sharp to stay employed than planting carrots in your back yard. The latter isn’t a bad idea, it just isn’t a strategy nor a tactic under any reasonable scenario.

>>I am serious.<<

As am I. And suggesting what to do in a “post collapse” scenario (which, as I have said, would have to be worldwide) just looks a bit silly and is something our enemies can and will use against us.

[Borax Queen]

I would like to be on your ping list too, please.
Thanks very much!

[goodwithagun]

Well said. There is nothing keeping freedumb, appropriate handle by the way, on this thread if he thinks we are cooks. If we are, there is nothing he can write that will change our minds. In the mean time, I sleep a little easier at night knowing that I will be able to feed my family if something happens. If it doesn't I'm out maybe a couple of hundred bucks. It does not cost a lot to prep. I want my son to know that food does not come from a window or a grocery store isle. It comes from the ground and from the animals that roam. Freedumbass insists that if something bad happens that feeding ourselves will not be the first priority. I suggest freedumbass wake up tomorrow and try to get through his day successfully with no food. Without food we will not be able to do anything. I've seen pics of starving children and mine will not go hungry.

[goodwithagun]

I’ve read through the thread and the only person who has suggested a “Mad Max scenario” is you. Kart and those of us who agree with him are simply trying to protect ourselves. If you don’t like what we are conversing about or planning for, please leave the thread. You won’t be missed. I’m serious also.

[JRandomFreeper]

We are already in a war world

No, we aren't. A world war is millions of people dying of disease or internal goverment action, and then the battlefield casualties, (see 1910s, 1940s) We're in limited actions.

Yes, I think you haven't studied tactics, or even strategy, or more importantly, logistics.

You don't have the technical skill-sets to steal a drone or fire a hell-fire missile.

And if you do, you get no food, or people to grow it for you.

And geeks today get plenty of wimmen, if they want them.

Just how long do you think it takes to plant a few acres? Months? NOT.

There is no hunkering with planting. It's just one more chore, like killing wild dogs in the forest.

/johnny

[freedumb2003]

>>If you don’t like what we are conversing about or planning for, please leave the thread. You won’t be missed. I’m serious also.<<

Well, there you go. Lockstep or leave.

[freedumb2003]

You speak of many things of which you have no knowledge.

But if it pleases you to do so, I won’t disabuse your notions.

[freedumb2003]

>>No, we aren’t. A world war is millions of people dying of disease or internal goverment action,<<

I didn’t say a world war. I said a war world. Think it through and arrive at whatever conclusions you wish.

[goodwithagun]

You obviously don't like what we're doing, something that we have every right to do by the way, so just leave the thread if it aggravates you that much. If we are the cooks you think we are, do you really think you will change our minds? Again, just like you are the only one mentioning mad max, you are also the only one mentioning lockstep. Quit putting words in my mouth and go back to DU.

[DuncanWaring]

But with 85% employment, modern USA society will continue to plow ahead.

We don't have 85% employment.

The actual EMployment rate is currently slightly under 60%.

[jy8z]

Can you say where you live (in general if you prefer to avoid specifics) and what you plant for each seasonal crop?

Thanks for asking. I live south of San Antonio. Spring time is for potatoes, peppers, tomatoes, zucchini, corn, green beans, cucumbers(salad & pickling), cantaloupe and watermelons. I plant carrots, onions, garlic, tomatoes, peppers and lettuce in the fall. Spinach, cauliflower, broccoli, cabbage and assorted greens are grown through winter as needed. I grow enough for several families(relatives) and have no problem peddling any excess to co-workers and friends.

[driftdiver]

A few months is a long time without anything to eat.

[freedumb2003]

As I have said in many of these posts I have no idea where the anger is coming from.

Some people just don’t like having their assumptions challenged, I guess. I didn’t call any one names, nor did I mock anyone’s FR name (old BTW and also bad form not to ping the person being discussed). Nor did I mock any one’s position on the matter. I seriously pointed out that it is probably not the optimum way to deal with the OP’s thesis of a post-collapse society.

My attempting to bring some reality to the discussions seems to engender great anger and angst.

[gitmo]

We don't have 85% employment.

Can you explain what a 10% unemployment rate means? I had always assumed it meant 90% of healthy adults are employed. But the numbers being thrown around latelty have made it obvious that is NOT what the rate means.

I deal with statistics all the time. Whatever they are doing with these numbers is obfuscation.