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Live Replay of SCOTUS Oral Arguments in DC v. Heller (2A case)
C-SPAN ^ | March 18, 2007 | C-SPAN

Posted on 03/18/2008 9:25:56 AM PDT by NinoFan

http://www.cspan.org/watch/cs_cspan_wm.asp?Cat=TV&Code=CS


TOPICS: Breaking News; News/Current Events; US: District of Columbia
KEYWORDS: 2a; banglist; dc; guns; heller; parker; scotus
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Comment #341 Removed by Moderator

To: ExSoldier
FWIW (since it's my 10th anniversary at FR today)...
Here's what I believe (in a nutshell):

o The right to K&B arms is personal
o It is for the purpose of protecting my self and my family from any threat
o The right can not be infringed in any way - and that right is guaranteed by the Constitution and natural law
o I may K&B any weapon that would normally be issued individually to a contemporary soldier
o I will exercise my right - dispite what the current law might say, because my right is not granted by law, it is unalienable - indeed, it is God-given.

342 posted on 03/18/2008 12:37:44 PM PDT by kinsman redeemer (The real enemy seeks to devour what is good.)
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To: BCR #226
2nd will be incorporated.

If the 2nd is incorporated into this decision, what will be the instant effect on cities like Morton Grove, IL? That was the first city that got national attention, to ban guns.

343 posted on 03/18/2008 12:39:56 PM PDT by ExSoldier (Democracy is 2 wolves and a lamb voting on dinner. Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote.)
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To: kinsman redeemer

Happy 10th, may you post in interesting times. ;)


344 posted on 03/18/2008 12:41:26 PM PDT by Tijeras_Slim
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To: DaveLoneRanger
I return to comparing this to driving. No one seems to have a problem with having to train for a driver’s license, and having to take a test, and renew the license every so often...

Well, in the state of California, at least, the law is very explicit that driving is a privilege, not a right. So, that explains the driver's license, the test, the renewal fees, etc.
345 posted on 03/18/2008 12:42:51 PM PDT by Mariebl
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To: DaveLoneRanger

And just WHAT is wrong with goat sacrifices?


346 posted on 03/18/2008 12:50:04 PM PDT by WayneS (Respect the 2nd Amendment; Repeal the 16th)
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To: BCR #226

the supremes sound like they wanna wide open interpretation or none at all... or just playin devils advocate to see how ‘insane’ he really is and what hes willing to push today ???


347 posted on 03/18/2008 12:50:05 PM PDT by Gilbo_3 (Choose Liberty over slavery... the gulag awaits ANY compromise with evil...LiveFReeOr Die...)
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To: P8riot

Anybody paying attention to what President Bush actually SAID knew he would sign the CFR bill. Paraphrasing his position, that dated back to at least three months prior to his 2000 election: “I prefer that there be no limits on contributions, but that it be demanded that all contributions be displayed on public web site within 48 hours, as I have done. However, I’ll sign any bill about CFR that comes out of the Congress.”

This is a very different situation. Generally, Pres.Bush has done what he said he would do before he was elected - including nominees to the Federal bench, and including, alas, illegal immigration.


348 posted on 03/18/2008 12:50:34 PM PDT by AFPhys ((.Praying for President Bush, our troops, their families, and all my American neighbors..))
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To: DaveLoneRanger
I’m not sure I agree that the license is strictly revenue-based. (Would you support free permits that still required a certain level of training?)

Would you support literacy tests for voting?

349 posted on 03/18/2008 12:51:53 PM PDT by mvpel (Michael Pelletier)
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Comment #350 Removed by Moderator

To: WayneS

Depends on who owns the goat.


351 posted on 03/18/2008 12:54:04 PM PDT by ASA Vet (Do we really want Huma answering the phone at 3AM?)
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To: Political Junkie Too
The reason for the fear of a "standing army" was that such an armed group would be a means by which a tyrannical federal government would enforce its dictates upon the people of the states. The founders would view the various armed "federal law enforcement" groups as being elements of the "standing army" that they feared

The absence of a standing army was intended to be a check on the power of the federal government, which would have no power to use armed force against the residents of a state, unless it had the agreement and cooperation of the state's executive

352 posted on 03/18/2008 12:57:17 PM PDT by PapaBear3625
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To: Pistolshot
In Parker, Ginsburg concurred that the 2A was an individual right. This evil troll of a woman might surprise us, and actually end up doing one right thing in her shameful career....
353 posted on 03/18/2008 1:01:25 PM PDT by NewJerseyJoe (Rat mantra: "Facts are meaningless! You can use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true!")
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To: DaveLoneRanger

You do NOT have a right to fly a plane.
You do have a right to keep and bear arms.

