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Modern humans, Neanderthals shared earth for 1,000 years
ABC NEWSonline ^ | Thursday, September 1, 2005. 3:29pm (AEST)

Posted on 09/02/2005 2:31:25 PM PDT by ckilmer

Last Update: Thursday, September 1, 2005. 3:29pm (AEST)
A reconstruction of the face of a young female Neanderthal.

A reconstruction of the face of a young female Neanderthal who lived about 35,000 years ago in France. (AFP)

Modern humans, Neanderthals shared earth for 1,000 years

New evidence has emerged that Neanderthals co-existed with anatomically modern humans for at least 1,000 years in central France.

The finding suggests Neanderthals came to a tragic and lingering end.

Few chapters in the rise of Homo sapiens, as modern mankind is known, have triggered as much debate as the fate of the Neanderthals.

Smaller and squatter than Homo sapiens but with larger brains, Neanderthals lived in Europe, parts of central Asia and the Middle East for about 170,000 years.

But vestiges of the Neanderthals stop about 28,000 to 30,000 years ago.

At that point, Homo sapiens, a smart, ascendant sub-species of humans originating in eastern Africa, became the undisputed masters of the planet.

So what happened to the Neanderthals?

One intriguing school of thought is that the Neanderthals did not suddenly disappear off the map but gradually melded in with Homo sapiens culturally and possibly sexually.

Interbreeding resulted, meaning that what we, today, supposedly carry some of the genetic legacy of the Neanderthals.

But a new study delivers a blow to this theory.

It shows that the two hominids did indeed co-exist for a long time but there is no evidence of any intermingling.

Indeed, it points to the likelihood that the Neanderthals petered out, their lineage expiring in starvation and Ice Age cold.

Paul Mellars, a professor of prehistory and human evolution at the University of Cambridge, and colleagues dated bone fossils preserved by French archaeologists who carefully excavated layers of soil at a site called 'la Grotte aux Fees' (the Fairy Grotto).

The cave, located at Chatelperron between the valleys of the Loire and Allier, is already famous as a former Neanderthal habitat.

But what makes the site especially interesting is that bone artefacts and flints bearing the typical hallmarks of prehistoric Homo sapiens were also found there.

Professor Mellars' team applied the modern tool of radiocarbon dating to get a precise idea of the age of the bone tools and compared those dates to the soil layers in which they were found and knowledge of the climate that prevailed at the time.

They found that Neanderthals lived in the cave between roughly 40,000 and 38,000 years ago, when the climate was, for the last Ice Age, relatively balmy.

Then came a sudden and prolonged cold snap, when the temperature dropped by as much as eight degrees Celsius and Homo sapiens - apparently migrating southwards in search of warmer climes - inhabited caves for about 1,000 to 1,500 years.

Thereafter, the climate slightly warmed again.

At that point, Homo sapiens moved out and the Neanderthals returned, staying for a period that went from about 36,500 years ago to 35,000 years ago.

After that, there is no more sign of them.

"This is the first categorical proof that Neanderthals and modern human beings did overlap in France for more than 1,000 years," Professor Mellars said.

He says it is also convincing evidence of the Neanderthals' vulnerability to climate change and of the rise of smarter, more adaptable rivals.

"People point out that Neanderthals were biologically better adapted to living in glacial conditions than modern humans, that they were built a bit like eskimos and were better anatomically at coping with cold conditions, whereas modern humans came in from Africa, where they evolved with bodies that were taller and thinner and did not conserve heat so well," he said.

"Yet the evidence is here that modern humans could cope with cold conditions better than the Neanderthals thanks to culture and technology, for instance with better clothing, better fire control and perhaps better shelters."

Professor Mellars says Neanderthals and Homo sapiens probably lived near each other for long periods.

But he says no evidence has been found of cultural interaction and DNA tests on samples taken from 1,000 Europeans have failed to find any evidence of Neanderthal genes.

In short, the indicators point to the likelihood that Homo sapiens crushed or ousted the Neanderthals in the fight to survive.

-AFP



TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: bear; bears; cave; caveart; cavedrawings; cavepainting; cavepaintings; chauvet; crevolist; france; godsgravesglyphs; lagrotteauxfees; macroetymology; neandertal; neandertals; neanderthal; neanderthals; paleosigns; thefairygrotto
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To: RadioAstronomer
I've been keeping score:
Discoveries attributable to the scientific method -- 500 billion.
Discoveries attributable to creation science -- zero.

