Free Republic
Browse · Search
General/Chat
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

A man’s discovery of bones under his pub could forever change what we know about the Irish
The Washington Post ^ | 17 March 2016 | Peter Whoriskey

Posted on 03/21/2016 8:45:16 AM PDT by Theoria

Ten years ago, an Irish pub owner was clearing land for a driveway when his digging exposed an unusually large flat stone. The stone obscured a dark gap underneath. He grabbed a flashlight to peer in.

"I shot the torch in and saw the gentleman, well, his skull and bones," Bertie Currie, the pub owner, said this week.

The remains of three humans, in fact, were found behind McCuaig’s Bar in County Antrim, Northern Ireland. And though police were called, it was not, as it turned out, a crime scene.

Instead, what Currie had stumbled over was an ancient burial that, after a recent DNA analysis, challenges the traditional centuries-old account of Irish origins.

From as far back as the 16th century, historians taught that the Irish are the descendants of the Celts, an Iron Age people who originated in the middle of Europe and invaded Ireland somewhere between 1000 B.C. and 500 B.C.

That story has inspired innumerable references linking the Irish with Celtic culture. The Nobel-winning Irish poet William Butler Yeats titled a book “Celtic Twilight.” Irish songs are deemed “Celtic” music. Some nationalists embraced the Celtic distinction. And in Boston, arguably the most Irish city in the United States, the owners of the NBA franchise dress their players in green and call them the Celtics.

Yet the bones discovered behind McCuaig’s tell a different story of Irish origins, and it does not include the Celts.

“The DNA evidence based on those bones completely upends the traditional view,” said Barry Cunliffe, an emeritus professor of archaeology at Oxford who has written books on the origins of the people of Ireland.

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtonpost.com ...


TOPICS: History
KEYWORDS: ancientautopsies; ancientnavigation; bookofconquests; bookofinvasions; bookofleinster; celts; cessair; countyantrim; districtofcolumbia; dna; eabhargabhalaeireann; fartyshadesofgreen; firbolg; gaels; genealogy; godsgravesglyphs; helixmakemineadouble; historiabrittonum; iberia; ireland; irish; leborgabalaerenn; milesians; nemed; nennius; partholon; peterwhoriskey; tuathadedanann; washingtoncompost; washingtonpost
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-50 next last

1 posted on 03/21/2016 8:45:16 AM PDT by Theoria
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: SunkenCiv

celts, irish, ping..that time of year...


2 posted on 03/21/2016 8:45:52 AM PDT by Theoria (I should never have surrendered. I should have fought until I was the last man alive)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Theoria
The Celts settled in areas called Galatia by the Romans, with each area having a different spelling of the word "Galatia."

They came from an area known as Galatia along the Po River which is in the area of Poland. They traveled a lot and set up roots in not just Ireland but also NW Spain and Turkey.

The Letter of St. Paul to the Galatians is the letter to the Celts in Turkey.

According to anthropologists who have studied them, the Celts in Ireland are the closest we have today of the original Celts.

3 posted on 03/21/2016 8:52:24 AM PDT by Slyfox (Donald Trump's First Principle is the Art of the Deal)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Theoria

Leave it to the Irish to be buried beneath a pub!


4 posted on 03/21/2016 8:52:39 AM PDT by MIchaelTArchangel (What one is different: T.Rex, T.Rump, T.Rash, T.Cruz?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Theoria

5 posted on 03/21/2016 8:53:08 AM PDT by Donglalinger
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Theoria

Irish archeological find under a pub. Gotta love it.


6 posted on 03/21/2016 8:54:16 AM PDT by CrazyIvan (Socialists are just communists in their larval stage.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Theoria

Per the article, JRR Tolkien seems to have been well ahead of the curve on this. Smart man.


7 posted on 03/21/2016 8:56:37 AM PDT by ClearCase_guy (I don't know what Claire Wolfe is thinking, but I know what I'm thinking.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Theoria
I read an interesting article -- I can't remember the numbers, but some large number of people in the British Isles believe themselves to have "Viking" blood, but DNA testing shows otherwise, and in reality a fairly small portion of the population can actually lay claim to Danish/Norse DNA.

My people came from Ireland (specifically a region that was heavily raided and invaded by Vikings), but a couple family members have done a few of those DNA tests over the last few years, and the tests consistently show a strong amount of Scandanavian. A couple of the tests narrowed it down specifically to Norwegian (not sure how that works, but I digress).

