Posted on 07/07/2008 3:34:44 AM PDT by Gamecock
Members of the LDS Church often make a big issue of the fact that their ancestors faced terrible persecutions during the early years of the LDS movement. To most people, Missourian sites like Independence, Liberty, Far West, and Caldwell County mean very little. Yet to the faithful Latter-day Saint, these places carry a great amount of significance.
It is true that the Mormons were driven from several states before finally arriving in what is known today as the state of Utah, and this violence can never be condoned. However, with all of the talk of the persecution early Mormons faced, there is rarely any discussion as to the role played by the Mormons in those early years. To be sure, the average Mormon has no idea that both sides had their share of abuses in human rights. To many Latter-day Saints, their forebears were simply innocent victims.
It would be wrong to say that the Mormons were treated badly simply because they had theological disagreements with their new neighbors. In his book The Mormon Hierarchy - Origins of Power, former LDS historian D. Michael Quinn wrote,
"Fear of being overwhelmed politically, socially, culturally, economically by Mormon immigration was what fueled anti-Mormonism wherever the Latter-day Saints settled during Joseph Smith's lifetime. Religious belief, as non-Mormons understood it, had little to do with anti-Mormonism. On the other hand, by the mid-1830s Mormons embraced a religion that shaped their politics, economics and society. Conflict was inevitable" (p.91).
On page 82 of the book, The Story of the Latter-day Saints, LDS historians James B. Allen and Glen M. Leonard wrote, "Impressed by the Mormon image of group solidarity, some old settlers expressed fears that as a group the Mormons were determined to take over all of their lands and business."
In his book, The 1838 Mormon War in Missouri, historian Stephen C. LeSueur notes that "non-Mormon land speculators could not hope to compete with the Mormons, who were purchasing large tracts of land with Church funds," and that the huge immigration of Mormons to the area also "threatened to displace older towns as the political and commercial centers for their counties" (p.3).
Arrogance on the part of the Mormon settlers certainly did not help the situation. As Allen and Leonard write,
"The Saints themselves may not have been totally without blame in the matter. The feelings of the Missourians, even though misplaced, were undoubtedly intensified by the rhetoric of the gathering itself. They were quick to listen to the boasting of a few overzealous Saints who too-loudly declared a divine right to the land. As enthusiastic millennialists, they proclaimed that the time of the gentiles was short, and they were perhaps too quick to quote the revelation that said that 'the Lord willeth that the disciples and the children of men should open their hearts, even to purchase this whole region of country, as soon as time will permit" (The Story of the Latter-day Saints, p. 83).
Smith's leadership didn't help ease the tension. For instance, when First Counselor Sidney Rigdon gave a fiery "Fourth of July Oration" (1838) that threatened the state of Missouri with what he called a "war of extermination," Smith made this speech into a pamphlet. Also adding to the Missourians distress were the rumors of Mormon "Danites," a secret band of Mormon hit men known to intimidate non-Mormon "Gentiles" and LDS dissenters.
The acts of violence brought against the Mormon settlers and the fact that the Mormons felt they would not receive proper redress compelled them to retaliate. Writes LeSueur,
"Although Mormon military action was generally initiated in response to reports of violence, the Mormons tended to overreact and in some instances retaliated against innocent citizens. Their perception of themselves as the chosen people, their absolute confidence in their leaders, and their determination not to be driven out led Mormon soldiers to commit numerous crimes. The Mormons had many friends among the Missourians, but their military operations undercut their support in the non-Mormon community" (The 1838 Mormon War in Missouri, p.4).
LeSueur believes much of the blame for the "plundering and burning committed by Mormon soldiers in Daviess County" can be laid at the feet of Joseph Smith himself.
I have heard Latter-day Saints justify these actions by saying the frustrations experienced by the Saints would seem to warrant retaliation. While I may sympathize with their desire to "respond in kind," we must keep in mind that in doing so the moral high ground is lost. Once you lower yourself to the level of your enemy, you can no longer claim to be guiltless in the situation. This, unfortunately, is what many Mormons do.
Attempts to get along in Missouri proved fruitless. Both sides blamed the other, and each claimed to be the defender rather than the aggressor. The violence came to a head in late 1838 when a group of Missouri militia, led by Captain Samuel Bogart, moved through Ray County disarming Mormon settlers and ordering them to leave. Reports circulated among the Mormons that Bogart's men had burned and plundered several Mormon homes in their two-day march. Though there is no evidence to support this claim, LeSueur writes that it was readily believed by Mormon leaders (p.133).
