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BBC Report: Noah's Ark "...more credible version based on Babylonian sources."
BBC On Line ^ | Friday, 19 March, 2004 | Jeremy Bowen

Posted on 03/19/2004 10:44:41 AM PST by yankeedame

Last Updated: Friday, 19 March, 2004, 11:06 GMT

Did Noah really build an ark?

By Jeremy Bowen
Presenter, Noah's Ark

In the Bible, God tells Noah he has to build an ark and load a pair of every kind of animal before a great flood engulfs the world. It is widely regarded as a myth, but could it actually be true?

The story of Noah and his ark is one which sticks in the minds of children and never gets forgotten.

God warned Noah - the only good man left in a world full of corruption and violence - to prepare for a great flood. With his sons he built a great ark and the animals marched in two by two. By the time the rain started to fall, Noah was ready. The ark was a refuge until the waters went down, leaving Noah and his menagerie high and dry on Mount Ararat.

There are many problems with the story. If the story is taken literally, it would have taken 35 years for Noah and his family to load two of every animal on earth. And a flood that engulfed the Earth would have left a signature for geologists - yet none has been found.

But it is possible to build a much more credible version of the story based on a different reading of the Bible, on ancient Babylonian sources that predate the Book of Genesis, and on archaeology and science.

Broken apart

The traditional shape of Noah's Ark comes from the imaginations of 19th Century artists. It would have been about 450ft long, and experts say it would have broken apart.

Even if such a feat of marine engineering had been possible, there are about 30 million species of animals in the world. For so many creatures, a fleet of enormous arks would have been needed.

Geologists have also proved that there is not enough water in the world to cover all the continents, then or now.

Loading 30 million species of animal would have taken 35 years But just because the details of this familiar story do not add up, should we turn our backs on Noah and the ark?

We have to forget the idea that such a huge boat carrying all known animals existed, that it came to rest on Mount Ararat in modern-day Turkey, and that a flood covered the entire Earth.

In 1851, British archaeologists discovered hundreds of clay tablets while digging in ancient Babylon.

It was 20 years later that British Museum assistant George Smith became the first person to read them. He found the story of Gilgamesh, which bore strong similarities to that of Noah. He was visited by the great gods, who decided there would be a great deluge, told him to make a boat and carry in it the seed of all living things.

Further Iraqi texts were discovered, showing the story emerged in Mesopotamia. And in the 1930s conclusive evidence of a huge flood in the area about 5,000 years ago - the time of the story of Noah - was found.

Trading centres

What we know of the culture of what is now Iraq gives the first glimpse of the real-life historical figure behind the myth.

Noah might have been king of a city called Shuruppak. He would have had a kilt, a shaven head and eye make-up, like the figures portrayed in artworks created in what was then known as Sumeria.

The epic of Gilgamesh says Noah had silver and gold, then the currency of wealthy merchants, suggesting he was a businessman.

Could this story have provided the inspiration for the Book of Genesis 2,000 years later?

Instead of building an ark to survive a great flood, he is more likely to have built boats to trade goods like beer, grain and animals.

All the big trading centres of the era were on the River Euphrates and it was cheaper to move goods by water than land. Sumerians were able to build barges about 20ft in length, and marine archaeologists have not found remains or inscriptions of larger vessels.

But they believe they would have had the technology to have built a series of barges and used them like pontoons on which a much larger boat, or ark, could have been constructed.

Tropical storm

Parts of the Euphrates were only navigable at certain times of the year, when the waters were deep enough for large boats.

Noah was likely to have waited for the melt waters to arrive in June and July and, if these had combined with a tropical storm, the river could have flooded the Mesopotamian plain.

The currents in the area would not have taken him towards Mount Ararat, but out into the Persian Gulf. Life would have been difficult, but they could have survived on the animals and beer on board.

One Babylonian text suggests the ark came to rest on what is now the island of Bahrain, providing a very different yet plausible end to the adventure.

Could this story have provided the inspiration for the holy men who wrote the Book of Genesis 2,000 years later? When they first heard the story, how could they fail to recognise its moral power, that if humankind falls short of God's laws, there's a dreadful price to pay. Behind that moral message lies one of the world's greatest stories.

