The Neverending Story (The Christian Chronicles)

Associated Press ^ | 3/24/01

[malakhi]

The Neverending Story
An ongoing debate on Scripture, Tradition, History and Interpretation.

Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams

Previous Thread

[Uri’el-2012]

Invincibly Ignorant ; RobbyS

RS>Might arise from the simple fact that many Jews even in Palestine-Syria were, like Stephen, Greek-speakers. Who knows but that Our Lord himself knew some Greek since a large Greek town is known to have existed just a few miles from Nazareth.Impossible to know, of course.

II>Who knows?


46080 posted on 04/03/2003 8:48 AM MST by Invincibly Ignorant

Could it be that the "Lingua Franca" of the 1st century was Koine Greek.

Or Perhaps that Koine Greek is very very precise in it's grammar.

Oh well, the Holy spirit chose it for His own reasons.

Matthew 23:39 For I tell you, you will not see me again until you say,
`Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.'" [Psalm 118:26]

Barukh haba b'Shem Adonai
Blessed is He who comes in the Name of the Lord
Y'shua HaMashiach

chuck <truth@YeshuaHaMashiach>

[JHavard]

Interesting quotes from the Koran

From, ”THE DINNER TABLE”

The Koran tells Muslims, that Musa, (Moses) knew the people of Israel were to inherit the holy land.

[5.20] And when Musa said to his people: O my people! remember the favor of Allah upon you when He raised prophets among you and made you kings and gave you what He had not given to any other among the nations.
[5.21] O my people! enter the holy land which Allah has prescribed for you and turn not on your backs for then you will turn back losers.
[5.22] They said: O Musa! surely there is a strong race in it, and we will on no account
enter it until they go out from it, so if they go out from it, then surely we will enter.
[5.23] Two men of those who feared, upon both of whom Allah had bestowed a favor, said: Enter upon them by the gate, for when you have entered it you shall surely be victorious, and on Allah should you rely if you are believers.
[5.24] They said: O Musa! we shall never enter it so long as they are in it; go therefore you
and your Lord, then fight you both surely we will here sit down.
[5.25] He said: My Lord! Surely I have no control (upon any) but my own self and my brother; therefore make a separation between us and the nation of transgressors.
[5.26] He said: So it shall surely be forbidden to them for forty years, they shall wander
about in the land, therefore do not grieve for the nation of transgressors.

From Koran book of, ”THE CHILDREN OF ISRAEL”

Interesting

[17.33]And do not kill any one whom Allah has forbidden, except for a just cause, and whoever is slain unjustly, We have indeed given to his heir authority, so let him not exceed the just limits in slaying; surely he is aided.

[17.104] And We said to the Israelites after him: Dwell in the land: and when the promise of the next life shall come to pass, we will bring you both together in judgment.

[17.111] And say: (All) praise is due to Allah, Who has not taken a son and Who has not a partner in the kingdom, and Who has not a helper to save Him from disgrace; and proclaim His greatness magnifying (Him).

Is it any wonder why Muslim countries are not blessed? They know God gave the Holy Land to Israel, but they still fight against the words of their own god in their own Koran.

JH :-)

[nate4one]

Why hasn't he returned yet? And, under what circumstances (what things have to happen/ will be happening) do you believe he will return?

Oh Malakhi, Great questions to those who will not give the right answers!! HE HAS RETURNED! We would have to go into much study but if Christ said He would in His disciples lifetime (Matt 16:28), then He did!

Couple of points I made the other day. Firstly, from the perspective of comparing the 7,000 year redemptive plan along side of eternity the disciples were right, the messiah is coming dang soon. Secondly, we're told that its not for us to know when he'll come and restore at the athid lavo. From our favorite book.

A 7000 year redemptive cycle? God had the Israelites wander the wilderness for 40 years (for redemptive purposes) before bringing the younger generation in the promised land.
Likewise Christ returned after 40 years (AD 30-70) in AD 70. A 40 year redemptive time is Biblical. 7000 years is fictional.

