MUST-READ CW2 THREAD FROM ARFCOM

This is my first post. I have been lurking, reading and learning for about 2 years. I hope there are many others like me. Thank you all for the wit and wisdom you have imparted. You are a great asset to this Nation. Now onto my post...

So here's what got me thinking. I'm in State law enforcement in Ohio. I was at one of our annual 2 day training events. We were in a classroom session on Domestic terrorism. The speaker was our agencies liaison with the FBI on the Joint Terrorism Task Force that was set up after 9/11. They broke it into two categories; home grown terrorists influenced by Al Qaeda and the like; and everybody else. So in the first category was some of the post 9/11 arrestees from Ohio like Christopher Paul and Imam Fawaz Damra, and then the second group included all white supremest groups, militia groups, people with anti-government sentiment, and anyone else who was overly religious. This part was nothing new to me, they have gone over this a few years prior. Then came the trouble...The instructor started talking about indicators which could be used to warn us of these peoples presence. Most made sense, like if the guy has a swastika on his forehead. Some others covered more discreet body markings. I didn't have any problem with this, but then he shows us a slide of some bumper stickers. One says, "The UN is not our friend!" and the second says, "Exercise your rights, or you'll lose them." He goes on to say that these are good indicators that the person in this car is anti-government and probably violent.

Now, I'm not one to let this slip by unchallenged. So I raise my hand and say, " Are you saying that these are possible indicators or probable indicators. He says, "probable." I take issue with this, "I say." "First, if you know anything about the UN, they aren't our friend. They also aren't our government, so I hardly see how that would make this person anti-government. And the second statement seems fairly innocuous. I would think that both the extreme left and the extreme right would say that a right not exercised is easily lost. So I would agree with both of those statements and I hardly think that makes me a threat." He looks right at me and says half jokingly, "maybe we should add you to our list." There was a bit of an awkward silence as we stared at each other. Then he just moved on. Later he showed more stickers that said things like, "I believe in the Bible", and abortion is wrong" At one point he showed a picture of some sort of Aryan Nation marking and said to me, "do you have one of these?" I was fuming.

At a later break I consulted some of the other guys, of which there were about 50. Some said they thought the guy was way out of line and some others said they thought I should have just let it go. Everyone seemed to agree he was serious. I later made the point to him that by his measure our forefathers would be suspect. I guess at that point it struck me. This guy draws no distinction between the person who blows himself up for Allah, and the guy who doesn't like big government. Since he was trained by the Feds, I must assume they feel the same.

It seems like most of the discussion and preparation here revolves around some degree or another of SHTF. I feel like that is well covered and thought out. I don't want to debate about the likeliness of one scenario or another, instead I would relish your thoughts on the scenario that concerns me the most, and which I think is the more difficult one to prepare for. You are suddenly that domestic terrorist, not because you have committed terrorist acts, but because of what you believe. They are coming for you. Now survive.

You can imagine what's stacked against you. You have to survive long enough to turn public sentiment in your favor. Not unlike our forefathers and ultimately you must save your country.

Here is what I think you have going for you. The Feds simply don't have enough resources, but could remedy that with foreign help. They rely heavily on local law enforcement which at least in my area will give them little support. State law enforcement is about half and half IMO.

Bearing in mind that the information is unsubstantiated... it still falls in line with what I hear from the peripheral at my day job.

This is an indicator, and one of many. These indicators are rather like a pressure gauge. So long as pressure is acceptable, then the pot won't boil over, or EXPLODE. But there's a fairly long list of indicators at this point, and as time goes on the list gets longer, and the pressure increases. It's NOT a good thing.

One thing that's definitely going to over pressurize the pot is for Federal authorities to augment U.S. law enforcement with foreigners in response to the domestic terrorism problem....especially if they show up in their uniforms. It won't matter what sort of agreement was signed by the nations involved. The fact is that foreign military, or law enforcement here in the U.S. simply isn't safe. Oh sure... we've had limited instances of it in the past (such as with 9-11 and Katrina), but if it's generally perceived that they're here against the citizenry at large, this will be a most definite catalyst.