61 posted on 09/03/2005 6:44:52 AM PDT by PatrickHenry (Felix, qui potuit rerum cognoscere causas. The List-O-Links is at my homepage.)
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To: PatrickHenry
I've been keeping score:

:-)

62 posted on 09/03/2005 6:48:58 AM PDT by RadioAstronomer (Senior member of Darwin Central)
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To: RadioAstronomer
New tagline.
63 posted on 09/03/2005 6:52:56 AM PDT by PatrickHenry (Discoveries attributable to the scientific method -- 500 billion; to creation science -- zero.)
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To: PatrickHenry

I like it! :-)


64 posted on 09/03/2005 6:57:59 AM PDT by RadioAstronomer (Senior member of Darwin Central)
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To: PatrickHenry

You might want to add this one to your "SOME LINKS DEBUNKING "YOUNG EARTH" BELIEFS" section.

http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2005/04/18_deep2.shtml

http://deep.berkeley.edu/APS/


65 posted on 09/03/2005 7:20:14 AM PDT by RadioAstronomer (Senior member of Darwin Central)
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To: muir_redwoods
>Actually the movie, "The Thirteenth Warrior" was based on a novel by Michael Creighton named "Eaters of the Dead" . . .
66 posted on 09/03/2005 7:27:20 AM PDT by theFIRMbss
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To: RadioAstronomer

Thanks for the info.


67 posted on 09/03/2005 9:43:12 AM PDT by winner3000
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To: RadioAstronomer
Those are good, but probably not necessary. I've already got a link to The Age of the Universe and SN1987A, which shows that lightspeed hasn't changed for 170,000 years. That's far back enough to deal with the YEC claims.
68 posted on 09/03/2005 10:52:54 AM PDT by PatrickHenry (Discoveries attributable to the scientific method -- 500 billion; to creation science -- zero.)
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To: ckilmer
My own gutsy theory and I am sure a politically incorrect one for those who dare.....(it has very little in the way of known (to me)facts to back it up.....just a hunch...)

.....Europeans and probably Asians are a blend of Homo erectus/Neanderthal. and whatever groups migrated from Africa 40,000 years ago....

.....the mixture worked....but the 2 groups that they spawned from didst work...one of those groups is dead, but lives on in the hybrid. the other of the 2 is a dead end that hasn't passed into history yet.

flame away.
69 posted on 09/03/2005 10:54:09 AM PDT by Vaquero (a red stater trapped in the body of a blue state.)
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To: ckilmer
[New evidence has emerged that Neanderthals co-existed with anatomically modern humans for at least 1,000 years in central France. The finding suggests Neanderthals came to a tragic and lingering end.]


IBF!
70 posted on 09/03/2005 12:49:32 PM PDT by spinestein (The facts fairly and honestly presented, truth will take care of itself.)
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To: PatrickHenry

Great link.


71 posted on 09/03/2005 1:38:26 PM PDT by Quark2005 (Where's the science?)
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To: Quark2005; RadioAstronomer

I got it from RA.


72 posted on 09/03/2005 1:45:21 PM PDT by PatrickHenry (Discoveries attributable to the scientific method -- 500 billion; to creation science -- zero.)
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To: theFIRMbss

I loved that book. The movie the "13th Warrior" was okay. But I really enjoyed the novel. It makes alot of sense but I wonder how it fits into the Intelligent Design theory.


73 posted on 09/03/2005 1:50:01 PM PDT by brwnsuga (Proud, Black, Conservative!)
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To: theFIRMbss

The point I was making was the connection to Beowulf.


74 posted on 09/03/2005 3:28:19 PM PDT by muir_redwoods (Free Sirhan Sirhan, after all, the bastard who killed Mary Jo Kopechne is walking around free)
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To: muir_redwoods

Hell, I liked the original "Beowulf"; but I liked "Eaters of the Dead", and the movie, "The 13th Warrior", too.


75 posted on 09/03/2005 4:07:13 PM PDT by chesley (Liberals...What's not to loathe?)
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To: muir_redwoods

Hell, I liked the original "Beowulf"; but I liked "Eaters of the Dead", and the movie, "The 13th Warrior", too.


76 posted on 09/03/2005 4:07:29 PM PDT by chesley (Liberals...What's not to loathe?)
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To: muir_redwoods
"The Thirteenth Warrior" is a re-write of Beowulf.

There were no Muslims in Beowolf.

77 posted on 09/03/2005 6:38:45 PM PDT by Alouette (We will have unity when liberals love their unborn children more than they hate conservatives)
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To: VadeRetro
"And if you routinely see something called a new "specie" popping out from nowhere, you should stop drinking whatever you're drinking."

If I see something called specie popping into existence from nowhere, I'll start believing in leprechauns. They (specie) are worth a fair penny these days.

78 posted on 09/03/2005 6:42:28 PM PDT by b_sharp (Science adjusts theories to fit evidence, creationism distorts evidence to fit the Bible.)
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To: ckilmer
Interbreeding resulted, meaning that what we, today, supposedly carry some of the genetic legacy of the Neanderthals.

Well, that explains more than a bit about me. Thanks!

79 posted on 09/03/2005 6:43:32 PM PDT by HitmanLV
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To: Alouette
"There were no Muslims in Beowolf."

Acquaint yourself with the distinction between a re-write and a translation.

80 posted on 09/03/2005 7:27:30 PM PDT by muir_redwoods (Free Sirhan Sirhan, after all, the bastard who killed Mary Jo Kopechne is walking around free)
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