Acts 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? 7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

And they did not know. But they knew the generation (Matt 24:34) and they knew once the signs began to manifest themselves. (1 John, Jude). Nate

[CindyDawg]

HE HAS RETURNED!

. No he hasn't, caz I'm still here :')

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

I am sitting here chuckling:)

Isn't it funny, the soft spot we all have here for each other on the NES. I am not proud of the fact, but I have no problem ripping someone's head off that is not from NES, on other threads. But you let one of "our guys" show up and it brings me to a halt on spewing hatefulness:)

Nate, how is Adam. I saw the pictures awhile back you posted. He looked a miracle considering his start in life. I think of him often. How are you? Can you say where you are at? Stay safe!

Becky

[nate4one]

The Bible never said you would leave. It simply said you would be with the Lord in the "air" (Greek word for "presence.")
Actually Revelation 21 said He was coming down to US. To dwell with us on earth.
God Bless,
Nate

[nate4one]

Hey,
I am with you. I will always share my feelings but there is a respect and family feeling when I come back here although briefly.

Adam is great. He may have to use braces on his ankles but all oter tests have him as good.
I am in Kuwait and I am told he has been gaining more personality and communication skills all the time by my wife. He holds up his finger saying he is "1" and he says "Dadda" and "Kaka." He is always so happy still.
Thanks for asking.

How's life here?
And the big man?

God Bless
Nate

[CindyDawg]

It will take me awhile to get back with you on scripture about that. I'm still gathering hell verses to debate Douglas with lol.

[PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain]

Dada and KaKa....what a combo, unless he is speaking of something or someone:) One, has it been that long....hard to believe. I am so glad he is doing well, although with the amount of prayers that were being said for him I don't know why I am surprised:)

Kuwait....once again... stay safe.

OH, BTW, the big man is fine, he is out polishing his bike, getting ready for spring, although today is a bit cold, which is why I am here:) But I am getting ready to haul a horse to town for my daughter, so I need to close up.

Becky

[JHavard]

Oh Malakhi, Great questions to those who will not give the right answers!! HE HAS RETURNED! We would have to go into much study but if Christ said He would in His disciples lifetime (Matt 16:28), then He did!

Matthew 16:28 Verily I say unto you, There be some standing here, which shall not taste of death, till they see the Son of man coming in his kingdom.

Matthew 17:1-3 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart, And was transfigured before them: and his face did shine as the sun, and his raiment was white as the light. And, behold, there appeared unto them Moses and Elias talking with him.

Peter wrote about what he and James and John had witnessed that day on the mountain in 65AD, 5 years prior to what you call the return of Christ.

He told us, that he had already witnessed this event.

2 Peter 1:16-18 For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty. For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. And this voice which came from heaven we heard, when we were with him in the holy mount.

Jesus told His disciples that some there would see Him coming in His glory.

Six days later, Peter James and John did.

Jesus told them not to tell anyone about it until after His resurrection.

Around 30 years later, Peter recorded what they had seen, right down to the voice of the Father saying "This is my beloved Son in whom I am well pleased."

How much longer can you complicate this?

JH :-)

[nate4one]

You took that completely out of context. In the SAME discourse in Matt 16, Jesus said that the Son of man would come with His fathers angels and render each man according to his works. (Paraphrase). Why would Christ speak to His disciples about living for Christ and the reward they would recieve for doing so and then change the subject for just 1 sentance???!! It does not follow even basic communication skills nor Christ's pattern. He always followed His prophecies (come with the angels) with a time statement (some here will not taste death). Matt 23 and 24 follow this SAME pattern.

Also Peter was just giving them confidence that his word was good in the matters of Christ and His return in glory, because he himself witnessed Christ's majesty on the mount.
He was using his presence on the mount as being proof he is a credible witness.
He, in no way, said that the transfiguration itself was a "parousia" of the kingdom.
YOU add that.
And to any coherent reader of Matt 16, the WHOLE CONTEXT, you are the one who complicates it.