I'm not unique in my associations, and as with most of us here, I know people I stay away from because they're unstable, and I consider them DANGEROUS....to themselves, to me, and to others! But I also know people who won't lift a finger no matter WHAT. These two types are on opposite ends of the spectrium. But most of the people I know are somewhere in the middle. Most of our personal associations are like this.... in the middle.

It's this middle that will suddenly catalyze and then gladly do things such as punch a hole from a distance into a blue helmet with a scoped hunting rifle, or shoot a law enforcement officer with an eastern European accent during a routine traffic stop (more likely if he's wearing a funny uniform)....and these are only a few of many things they'll be willing to do when that pot I was talking about explodes.

IMHO, the Feds are straining to create a domestic terrorism problem. Oh yes...there are indeed white supremacists, Jihadis, and crazy people who simply resort to violence FIRST, and generally we AVOID these people like plague! These people ARE dangerous to EVERYBODY and federal law enforcement agencies are right in dealing with them!

But the feds are failing to notice something, and this will certainly cause them severe problems IF they over pressurize that pot I was talking about. This something are those plain middle of the road people who are now organizing for the purpose of a common defense. They could care less about Jihad, or white supremacists, or the other crazies, or even federal and local law enforcement for that matter. But they are nurturing and developing a very pronounced sense of accountability over each other, with respect to physical security, and it's akin to a large field being taken over by hundreds (perhaps thousands) of smallish yellow jacket nests. Woe be to the one who steps in the first nest! These people are difficult to pick out of a crowd as well. They don't put bumper stickers on vehicles, and (generally) won't talk politics or religion with you. They don't hang out here, or at AR-15.com, and they don't discuss strength numbers, or even that they might shoot recreationally on a weekend. They're nice, but they're developing systems of trust and putting OPSEC into play even though some of them don't know the definition of the acronym.

I've said this before about these middle of the road people. They're good, solid people...patient, and slow to anger... Judeo/Christian based, and (IMHO) overly willing to use our representative legislative processes, even when it's so obviously corrupt and in such a dismal state of failure. But WHEN these people consciously decide to act, there will be no turning back as a nation. I say WHEN because there is an observable and measurable increase of hostility and distrust between them and their government. It's not on the decrease. It's on the increase. At some point, something must give. At some point, these middle of the road people will be faced with a line in the sand and, historically here in America, this sort of thing usually pans out quite different than Europe or any other nation.

If there's any truth to the source of this thread, the feds should be very, very careful.

Gonna cut and paste my reply from another thread here...

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Sorry.

I just don’t see it happening.

It’s not like you’re talkin a couple guys in camo will be driving around in a beat up Volvo pretending their going to play paint ball somewhere.

We’re talking troop carriers. Lots of them. Maybe more than has been in any single place at one time since WWII.

And what’s Katie Couric gonna say about it at 6PM?

Nothin. Cause it won’t even be on the air anymore. Government would have to, out of total necessity, shut down all major forms of communication. People might notice that. Even those who don’t watch CBS.

And where are all the buses used for transport? You start pickin folks up, and we’re not talking kindergarten buses. We’re talking buses with chains attached to the seats...

Even IF they were smart enough to get all these things planned out, it would take like what, about 15 minutes before anybody with half a brain in this country would realize things were way, way wrong and they were rounding folks up.

Then, it’s party time!

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The logistics behind it would render it impossible... but!!!!

That does not mean that they could not take over SOME (not all) urban districts and transportation corridors.

RE: "My sister is a LEO in Texas for 20 years now. While a usually level headed person, she, too, feels that anyone not fully supporting the government in every way is someone to watch for trouble."

I wonder what LEO personnel think about government when some with influence in today's government were in the streets murdering cops a generation ago. To wit, Mr. and Mrs. Ayers are "guilty as hell" and arguably now represent "the Establishment." IMO.

I hope you don't mind this second reply to you, it's just that I really want the murderers of Sgt. McDonnell convicted and IMO there is absolutely no doubt who's responsible for his murder. Problem is, the Ayers have admirers and friends in high government, media, and academic places -- i.e., the Establishment.

Officer Down Memorial Page

Justice Department: 'Zip it' on Ayers probe