The Hissing of Bummer Dames.
Posted on 04/26/2010 6:26:23 PM PDT by Artemis Webb
"What is the big deal about Bob Dylan?" Julia Schrenkler wondered on Gather.com three years ago. Well, according to fellow folkie Joni Mitchell, he's a plagiarizing fraud.
"Bob is not authentic at all," Mitchell tells the Los Angeles Times. "He's a plagiarist, and his name and voice are fake. Everything about Bob is a deception. We are like night and day, he and I."
True, Dylan's name is a "fake" -- he was born Robert ... um, Zimmerman -- but he'd have to be some kind of crazy to invent a voice like his current subterranean croak. Let's assume she's talking about his Woody Guthrie-isms of the '60s, just to be on the safe side.
But Mitchell (birth name: Roberta Joan Anderson, btw) doesn't restrict her remarks to male performers of her generation, letting us know that "Grace [Slick] and Janis Joplin were [sleeping with] their whole bands and falling down drunk."
Well, yes, but what of the Canadian-born Mitchell's own work? Time for a little self-examination, perhaps?
"My work is set against the stupid, destructive way we live on this planet," she announces. "Americans have decided to be stupid and shallow since 1980. Madonna is like Nero; she marks the turning point."
Ladies and gentlemen, Joni Mitchell: Special Ranting 2010 Edition. Approach her at your own risk...
(Excerpt) Read more at knittingcrochet.gather.com ...
I wasn’t aware he was inducted for his lyrics...
I’m not a Joni fan at all - although I grant that the album “absolute court and spark” (???) was very influential and quite original (not negating my previous post).
Bit of trivia - Jimmy Page was/is a huge Joni fan - and apparently was quite influenced by her. Seems amazing to me but it’s the truth.
I appreciate Joni for turning people on to Pat Metheny and Lyle Mays, and Jaco on “Shadows and Light.”
“and look upon myself and curse my fate”
desiring this man’s art and that man’s scope.
with what I most enjoy contented least..
Rave on, Joni.
I've done a lot of traveling in my time, and I've not denied myself pleasures of life I could afford. But I'll bet anything that my carbon footprint--the "destruction" I've visited upon this blue orb--isn't a tiny fraction of the destruction that the self-indulgent jet-set hippie Joni Mitchell is responsible for.
I like a lot of her early stuff--bright, cheery music like "Chelsea Morning." I even liked "Big Yellow Taxi" even though that was a paen to her new earth religion. "Court and Spark" is still one of my ten favorite albums.
I liked THAT Joni Mitchell. Too bad she's morphed into a graceless, bitter old harpie.
I don't follow the glitterati news, but I think I remember hearing something about that. None of us are immune to the ravages of time.
She's not garnering any positive flows with these ugly statements, though. Good will works almost as well as directed prayer.
Her statements seem a tad hypocritical for a flower child, don't they?
The Hissing of Bummer Dames.
Dont tell me Herman’s Hermits weren’t real....
I didn’t realize, “Furry Sings the Blues” was autobiographical . . .
Yes, sit back and, uh, “enjoy”:
‘Here Comes Santa Claus’ from Dylan’s 2009 Christmas album:
http://www.amazon.com/Christmas-In-The-Heart/dp/B002R4K6AG
Not meaning to hijack my own thread but I remember a great Ty Cobb anecdote in Ken Burns "Baseball". One of Cobb's teammates and roommates told the story of how every day when he went back to their hotel he would find Cobb relaxing in the bathtub ahead of him. Well one day for some reason or another this unlucky guy had a chance to get to the hotel first. He climbed into the tub of suds and was there when Cobb came in. Cobb became enraged and pulled him bodily from the tub. Then Cobb threw him to the floor and grabbing him by the shoulders screamed, "You don't understand! I have to be FIRST!"
Both Sinatra and Presley recorded thousands and thousands of songs and most of what they recorded is forgettable garbage, to be remembered only because those voices sang the lyrics.
In each case, they only produced a handful of truly classic recordings.
For Elvis, it was the original Sun sessions, the first Nashville RCA sessions, the Memphis recordings of the late 60s and the prime gospel recordings - about three hours of absolutely incredible music in which Elvis sang the right songs backed by real musicians with honest arrangements - and with Elvis himself singing with real passion and conviction.
For Sinatra it was his Capitol recordings of the late 50s - the melancholy concept albums arranged by Stordahl and Riddle. Again, this was Sinatra at the height of his powers when he still cared about breaking new musical ground, backed by a flawless orchestra and singing classic American standards with intelligent lyrics.
Presley and Sinatra, as great as their voices were, lived for most of their careers as prisoners of managers, record executives and industry fads. The 1960s were largely a lost decade for both of these men creatively - and sadly, those were the best years either man had left. By 1970 Sinatra was in his late 50s and Elvis was a junkie.
He didn't leave them. He was never really with them.
I remember watching a filmed interview with Dylan where he said as much, albeit in his round about, indirect way.
I understood enough about Dylan even before then, that he was a very misunderstood rebel, and that the flower child, hippie crowd mistook him for one of them. As you say, he never was.
here’s my contribution- a tiny violin
It was the guitar work.
Joni Mitchell was using some bizarre tunings, chords, and progressions for the time, and every guitar slinger of the time noticed it (including yours truly).
She also had incredible chops for a gal. She wasn't just strumming open chords and being a front for some folk band. She was a virtuoso.
I think that a lot of young girls were inspired to pick up the guitar by her. Today, you can find a lot of smoking female guitar players, but Joni was one of the first, first-rate female guitarists in modern popular music.
“I wasn’t aware he was inducted for his lyrics...”
Inducted? I don’t think that was the topic, was it? I thought we were talking about legendary singer/songwriters...at least I was...sorry if I misunderstood...but there is no comparison between Chuck Berry and Bob Dylan, in my opinion...two different worlds.
Dylan has about 6 or 7 songs that I can tolerate and/or just about like. They are, in order preference:
Lay, Lady, Lay
Hurricane
Knockin' on Heaven's Door
Like a Rolling Stone
Subterranean Homesick Blues
Tangled Up in Blue
Gotta Serve Somebody
Sinatra I never really cared for. I actually wasn't a great fan of Presley either. His early gospel stuff I thought was excellent, though. Sam Cooke gets my vote, hands down.
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