And behind that story we can just glimpse a real man, a real boat and a real adventure.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; Philosophy; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS: 300manyearsoflabor; archaeology; blacksea; blackseaflood; coracle; cuneiform; ggg; godsgravesglyphs; grandcanyon; greatflood; history; irvingfinkel; noah; noahsarc; noahsark; noahsflood; speculation
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To: Gippers Brigade
Good point ... perhaps he should not have said "infants" ... but rather "not adults."
81 posted on 03/19/2004 2:46:37 PM PST by dartuser
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To: dartuser
No, but I think Christians who are not open to the suggestion that Noah's Flood is an allegory have a challenge in defending it as a literal account. Christians believe in many other things in the bible as being symbolic or allegorical, but quite a few insist that the story of Noah must be entirely fact.

I try never to attack anyone for their personal religious beliefs, unless you happen to be a moslem who thinks Allah wants you to kill me. And to the extent I've done that on this thread, I apologize. I should have restricted my comments more to the fact that I used to believe the literal account of Noah's Flood, but no longer do. Nor do I think which side you come down on the issue is particularly important to God. It's an irrelevant side issue to the important things.

82 posted on 03/19/2004 2:46:43 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: dartuser
..."your son would tell you he doesn't think the Bible discusses how animals got to Australia."....

Probably not, but I'll betcha that he'll say, "because God wanted them there."
83 posted on 03/19/2004 2:48:30 PM PST by aShepard
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To: Old Professer
There's the rub huh? Everyone know there's always been a Julian calendar. Even before there was a "Julian"./so
84 posted on 03/19/2004 2:50:29 PM PST by Jaded (My sheeple, my sheeple, what have you done to Me?)
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To: Dog Gone
"No, but I think Christians who are not open to the suggestion that Noah's Flood is an allegory have a challenge in defending it as a literal account."

The creation science movement has been quite successful defending this since the time of Darwin.

"Christians believe in many other things in the bible as being symbolic or allegorical, but quite a few insist that the story of Noah must be entirely fact."

Very true, but only where the text is obviously meant to be taken symbolically ... we can read parts of Revelation and we see the imagery, language, and genre as one that obviously requires applying a different eye. But the account in Genesis uses plain language that doesn't require allegorical interpretation. It describes simple events that are understood plainly. If it reads plainly, why try to make it say something that is not plain.

Im curious, what evidence did you come across to make you give up your literal interpretation of the flood?
85 posted on 03/19/2004 2:57:04 PM PST by dartuser
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To: aShepard
lol ... OK, then I would disagree with him ...
86 posted on 03/19/2004 2:58:07 PM PST by dartuser
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To: dartuser
"there are about 30 million species of animals in the world. For so many creatures, a fleet of enormous arks would have been needed."

How many species were there at the time of Noah? THAT is the question ... not how many there are today. And how many species can be generated from an example of each animal? We would need some kind of canine to make wolves, cocker spaniels, german shepards ...

Bad move. You don't argue FOR the bible by arguing FOR evolution. Well you could, but many here will not appreciate it =)

87 posted on 03/19/2004 3:09:43 PM PST by SengirV
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To: dartuser
The creation science movement has been quite successful defending this since the time of Darwin.

You tell funny joke!

Creation science continues to twist and turn in order to avoid the data outside the bible.

88 posted on 03/19/2004 3:27:51 PM PST by Dinsdale
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To: dartuser
Geology, with emphasis on depositional environments. The fossil record just doesn't support a mass burial of all land animals outside of the ark in a single event. If we had a fossil bed containing dinosaurs, dogs, monkeys, and humans all mixed together, then we'd know they all died in one event. But we don't.

Then there are the common sense problems with letting out all the animals at Ararat I mentioned earlier. Or the water volume problem. Or the what the heck would people and animals eat except each other when they disembarked problem.

Rather than straining to come up with bizarre explanations for all these problems, I came to the conclusion that it was an allegory.

89 posted on 03/19/2004 3:27:56 PM PST by Dog Gone
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To: SengirV
"Reproducing according to its kind" IS Bible ...