You confuse a demonstration of Majesty with the coming of His kingdom? Doesn't it make more sense to say that the "reward" verse 27 is more consistant with a coming in the kingdom?

God Bless,
Nate

[OLD REGGIE]

Hee hee! Sunny and near 80 right now. :o)

What will your weather be when ours is sunny and near 80? Haw haw!

[JHavard]

What will your weather be when ours is sunny and near 80? Haw haw!

For those two days, we'll stay in the pool. Heh heh heh.

14 to 20" of snow in NY and NH? That's the worse case of global warming I've heard of. Lol

Ginny just came in from the pool, and being from Pittsburgh, she think's the water's warm, even though it's only 76 degrees. Go figure

JH

[CindyDawg]

We call them heated pools here.

[JHavard]

You took that completely out of context. In the SAME discourse in Matt 16, Jesus said that the Son of man would come with His fathers angels and render each man according to his works. (Paraphrase). Why would Christ speak to His disciples about living for Christ and the reward they would recieve for doing so and then change the subject for just 1 sentance???!!

Mt 16:27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.

So your saying Christ came in glory with His angels and EVERY man was rewarded according to their works in 70AD, and no one saw it or heard about it? Boy, was the return of Christ over played. How many times was this great day prophesied, and written about, just to silently slip past the whole world.

Matthew 16:27, and 28, are two separate accounts of time. V-27 is when the Father chooses to end the age, and verse 28 is a preview of what this Jesus who everyone saw as a nice passive meek man, and what He would look like when He comes in his power at that time.

Have you found a way to spin around the fact that John wrote his books after 70AD, and he saw nothing significant enough about the return of Christ to bother mentioning it?

JH

[JHavard]

We call them heated pools here.

In Pittsburgh Pa. any water over 60 degrees is called a heated pool. Hehehehe

JH :-)

[CindyDawg]

So where do you believe we are? Hell? Caz no way can this place be Heaven.

[JHavard]

So where do you believe we are? Hell? Caz no way can this place be Heaven.

South Texas isn't West Virginia you know. :-)

JH

[CindyDawg]

I agree that Texas is about as close as you will get, but it's still not Heaven :')

[nate4one]

Have you found a way to spin around the fact that John wrote his books after 70AD, and he saw nothing significant enough about the return of Christ to bother mentioning it?

JH,
The destruction of Soloman's temple was the single biggest event to happen before Christ's emmergiance.
Herod's was said to be even greater.

Yet John, nor ANY other New Testament writer found what Josephus filled a HUGE book with significant enough to even hint about?
How many times is the priesthood (nonexistent AFTER AD 70) mentioned in Revelation as still existent. Even the pursecutions and deceptions of those "synogogue of Satan" members is brought up in Revelation.
THEY NO LONGER PERSECUTED THE CHURCH AFTER AD 70!!

YOUR only evidence is that John was spotted on Patmos in AD 96. All that proves is a non-disappearance rapture.

So your saying Christ came in glory with His angels and EVERY man was rewarded according to their works in 70AD, and no one saw it or heard about it? Boy, was the return of Christ over played. How many times was this great day prophesied, and written about, just to silently slip past the whole world.

Not only did the whole world know what happened in AD70, the known world was involved. The Roman Empire. And Josephus recorded it all.

You miss your own Bible friend.
God came plenty of times "in the clouds" in the Old testament in judgement against nations like Egypt, Babylon etc.

All Christ did was use this same apocolyptic language again to pronounce judgement on those who would be destroyed for the blood of the martyrs and saints (Matt 23:29-38), that was the Babylon of Revelation, the synogogue of Satan (Rev 17-18).

1. Is God going to judge 2 different nations for the same crime (shedding of all the innocent blood on earth)? Babylon and Israel?
2. Is Christ going to speak a sermon on the cost and reward off discipleship to end it with 1 completely unrelated sentance? Even when it follows his pattern to "prophecy" then give a time text?" (Matt 10,, 16, 23,24, Luke 21:32, etc?

God Bless Friend!