Posted on 04/21/2007 6:42:25 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
We've got some real challenges facing us. FR was established to fight against government corruption, overstepping, and abuse and to fight for a return to the limited constitutional government as envisioned and set forth by our founding fathers in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution and other founding documents.
One of the biggest cases of government corruption, overstepping and abuse that I know of is its disgraceful headlong slide into a socialist hell. Our founders never intended for abortion to be the law of the land. And they never intended the Supreme Court to be a legislative body. They never intended God or religion to be written out of public life. They never intended government to be used to deny God's existence or for government to be used to force sexual perversions onto our society or into our children's education curriculum. They never intend for government to disarm the people. They never intended for government to set up sanctuary cities for illegals. They never intended government to “rule” over the people and or to take their earnings or private property or to deprive them of their constitutional rights to free speech, free religion, private property, due process, etc. They never intended government to seize the private property of private citizens through draconian asset forfeiture laws or laws allowing government to take private property from lawful owners to give to developers. Or to seize wealth and redistribute it to others. Or to provide government forced health insurance or government forced retirement systems.
All of the above are examples of ever expanding socialism and tyranny brought to us by liberals/liberalism.
FR fights against the liberals/Democrats in all of these areas and always will. Now if liberalism infiltrates into the Republican party and Republicans start promoting all this socialist garbage, do you think that I or FR will suddenly stop fighting against it? Do you think I'm going to bow down and accept abortionism, feminism, homosexualism, global warming, illegal alien lawbreakers, gun control, asset forfeiture, socialism, tyranny, totalitarianism, etc, etc, etc, just so some fancy New York liberal lawyer can become president from the Republican party?
Do you really expect me to do that?
With over 4,500 replies, I guess I’m way late to this thread, but I wonder if all the RINO Rudy-bots have opus’d out yet?
It’s a free thread, they’re welcome to stay, but I glad Jim Robinson made a clear stand on the matter.
I think that’s what annoys me about the rudy supporters. I love debating with them over the actual record and beliefs of their candidate and my candidate and other candidates. I don’t care how “crass” their charges are, if they are about facts, I can handle it.
But this is a conservative site, and to come here and tell us conservatism is dead and we need to move on, that nobody will vote pro-life so we need to vote pro-abortion, that rudy is inevitable so we shouldn’t talk about his flaws because it will hurt him in the general election, or my favorite “that we are violating Reagan’s 11th commandment”, well that rubbed me the wrong way.
That’s why I started calling them defeatists. They have decided that conservatism has lost the war, and are suing for terms of surrender now. That makes them as “treasonous” to the cause of conservatism as Harry Reid is for his comments that we LOST the war in Iraq while we are still fighting it.
They day may come when the hearts of conservatives shall fail, but it is not this day.
Truth & reason have no place in an environment where winning is what matters. The bottom line is that the GOP is a centrist, big government organization that professes to hold conservative views merely for political expedience.
How come there isn't a party comparable to the Greens on the right? At least hard-core leftists are true to their "core beliefs"; I fail to see that level of commitment on the right. Rather, Conservatives can't seem to reconcile why conservative Republicans ignore their input and pursue candidates like Rudy.
This stare down is nothing more than a game of chicken. The GOP is betting that Rudy can pick up more Dem voters than lost SoCons and sweep the big blue states - sort of Arnie on a national scale.
If they pull it off, then the conservative movement is dead within the GOP. At that point, RINOs (conservatives who violate their principles and vote R) are free to mirror the Greens and get down to promoting their vision of the country - without being tied to money-interests and other powers that currently control the GOP.
I have no doubt that Rooty would fight the WOT just like Bill Clinton. Using the courts. That didn't stop 9/11, and it won't stop jihadis.
Rudy was a fool to store fuel in the WTC, and he was a fool to keep all of his emergency services in the WTC knowing it was a target before.
This was poor judgment probably due more to his arrogance.
Rudy has no military knowledge and has not served the country in any capacity other than being a mayor.
You take this "one issue" and put it together with his 100% support for abortion, grabbing guns, pro gay policies, and intertwine all of that with a very well known sleazy personal life , you have a BAD candidate.