See the difference? Permits don’t express rights; they demonstrate a privledge. “Nut jobs,” and I presume you mean those already identified as such, would already be banned from even possessing arms.


354 posted on 03/18/2008 1:02:34 PM PDT by Lord_Calvinus
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To: Mariebl; All

The state of Illinois makes that clear as well - that driving is a privilege and not a right... (Well at least back in 1990 it was that way — I had a friend who got busted at 17 when she used a DL to try to get into a bar when she was visiting a college, and she had her license suspended immediately for a year before she ever even went to court - no proof she had really done the crime she was charged with and she lost her license for a year anyway... It was her own fault for using a fraudulent ID, but it astounded me that they could suspend her license before she was even “convicted” of any wrongdoing...)
************************************************************

The thing about rights and freedom — in order to have them, and protect them for EVERYONE we must be willing to live with some risk...

As for gun laws — the only ones who follow those laws are the law-abiding citizens who are the responsible ones. Criminals will always have guns or other weapons if they really desire them... No law will prevent that.

You can’t make things “perfect” in human society. That is the delusion the gun grabbers/socialists/communists live under...


355 posted on 03/18/2008 1:05:07 PM PDT by LibertyRocks (The Liberty Rocks Blog - http://libertyrocks.wordpress.com ~ also see; http://www.libertyrocks.us)
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To: semantic

I just can’t see that happening.

Further, I don’t see Justice Thomas merely affirming someone else’s opinion on this issue. RKBA is a hot-button issue with Justice Thomas. I would predict that Justice Thomas writes an opinion that strongly affirms the individual right, strikes down the DC gun ban and gives the most expansive and historically instructive opinion on RKBA.

So even if everyone agrees with the individual rights position, you’d see a 8-1-0.

As it is, I simply cannot foresee any way that Ginsberg and Souter see an individual right. I predict something like 5-1-3 or 4-2-3, if someone else (eg, Alito or Scalia) signs on with Thomas on a more constructionist opinion.


356 posted on 03/18/2008 1:05:46 PM PDT by NVDave
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To: DaveLoneRanger

I understand and respect what your trying too say. Yet as in a Drivers license......not all states require a test every few years ......TX does not. I took a test to get my license at age 16 . I am now 54. Haven’t had a test since for driving. All I am required to do is get a new card issued at cost every 4 to 5 years (I forget time line).....that is pure revenue vs safety.

As well (trying to not be a smart ass or insulting ) my right to drive is not in the bill of rights......:o)

I would suggest that the firearms “dealer” be required to train / familiarize the shooter if it is their first firearm AND they have neither military or other civilian equivalent use of force and firearms training. A lack of a numbered certificate or other proof of basic firearms “training” would open the individual owner, not the manufacturer or retailer , to litigation of a civil vs legal sort if an accident would occur. Of course such would not preclude criminal negligence by the owner / shooter if such a skill was abused.

Just my opinion of course......

Stay safe !


357 posted on 03/18/2008 1:05:53 PM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.©)
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To: DaveLoneRanger

>I think the permit system is a reasonable way to make sure the nut jobs don’t end up with guns.the nut jobs

Do you object to car or pilot licenses?<

Dave, How many illegal aliens are stopped everyday driving without a license? The need to acquire a permit is only relevant to someone wishing to remain legal. Criminals and the nut jobs do not care about legalities.

The permit system is a publically acceptable way of maintaining control power over the citizen/subjects!


358 posted on 03/18/2008 1:07:07 PM PDT by B4Ranch ("In politics, nothing happens by accident. If it happens, you can bet it was planned that way." FDR)
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To: GnL
I should clarify my statement: SCOTUS will agree 9-0 that the 2A is an individual right. However, Breyer/Stevens may take the position that certain restrictions are available, as in crime statistics. Therefore, the final ruling may be 7-2.

That in itself would be killer to the Brady bunch, because the court would be stating the central point that the 2A pertains to an individual right not limited to soldiering.

As an aside, has anyone noted that all comments made by Breyer/Stevens were in context of original intent/contemporaneous construction? Do people realize just how huge this is?

That's like agreeing to play a football game entirely on one side of the field.

359 posted on 03/18/2008 1:08:13 PM PDT by semantic
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To: PISANO
If true and it turns out to be a 5-4 ruling in favor of the 2nd Amendment as written, then to all on FR with BDS, remember to BLAME BUSH!!

Without conservative "input" Bush would have Harriet Miers on the bench, not Samuel Alito.

With no experience as a judge, I think it's anyone's guess how Miers would rule on this case. Bush's choice could have easily turned a possible 5-4 victory into a 4-5 loss.

360 posted on 03/18/2008 1:15:47 PM PDT by RJL
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