On October 24, two Mormon spies were captured by Bogart's men and taken to their camp on Crooked River. In response, a band of over 50 Mormons, led by LDS Apostle David Patten, engaged in a firefight with Bogart's men. When the Mormons drew their swords and charged the camp, the militia fled, leaving one dead and another man wounded. Patten himself was mortally wounded in the battle. Two Mormon soldiers, coming upon the wounded and unconscious militiaman by the name of Samuel Tarwater, mercilessly mutilated the man's face with their swords and left him for dead.
When listing the atrocities brought against the LDS people in Missouri, the massacre at Haun's Mill always seems to come to the forefront. Speaking of the persecution faced by Mormons in the past, LDS Apostle Bruce R. McConkie wrote:
"We have staggered under the iron fist of persecution during our whole latter-day history, and we know that hatred and ill will and death will continue to be spewed out upon us until the coming end of the world. We have been driven and scourged and slain; the blood of our prophets stains Illinois; at Haun's Mill the innocent blood of the martyrs for truth cries unto the Lord of Hosts; and on frozen and desolate hills, across half a continent, lie the lonely graves of suffering saints who chose death in preference to the creeds of compulsion of a decadent Christendom" (A New Witness for the Articles of Faith, pp. 656-657).
McConkie's dramatic rhetoric fails to take into account the fact that the Haun's Mill massacre took place just one week after the battle of Crooked River. Quinn writes:
"A generally unacknowledged dimension of both the extermination order and the Haun's Mill massacre, however, is that they resulted from Mormon actions in the Battle of Crooked River. Knowingly or not, Mormons had attacked state troops, and this had a cascade effect upon receiving news of the injuries and death of state troops at Crooked River, Governor Boggs immediately drafted his extermination order on 27 October 1838 because the Mormons 'have made war upon the people of this state.' Worse, the killing of one Missourian and mutilation of another while he was defenseless at Crooked River led to the mad-dog revenge by Missourians in the slaughter at Haun's Mill" (Origins of Power, p.100).
The Mormons would eventually be forced to leave Missouri and settle in Nauvoo, Illinois. Controversy, however, would not disappear. When Smith became the target in a newspaper known as the Nauvoo Expositor, he ordered the destruction of the press. This action caused no small disturbance, and in order to insure order, Smith called out his standing army (The Nauvoo Legion) and placed the city under martial law. Illinois Governor Ford felt the only way the problem could be solved was by a trial to be held in Carthage, the county seat. Although Smith was in the process of fleeing to the west, he was persuaded by friends to turn himself in. A gripping tale of persecution and unjust imprisonment is told during the tour of the Carthage Jail. The guide tells how Joseph Smith claimed that he was going to Carthage as a "lamb to the slaughter" (D&C
135:4). However, such a description of Joseph Smith's final moments is hardly close to the truth, as John Taylor's account in volume seven of the Documentary History of the Church shows:
"Elder Cyrus H. Wheelock came in to see us, and when he was about leaving drew a small pistol, a six-shooter, from his pocket, remarking at the same time, Would any of you like to have this?' Brother Joseph immediately replied, `Yes, give it to me,' whereupon he took the pistol, and put it in his pantaloons pocket. The pistol was a six-shooting revolver, of Allen's patent; it belonged to me, and was one that I furnished to Brother Wheelock when he talked of going with me to the east, previous to our coming to Carthage I was sitting at one of the front windows of the jail, when I saw a number of men, with painted faces, coming around the corner of the jail, and aiming towards the stairs. The other brethren had seen the same, for, as I went to the door, I found Brother Hyrum Smith and Dr. Richards already leaning against it, They both pressed against the door with their shoulders to prevent its being opened, as the lock and latch were comparatively useless. While in this position, the mob, who had come upstairs, and tried to open the door, probably thought it was locked, and fired a ball through the keyhole; at this Dr. Richards and Brother Hyrum leaped back from the door, with their faces towards it; almost instantly another ball passed through the panel of the door, and struck Brother Hyrum on the left side of the nose, entering his face and head. At the same instant, another ball from the outside entered his back, passing through his body and striking his watch. The ball came from the back, through the jail window, opposite the door, and must, from its range, have been fired from the Carthage Greys, who were placed there ostensibly for our protection, as the balls from the firearms, shot close by the jail, would have entered the ceiling, we being in the second story, and there never was a time after that when Hyrum could have received the latter wound. Immediately, when the ball struck him, he fell flat on his back, crying as he fell, `I am a dead man!' He never moved afterwards. I shall never forget the deep feeling of sympathy and regard manifested in the countenance of Brother Joseph as he drew nigh to Hyrum, and, leaning over him, exclaimed, `Oh! my poor, dear brother Hyrum!' He, however, instantly arose, and with a firm, quick step, and a determined expression of countenance, approached the door, and pulling the six-shooter left by Brother Wheelock from his pocket, opened the door slightly, and snapped the pistol six successive times; only three of the barrels, however, were discharged. I afterwards understood that two or three were wounded by these discharges, two of whom, I am informed, died, I had in my hands a large, strong hickory stick, brought there by Brother Markham, and left by him, which I had seized as soon as I saw the mob approach; and while Brother Joseph was firing the pistol, I stood close behind him" (pp. 101-103).