"Saddled?" If Fred doesn't run, them's the choices.
Peach has been insulted on many threads pertaining to Rudy, not just this one, and the insult attack posts were left standing. I can image it does get tiring.
. Because if she is, then many others, who know her mettle, will always wonder if they (we) will be next
Indeed.
Peach was a fine freeper, and IS a top quality human being.
Without a doubt OhioWFan.
I want FR to be a beacon of truth and reason, and to have a strong voice in next year's election
Me too!
but I am wondering what damage will has already been done to its credibility by what has happened here.
IMO.
If this site has become such that it would ban those two FReepers, who have been so helpful and valuable, then this forum has moved beyond a place where I want to be associated.
Please either tell me that this is not true, or an error, or please cancel my account as well.
Well, I suppose that some of them are. But it's not all that obvious.
People in the East are much more moderate in their social views. On a forum like this, which has gravitated toward a strong social conservative presence, arguing a social moderate viewpoint is problematic, and that leaves the traditional fiscal and security issues that can be discussed rationally here. You will find social issues discussed on other forums, and not here. As you probably can see, anytime they are broached as a topic, the place goes up in flames.
So I would say no to your premise, and that there are many other issues being discussed. But the discussion is quite limited here.
I think it is clear from my body of postings that I am a firm believer in dialog, the more the better. I don’t know how you, being familiar with my posting history, would come to a different conclusion, but your opinion is wrong.
I think both sides are talking past each other trying to score points. I think there is some small room for agreement if we didn’t just assume the worst of each other (although I’m seeing less of that possibility given the eye-opening I’m getting from this thread and from going to the WideAwake site and reading stuff there.
I am apparently naive when it comes to politics. I hate politics, I hate how easily so many people can just lie to your face as a matter of strategy, or be completely disingenous about why they support people.
Anyway, I just wanted to counter your opinion. Feel free to believe what you want, and I’ll continue to try to have reasoned discussions of the issues and the policies of the candidates.
beeber was just one of several. Many are still posting as we type.
Oh I, too, have been a target from time to time. I just don’t let them get to me because when it comes down to it, my posts, positions, etc. speak for themselves. The opinions of a few malcontents mean nothing and are actually quite hilarious! But it does get rather tedious at times, doesn’t it?
It is true. Plus about another 13 or so, some very well known here.
Quite a red letter day on FR.
I’d be interested, as I thought I’d followed Thompson pretty closely and I don’t remember reading anything like that. Not questioning your sincere belief about it, but would want to see it because I don’t remember it.
It was right around the time the whole CFR thing got mentioned. The actual quotes were in the thread, in bold IRC.
EV is not "sliming" Fred Thompson. He's bringing up a legitimate issue he's got with Fred's record. And I disagree with EV's take on that issue as it concerns Fred's current position. But I'm not going to agree with you that he's "sliming" anyone by discussing it.
That was the purpose of this thread, IMO....
It's happened before, and will happen again. It's actually getting to be a predictable thing around here.
I read the purpose of the thread as someone stating their opinion of a candidate, no more, no less. I have seen no directive against people still supporting that candidate, just a warning not to besmirch other conservatives to prop up their guy. "Peach has been insulted on many threads pertaining to Rudy, not just this one, and the insult attack posts were left standing. I can image it does get tiring."
I have nothing against Peach, but she gave as good as she got, as did most of the Giuliani supporters (which does not condone any insults made against them). So please do not paint them as innocent angels in all of this.
Mr. Robinson, respectfully, have you lost your damn mind?
Whether my account is canceled or not, I am outta here.
Talk about biting the hand......
Hey, you keep encouraging people to runaway. Appears you have a yellow streak running down your trouser leg. Whazamatter, you gotta buy the jury to win the case?
The notion that Rudy is a fiscal conservative has also been discredited as a myth.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1821920/posts
You are correct that people in the Northeast (NOT the East) are more liberal; however, we have no reason to believe that any of these long-time Democratic voters would see any reason to vote for Rudy and not the ‘Rat candidate.
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