There is no problem with a Christian differentiating between micro (vertical) and macro (horizontal) evolution ... I see no problem with species adapting, growing thicker hair over time to better combat harsh climate ... but I aint never seen a horse evolve from a whale.
90 posted on 03/19/2004 3:28:04 PM PST by dartuser
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To: Dinsdale
You should read a little more. Actually, it's Darwinism that continues to perpetrate disproven theories to the masses and slap the quaint "science" label on it. Evolution is mathematically impossible ... it takes much more faith to believe the astronomical numerics of random chance ... than it does to believe in an intelligence creator.

Perhaphs "Darwins Black Box" by Behe will assist you.
91 posted on 03/19/2004 3:36:04 PM PST by dartuser
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To: dartuser
How many different KINDS of living things are there then?
92 posted on 03/19/2004 5:27:44 PM PST by SengirV
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To: wildwood

Greek Flood Myth

Then comes the Greek story of the flood. Bereft of Prometheus' guidance, men and women grew so wicked that Jupiter sent a great flood which destroyed them all, except one good man, Deucalion, a son of Prometheus, and one good woman, Pyrrha, a daughter of Epimetheus. These two were preserved as being fit to live. The flood submerged all earth except Mount Olympus, where the gods lived, and Mount Parnassus, where Deucalion and Pyrrha found shelter. Then the waters withdrew, and from the oracle of Apollo on Parnassus came a voice commanding the two survivors to people the world anew with more worthy inhabitants. They were told to begin by casting behind them "the bones of their mother." Deucalion shrewdly interpreted this strange oracle as referring to the stones, the bones of Mother Earth. So as he and Pyrrha left the oracle, they tossed stones over their shoulders. All that Deucalion threw took form as men, those of Pyrrha became women. She was slighter than Deucalion, and threw smaller stones, so women have ever since been less of stature than men. 

The son of Deucalion was that Hellen from whom all the later Greeks claimed descent. Yet it is notable that even in their legends they retain the traces of their divided race. On Hellen's family tree there is a distinct place assigned for each Achaean hero. But the heroes of the older Aegean people are never traced from Hellen. Each one is given independent origin as the child or grandchild of some god. Thus we have a fairly positive way for deciding of each hero in the stories that follow whether he was in truth Achaean or whether the memory of him had been preserved from older non-Achaean days.

Now, what part of this flood myth matches the story in the Bible?

93 posted on 03/19/2004 5:54:38 PM PST by Junior (No animals were harmed in the making of this post)
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To: Chewbacca
No, but what he did take on the ark were infant animals, which included dinosaurs.

I've often wondered if many of the great extinctions occurred when certain species either didn't board the ark or were not invited to do so.

94 posted on 03/19/2004 6:14:07 PM PST by night reader
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To: Jaded
You're missing the point; it is a matter of definition as to what a species is, the broader the definition the more there are to account for.
95 posted on 03/19/2004 6:21:45 PM PST by Old Professer
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To: Old Professer
No not at all. People look at dating of archeology finds as a way to disprove the Bible. The point was that people want to stuff an infinite God and His creation in to the finite world in which we live and our measures of time.
96 posted on 03/19/2004 7:12:37 PM PST by Jaded (My sheeple, my sheeple, what have you done to Me?)
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To: Junior
IYHO, of course.
97 posted on 03/20/2004 8:38:33 AM PST by dubyagee (Just ranting to myself...pay no mind.)
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To: yankeedame
You mean God told Noah to bring two of each kind of BEER! Go, Noah.
98 posted on 03/21/2004 6:44:20 AM PST by Henchman (I Hench, therefore I am!)
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To: Old Professer
What is a species?

Second time that's come up today.
Here's the best answer I was able to google up.

Click here

99 posted on 03/21/2004 6:56:30 AM PST by ASA Vet ("Anyone who signed up after 11/28/97 is a newbie")
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To: Chewbacca
No, but what he did take on the ark were infant animals, which included dinosaurs.

How many animal species were onboard the Ark?

100 posted on 03/22/2004 9:40:04 AM PST by Modernman (Chthulu for President! Why Vote for the Lesser Evil?)
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