Having taken this tour twice (once in 1980 and another in 1998), I noticed that both times the mention of the smuggled gun was left out. In fact, when the subject of the gun was brought up in the 1998 tour by a Christian in the crowd, we were told that it was not smuggled (it was "brought in") and that the shootout was not a "gun battle." This is an incredible game of semantics. The fact that Smith did try to defend himself disqualifies him from being described in the same manner as our Lord during His arrest, trial, and death (Acts 8:32).
After Smith's demise, things would be quiet for a time. Eventually, however, troubles between the Mormons and their Gentile neighbors would resurface. With little hope to see things resolved, plans were being made by the LDS leadership to leave Illinois. On August 23, 1845, a strategy was approved for an expedition beyond the Rocky Mountains. The first company, composed of 143 men, 3 women, and 2 children, would leave in mid-April. Three and a half months later they would arrive in the Salt Lake Valley.
Even with my strong views regarding the errors of the Mormon faith, I will be the first to denounce religious persecution, as it is properly defined, against any people, Mormons included. I say properly defined because many Mormons feel that any verbal disagreement with their faith is a type of persecution. However, it gets a little tiring to hear of Mormons constantly pointing to their 19th Century persecutions as if this is some sort of sign of God's divine approval on the LDS Church. If violence against a certain faith were the only way to determine truth, then certainly the Mormons themselves would have to recognize that our Christian faith was just as viable as theirs. Can a Mormon, off the top of his head, recall when the last Mormon was killed just because he was a Mormon? Certainly we have heard of Mormons being tragically killed while serving missions, but these cases involve circumstances other than true martyrdom (robberies, car accidents, being mistaken for CIA agents, etc). On the other hand, it is not uncommon to hear of Christians around the world who are being killed because they refuse to denounce their belief that Jesus is the Way, the Truth and the Life. While martyrdom seems to be a thing of the past for the Mormons, it is a common occurrence among those who have placed their total trust in the Jesus of the Bible.
No he commanded a legal militia. Consult your constitution. What is amazing is that on the most conservative website online anti-Mormons consistently adopt liberal lies when it comes to discussion of the Mormons. But hey its an open forum. Any other liberal lies you want to promote in open view of your fellow FReepers?
Gov. Boggs and Gov. Ford. Anti-Mormon’s favorite Democrats.
Who "joked" about infanticide?
Don't do that.
The fact is, the baby died of natural causes and it had nothing to do with the people who tarred Smith.
Only someone trying to stretch the facts in order to elicit sympathy that they are not entitled to would do so in order to justify a lecherous man like Smith who abused women and young girls (even as young as 15).
Venus is reflective of the sunlight (the sun is associated with God in the Bible as well). It is a very complex and fitting meaning that early Christians attached to the morning star (inverted pentagram). What is amazing is how well they understood the astronomical properties. The symbolic meaning is touching as Jesus (the morning star) reflects the light of the celestial sun (the Father). Of course the first time it was associated with Satanism was from a defrocked French man of course. Leave it to the Frenchies to slander a Christian symbol so thouroughly that so called conservative (who uncannily keep using liberal arguments) have willingly given their symbol of Christ up. You should be standing up for your own Christians symbol.
Why do you collude with the defrocked Frenchie to promote the later false meaning of the morning star instead of the original Christian meanings. To use my analogy again. What you are arguing is that the rainbow really should be used for gays instead of as a sign of the covenant. Since when do Christians give up their symbols just to try to make Mormons look bad. you should be fighting for your own symbols.
The pdf link at this article is an interesting read. The inverted pentagram was associated with Christ by Constantine (ever heard of him?) and is found on the medal of honor as well. There are many pics in the pdf article linked here www.fairlds.org/pubs/Stars.pdf of the Christian usage over thousands of years of the inverted pentagram. Christian symbol inverted pentagram
The real question is are you going to continue to promote the secular Frenchie version and deny your own Christian meaning just to bash Mormons or are you going to stand unashamed and fight for your own symbols.