For those not in the know, generally speaking in the Viking Age the Danes invaded England and the Norwegians invaded Ireland.

It's not a slamdunk (I suppose a devilishly handsome Norwegian fisherman could have washed up in my ancestral village anytime between the Viking age and the early 1800's and added some Norwegian to my line), but considering that my people came from a region that saw strong Norse influence, I cherish the idea that I am part "Viking."

8 posted on 03/21/2016 8:58:59 AM PDT by Wyrd bið ful aræd (Don't Tread On Me)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ClearCase_guy
Lebor Gabála Érenn
9 posted on 03/21/2016 9:00:15 AM PDT by Theoria (I should never have surrendered. I should have fought until I was the last man alive)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Wyrd bið ful aræd

The Vikings founded Dublin.


10 posted on 03/21/2016 9:01:12 AM PDT by C19fan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: Theoria

I’ve known for sometime that the Irish DNA is closet to the Basque people (a distinct culture and DNA unto itself in Northern Spain/Southern France) as is the language structure. This arena is an exciting area that more will continue to unfold. Thanks so much for posting!!


11 posted on 03/21/2016 9:01:47 AM PDT by GOP Poet
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Donglalinger

Dead Leprechaun?


12 posted on 03/21/2016 9:02:36 AM PDT by JimRed (Is it 1776 yet? TERM LIMITS, now and forever! Build the Wall, NOW!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: JimRed

A survey of drunk scientists say it’s a strong possibility!


13 posted on 03/21/2016 9:05:32 AM PDT by Donglalinger
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: Theoria

Yet the bones discovered were not of Celtic origin ? So what were they if not Celtic ?


14 posted on 03/21/2016 9:07:22 AM PDT by mosesdapoet (My best insights get lost in FR's becaus e of meaningless venting no one reads.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Theoria

I’m not sure any of that is a real revelation. Traditionally, Ireland went through many different people’s moving in, in legend, Fir bolg, later Tuatha denann, later Milesian Celts.

The earliest inhabitants of western Europe are probably who the Irish are most genetically related to, like people in Basque/Spain. The fringe of Europe having slightly different (older) genetics than central or Eastern Europe shouldn’t be surprising, if you see where people migrate from.

Culture and language do not equal genetics. Genetically, the Celts were a mixed bag. Like many times in history, a ruling group could take over an area and impose their culture, yet the main underlying genetics was not changes.

There are exceptions. For example, the conquest of China resulted in the rulers becoming culturally Chinese. In Britain, the Germanic invaders significantly dented the genetics of the Britons that lived there.


15 posted on 03/21/2016 9:09:50 AM PDT by baltimorepoet
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Donglalinger

It would appear they were a lot smaller in the old days.


16 posted on 03/21/2016 9:10:16 AM PDT by tet68 ( " We would not die in that man's company, that fears his fellowship to die with us...." Henry V.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: GOP Poet
If you look at the map in the Washington Post article, it appears that the DNA from the bones comes closest to those of Ireland, Scotland, Wales, and Cornwall, the traditional Celtic fringe of the British Isles, and England, decreasingly as you go eastward, the French and Belgian coasts, and, unusually, central Germany. The Basque country has no more relation to this DNA than do the Balkans or Turkey. Galicia, Portugal, and western Spain have more common DNA with the 4,000 year old Irishman than the Basque country.
17 posted on 03/21/2016 9:10:51 AM PDT by Wallace T.
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: mosesdapoet
Yet the bones discovered were not of Celtic origin ? So what were they if not Celtic ?

Indeed! Were there no ships? Carts? Horses? Shoe leather? One big mistake made by neophyte students of history is to automatically assume that every time and place existed in isolation from every other time and place.

18 posted on 03/21/2016 9:15:31 AM PDT by Agnes Heep ("Oh, Master Copperfield, with what a pure affection do I love the ground my Agnes walks on!")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: mosesdapoet

These samples[three] were traced to primarily Steppe and Near Eastern genetic heritage.


19 posted on 03/21/2016 9:17:07 AM PDT by Theoria (I should never have surrendered. I should have fought until I was the last man alive)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Theoria

Okay, so they’re not Celts. What are they? I’m not about to click to the Washington Post to find out.


20 posted on 03/21/2016 9:25:59 AM PDT by IronJack
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-2021-4041-50 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
General/Chat
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson