New Ice-Core Evidence Challenges the 1620s age for the Santorini (Minoan) Eruption

Journal of Archaeological Science, Volume 25, Issue 3, March 1998, Pages 279-289 ^ | 13 July 1997 | Gregory A. Zielinski, Mark S. Germani

[SunkenCiv]

Determining a reliable calendrical age of the Santorini (Minoan) eruption is necessary to place the impact of the eruption into its proper context within Bronze Age society in the Aegean region. The high-resolution record of the deposition of volcanically produced acids on polar ice sheets, as available in the SO42-time series from ice cores (a direct signal), and the high-resolution record of the climatic impact of past volcanism inferred in tree rings (a secondary signal) have been widely used to assign a 1628/1627 age to the eruption. The layer of ice in the GISP2 (Greenland) ice core corresponding to 1623±36 , which is probably correlative to the 1628/1627 event, not only contains a large volcanic-SO42-spike, but it contains volcanic glass. Composition of this glass does not match the composition of glass from the Santorini eruption, thus severely challenging the 1620s age for the eruption. Similarly, the GISP2 glass does not match the composition of glass from other eruptions (Aniakchak, Mt. St. Helens, Vesuvius) thought to have occurred in the 17th century nor does it match potential Icelandic sources. These findings suggest that an eruption not documented in the geological record is responsible for the many climate-proxy signals in the late 1620s . Although these findings do not unequivocally discount the 1620s age, we recommend that 1628/1627 no longer be held as the "definitive" age for the Santorini eruption.

[SunkenCiv]

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[SunkenCiv]

more about irrelevant radiocarbon results:

ARCHAEOLOGY: New Carbon Dates Support Revised History of Ancient Mediterranean
Science Magazine | 4/28/2006 | Michael Balter
Posted on 04/27/2006 7:59:30 PM EDT by Lessismore
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1622847/posts

Olive branch solves a Bronze Age mystery
Yahoo/MSNBC (Science) | 3:04 p.m. ET April 27, 2006 | Kathleen Wren
Posted on 04/28/2006 8:59:40 AM EDT by The_Victor
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1623102/posts

Debate Erupts Anew: Did Thera's Explosion Doom Minoan Crete?
International Herald Tribune | 10-23-2003 | William J. Broad
Posted on 10/23/2003 5:47:33 PM EDT by blam
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1006850/posts

[SunkenCiv]

oops, still more:

Ancient Volcano, Seeds And Treerings, Suggest Rewriting Late Bronze Age Mediterranean History (More)
Cornell University | 4-28-2006 | Alex Kwan
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1623821/posts

[SunkenCiv]

Sturt Manning (message 8) has done an about face now, and sez the eruption was 17th century BC. He's wrong again. Anyway, here's something I came across while looking for, hmm, anyway, not this:

[b-hebrew] Ark of the Covenant
Michael Banyai Banyai
Fri Aug 20 15:04:00 EDT 2004

...according to Sturt Manning, an expert on the matter, personal information to me, the Tel ed Daba pumice proves chemicaly not to be of Theran provenance, so it has no sense lowering the date of the Theran eruption.

The Theran eruption remains thus still cca. 1618 BC, and has nothing to do with the 18th dynasty.

[SunkenCiv]

The Thera (Santorini) Volcanic Eruption
and the Absolute Chronology
of the Aegean Bronze Age
by Sturt Manning

Pumice at Tell el-Dab'a. Some pumice from the Minoan eruption of the Thera volcano has been found in an early New Kingdom (18th Dynasty) at Tell el-Dab'a, and not before. Thus Warren suggests (as has been suggested in several publications by Bietak and Warren from 1994-1998) that the eruption probably occurred about the same time... The pumice could either have been lying on the seashore for a long time before collection, or could come from post-eruption collection of pumice in the Aegean and subsequent trade to Egypt. It is certainly not necessary to regard the pumice as at all contemporary with the eruption... This scenario of potentially significantly later, post-eruption, use of the Theran pumice at Tell el-Dab'a finds some support in a recent scientific examination by Max Bichler et al. They report on the analysis of three pumice samples from Tell el-Dab'a. They found that only two of the three pumice samples analysed from Tell el-Dab'a came from the Minoan eruption of Thera. The third sample, in contrast, comes from another eruption. This third sample (Tell el-Dab'a3) is very similar to pumice found at Antalya, Turkey, and on the Greek island of Chios... This finding thus challenges the a priori assumption of special, contemporaneous, and unique use of Thera pumice and the idea that its use at Tell el-Dab'a can be seen as a chronological marker... Second, if one looks for another suitable, roughly contemporary, and chemically consistent, volcanic source, then one might speculate that a likely source of the pumice in the Tell el-Dab'a3, Antalya, and Chios, samples in the study of Bichler et al. could well be the Yiali (Nissyros) volcano in the east Aegean... POSTSCRIPT JANUARY 2000. The Tell el-Dab'a3 samples have now been identified as related to the Kos volcano (Peltz et al. 1999). The general argument about use of differing pumices of differing ages remains valid, nonetheless.

The pumice came from the Kos volcano. Imagine that. Doesn't it seem likely that someone would have got that right in the first place, if they hadn't been saddling on every little thing as proof of a mega-eruption?

What this pumice controversy shows is, there was a rush to embrace the supposed 17th c BC eruption -- even though there is literally no evidence that it even ever took place -- and that the Tell el-Dab'a finds were redated from 2nd IP to 18th Dynasty in part because of the chronological impossibilities brought on by raising the date of the supposed eruption (there's no evidence for any major eruption, certainly not the apocalyptic vision of the bulk of the Volcanimbeciles). Using the pumice to say, hey, look, this pumice fell and was in use right away was a weak argument, and shows just how far gone the conventional pseudochronology has become.

[SunkenCiv]

Bietak, Manfred (2004),
"Review: Sturt W. Manning--A Test of Time (Oxbow, 1999)",
Bibliotheca Orientalis 61: 199-222.
http://www.informath.org/BiOr04i.pdf

saw this at:
http://www.glyphdoctors.com/mod/forum/discuss.php?d=662

[gleeaikin]

Volcanic evidence around 1500 BCE.

Checking out major volcanic activity in the Mediterranean for those centuries turns up a major eruption of Mt. Etna listed as 1500 BC, +- 50 years. I have check out various Mt. Etna sites, but find very little information about this eruption, except it probably left a very large collapsed area like Mt. St. Helens. I think the name was Valle del Bove (sp?). I really wonder why scientists have not paid more attention to this eruption, as the severe decline of the Minoans took place around this time. I have seen an areal photo of a much smaller recent eruption of Mt. Etna with a pronounced plume being blown directly toward north Africa.

Other research I have heard of indicated that Santorini had several earthquakes and was evacuated about 20 years before the big one.

[gleeaikin]

"I'm not sure I want to part with it yet."

Check out my comment #47, wherein I discuss the major eruption of Mt. Etna, 1500BCE + - 50 years. If anything is related to Exodus, that one is. Besides it may have been part of a much larger series of tectonic events aroung the Mediterranean and the Sinai. I think Exodus took place during the 18th Dynasty. I think that Hatshepsut may have been involved somewhere in the Moses story, or Amenhotep II, or both at different times. I am still working on those theories.

[gleeaikin]

"I'm not sure I want to part with it yet."

Check out my comment #47, wherein I discuss the major eruption of Mt. Etna, 1500BCE + - 50 years. If anything is related to Exodus, that one is. Besides it may have been part of a much larger series of tectonic events aroung the Mediterranean and the Sinai. I think Exodus took place during the 18th Dynasty. I think that Hatshepsut may have been involved somewhere in the Moses story, or Amenhotep II, or both at different times. I am still working on those theories. At any rate I don't think Ramases II was involved. [My computer is acting weird, so pardon any double posts.]

[blam]

"[My computer is acting weird, so pardon any double posts.]"

It's not awake yet...and, I don't know what I'm doing up at this time.

[SunkenCiv]

part of a much larger series of tectonic events aroung the Mediterranean and the Sinai

There were no active volcanoes in the Sinai. There's no extant evidence of tectonic activity during the Exodus, either, partly because there's been so much disagreement about the date.

I think the name was Valle del Bove (sp?). I really wonder why scientists have not paid more attention to this eruption, as the severe decline of the Minoans took place around this time.

At least the fictional 17th/16th/15th/14th c BC eruption of Thera has the virtue of being in the neighborhood. But regardless, there's no thick strata of ash on Crete, which was the Minoan homeland; there is no evidence of any destruction of Minoan sites apart from fire, showing that the agent of destruction was some sacker of cities; and there's no tsunami evidence, and destruction by earthquake is difficult to show (other than sites like Kourion on Cyprus where human remains are found buried under the toppled architecture).

Other research I have heard of indicated that Santorini had several earthquakes and was evacuated about 20 years before the big one.

The island was evacuated apparently due to an earthquake, and as noted above somewhere, someone stripped it pretty clean -- no valuables. Also, no human remains were found buried under toppled walls or whatnot.

The main arguments in favor of the earthquake are the lack of human traces and the lack of valuables, but both of those could have resulted from an invasion and sacking of the town. IOW, there's not even much evidence for the earthquake. It's just another idea which has been seized upon to support the idea of a later super fantastic volcanic eruption. :')

Sturt Manning's note (also above) that the pumice found in Egypt has actually been linked to the volcano on Kos -- which apparently saw its last eruption 161,000 years ago. The island of Kos itself is described as "dominantly non-volcanic" -- which means that it won't be long before someone dreams up a 17th century BC eruption by the Kos volcano, probably simultaneously with the supposed eruption of Thera.

Volcanic eruptions as the agent for the downfall of the Minoans started out an unsubstantiated hypothesis, and has grown into a delusional system.

[gleeaikin]

There were no active volcanoes in the Sinai.

What about the pillar of fire by night, the the pillar of smoke by day. Sounds pretty volcanic to me. The parting of the red (reed?) sea could have been caused by magma inflation of the earth and deflation.

While there may not be active volcanoes in the Sinai, there are on the West side of Saudi Arabia along the Red Sea. "The Encyclopedia of Volcanoes" (Sigurdsson, 2000), says regarding flood basalt fields, "They occur at hot spots where significant crustal spreading has occurred, for example...the fields in Arabia and Syria that parallel the Red Sea/Dead Sea rift systems. (pg. 287) On the next page, Figure 4 shows a "Sketch map of a moderate-sized flood basalt field: Harrat Rahat in Arabia....lavas under 0.6 Ma including those of historic eruptions in AD 641 and 1256"

The end plates of the Encyclopedia show 7 volcanoes along the northern half of Saudi Arabia's border on the Red Sea. I wish I knew more about those volcanoes, and when they might have been active.

[SunkenCiv]

That's nice, and could be of some help, but again, there's no way for a volcano that far away to show up in that way (pillar of cloud/fire), and the passage across the Gulf of Aqaba would have to involve major shifts of the Earth's crust. There's also the idea that the Israelites would have survived in close proximity to an erupting volcano, or for that matter, would have run toward it once close enough (having crossed the Sinai).

[SunkenCiv]

A re-analysis of the
Late Bronze Age eruption and tsunami
of Santorini, Greece, and the
implications for the volcano–tsunami hazard
Dale Dominey-Howes
Journal of Volcanology and Geothermal Research
Volume 130, Issues 1-2,
15 February 2004, Pages 107-132

Abstract: The paroxysmal eruption of Santorini (ca. 3500 BP), referred to as the Late Bronze Age (LBA) eruption, probably generated multiple tsunami; their occurrence and impacts being cited frequently in scientific papers and articles. This paper examines what is known about any LBA tsunami, noting possible mechanisms of generation and identifying sedimentological traces. Firstly, the eruption sequence is outlined providing the context in which tsunami genesis may have occurred. Secondly, the arguments forwarded for the tsunami and a summary of the evidence is given. Thirdly, results of a new geological investigation for LBA tsunami deposits at 41 coastal sites from Crete and Kos are presented. The data are used to test the hypothesis that the LBA eruption generated an east Mediterranean-wide tsunami. It will be seen that no terrestrial geological evidence is identified. The paper re-examines the original arguments presented for LBA tsunami, challenging them because their founding assumptions are flawed. Together, the new data and the re-analysis of the original tsunami hypothesis indicate that there is insufficient evidence to demonstrate that any significant far-field tsunami propagated throughout the entire east Mediterranean as frequently purported. Some terrestrial evidence exists to suggest localised near-field tsunami inundation. There is good submarine evidence however, to suggest that a tsunami was focused to the W and WSW. The results have important implications for understanding the volcano-related tsunami hazard within the region and elsewhere.

[SunkenCiv]

Volcanic eruptions' effect on vegetation
after Neil Ogle, Chris S. M. Turney,
Robert M. Kalin, Louise O'Donnell,
C. John Butler

Volcanic eruptions may reduce the amount of isotopic carbon in vegetation, according to an analysis of the effect of historical eruptions on oak trees. Ogle et al. report on the chronology of carbon 13 records seen in a pair of Irish oaks through several major eruptions in the 18th and 19th centuries. The authors studied meteorological data from observatories in northern Europe and found a significant reduction in the carbon content stored inside the trees, which they attribute to the effects of the eruptions. The researchers suggest that airborne material spewed into the atmosphere from the eruptions likely decreased the amount of sunlight reaching the trees, which in turn hindered leaf formation and reduced the amount of carbon 13 absorbed from the air. They note that such soot and ash could remain in the atmosphere for several years, where it could be transported around the globe and affect incoming solar radiation and affect plant growth worldwide.

Carbon 12 is enhanced compared with isotopic carbon in plants grown in volcanic soils, which are lousy with C12, [characterization deleted]s.

[SunkenCiv]

"Even when, during the respective Thera Conferences, individual scientists had pointed out that the magnitude and significance of the Thera eruption must be estimated as less than previously thought, the conferences acted to strengthen the original hypothesis. The individual experts believed that the arguments advanced by their colleagues were sound, and that the facts of a natural catastrophe were not in doubt... All three factors reflect a fantasy world rather than cool detachment, which is why it so difficult to refute the theory with rational arguments." -- Eberhard Zangger, "The Future of the Past: Archaeology in the 21st Century", pp 49-50.

[SunkenCiv]

Archaeologists Rewrite Timeline Of Bronze And Iron Ages, Alphabet
Cornell University | 12-19-2001 | Blaine P. Friedlander Jr.
Posted on 12/24/2001 8:04:31 AM EST by blam
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/596279/posts

So Who Is Buried in Midas’s Tomb?
NYT | 12/25/2001 | John Noble Wilford
Posted on 12/25/2001 1:12:01 AM EST by a_Turk
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/596541/posts

Debate Erupts Anew: Did Thera’s Explosion Doom Minoan Crete?
International Herald Tribune | 10-23-2003 | William J. Broad
Posted on 10/23/2003 5:47:33 PM EDT by blam
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1006850/posts

ARCHAEOLOGY: New Carbon Dates Support Revised History of Ancient Mediterranean
Science Magazine | 4/28/2006 | Michael Balter
Posted on 04/27/2006 7:59:30 PM EDT by Lessismore
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1622847/posts
[particularly message 25]

Olive branch solves a Bronze Age mystery
Yahoo/MSNBC (Science) | 3:04 p.m. ET April 27, 2006 | Kathleen Wren
Posted on 04/28/2006 8:59:40 AM EDT by The_Victor
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1623102/posts

Ancient Volcano, Seeds And Treerings,
Suggest Rewriting Late Bronze Age Mediterranean History (More)
Cornell University | 4-28-2006 | Alex Kwan
Posted on 04/29/2006 3:24:20 PM EDT by blam
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1623821/posts

Santorini Eruption Much larger Than Originally Believed
University Rhode Island | 8-23-2006 | Todd McLeish
Posted on 08/23/2006 8:58:47 PM EDT by blam
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1688940/posts

A Culture Shaped By Natural Disasters (Thera/Akrotiri)
Kathimerini | 1-16-2007 | Christos Doumas
Posted on 01/16/2007 6:33:09 PM EST by blam
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1768593/posts

Sinai pumice linked to ancient eruption [...not!]
Yahoo | Monday, April 2, 2007 | Katarina Kratovac w/ contrib by Nicholas Paphits
Posted on 04/07/2007 12:08:27 AM EDT by SunkenCiv
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1813465/posts

The wave that destroyed Atlantis [Destroyed by a giant tsunami?]
BBC On-Line | Friday, 20 April 2007 | Harvey Lilley
Posted on 04/22/2007 5:53:44 AM PDT by yankeedame
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1821546/posts

How Old Tree Rings And Ancient Wood Are Helping Rewrite History
Science Daily | 10-27-2007 | Cornell University
Posted on 10/28/2007 2:05:05 PM EDT by blam
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1917591/posts

Layers of mystery: Archaeologists look to the earth for Minoan fate
Worcester Telegram & Gazette | Sunday, October 28, 2007 | Judy Powell
Posted on 11/03/2007 11:04:25 PM PDT by SunkenCiv
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/1920708/posts

Did a Tsunami Wipe Out a Cradle of Western Civilization?
Discover Magazine | 01.04.2008 | Evan Hadingham
Posted on 01/15/2008 11:53:15 AM EST by forkinsocket
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/1954101/posts

[SunkenCiv]

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[SunkenCiv]

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[mrreaganaut]

I like Rohl’s new chronological proposals.

While the conclusions may be debated, his book does a good job of explaining why “chronology” and the Greek Dark Ages are amateur Victorian notions, at best: http://www.amazon.com/Pharaohs-Kings-David-Rohl/dp/0609801309/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1300060513&sr=8-1

Of course, if Santorini didn’t have a massive eruption after settlement, then the whole “we have a scientific explanation for the Plagues” goes out the window.