2 Timothy 1:8 Be not thou therefore ashamed of the testimony of our Lord, nor of me his prisoner: but be thou partaker of the afflictions of the gospel according to the power of God;
The Chartres Cathedral and Amiens Cathedral displays inverted pentagrams. The book by Yves, "Art of the Christian World: AD 200-1500 A handbook of Styles and Forms" has more.
This link discusses the Christological symoblism The Pentagram
...it should be also noted that they are non-existent in any depiction of the Devil or Satan before Éliphas Lévis nineteenth century Baphomet. [7] There are a number of examples of the pentagram found on buildings of a religious nature in Europe. [13] Notable examples can be seen on gravestones in the Claustro da Lavagem in the Convento at Tomar, Portugal, the monastery of Ravna, Bulgaria and the Church of All Saints at Kilham, Humberside, Yorkshire, England, which incorporates the symbol on the columns which support the Norman doorway. [10] It is indented on the gateposts of the churchyard of S. Peters, Walworth, England, built in 1824. [11] There are also a number of examples in the sketchbook of thirteenth century stonemason, Villard de Honnecourt. [8] Further examples of the pentagrams use in Christian architecture can be found in a large carved inverted star in the centre of the north transept rose window of Amiens Cathedral in France, built between 1220 and 1410 C.E.; a huge inverted five-pointed star on the steeple of the Marktkirche, or Market Church in fourteenth century Hanover, Germany; the numerous inverted stars that surround a statue of Mary and the Christ Child in Chartres Cathedral circa 1150 C.E.; the interlaced star depicted in the "Berthold Missal" drawn in the Benedictine Abbey in Weingarten Germany circa 1225 C.E.; an inverted nativity star in the sculpted capital of a cloister pillar from the twelfth century C.E.; and various Orthodox paintings that illustrate the Mount of Transfiguration.[14]
14. See Martin Hürlimann, French Cathedrals. New York: Viking Press, 1967, p. 149 for Amiens Cathedral; Christian Norberg-Shulz, The Concept of Dwelling: On the Way to Figurative Architecture. New York: Rizzoli, 1985, p. 74 for Marktkirche; Gertrud Schiller, Iconography of Christian Art. Greenwich, Connecticut: New York Graphic Society, 1971, 1, plate 271 for Weingarten; Yves Christe, et. al., Art of the Christian World, A.D. 200-1500: A Handbook of Styles and Forms. New York: Rizzoli, 1982, p. 346; Leonid Ouspensky and Vladimir Lossky, The Meaning of Icons. Boston, Massachusetts: Boston Book and Art Shop, 1952, p. 213; Engelina Smirnova, Moscow Icons: 14th-17th Centuries. Oxford: Phaidon, 1989, figure 121; V. N. Lazarev, Moscow School of Icon Painting. Moscow: Ishkusstvo, 1971 for Orthodox paintings.
When the temple was built (and the Logan Temple which also has inverted stars) Mormons openly declared the Christ centered meaning of the stars (and published its meaning in the local newspapers of the day). Symbols mean what we (or God has attached to them). It is interesting that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, which claims to be a restoration of the primitive Church of Christ, is the one who has the correct meaning of the early symbols while you have adopted and legitimized the defrocked Frenchman's version.
Mormons like this symbol as well. Care to have a go at it and say Mormons are gay now as well?
ping to 204
thought you might like #204
Like I said your version doesn't even square with the mobs own accounts. They invaded the home (illegally) pulled Joseph Smith from his bed. Tore the baby out of his arms. Pullled him outside and beat and tarred and feathered him. The baby was left on the floor exposed to the winter cold through the open door. The baby died soon after. The mobsters were proud of the fact and openly bragged about it. Except the Doctor who seemed to regret being brought along. The mob included a Baptist minister but IMO, out of the crowd the Doctor may be the only one who has any claim on the title Christian.
Under any legal state the mob could be charged with murder. Look it up or talk to a criminal prosecutor about it. Heck, there are probably a few hanging around on FR you could ping.
Its called the "felony murder rule" and is on the books in every jurisdiction in the united States. Look it up wii has a good explanation of what it is. In the commission of a felony disregard for life that results in the death of the participant whether intentional or not is considered murder and is a capital crime. Besides as much as you take the opposing liberal non conservative side on this legal matter you wouldn't pass a Solomon stlye test. There is no way in heck you would allow your infant to be so killed out of the wanton disregard displayed by the mob.
What really amazes me is that you so unashamedly argue for the felony murder of the infant. Your posts read like a liberal defense attorney trying to get their criminal off the hook. Go ahead have at the last post.
wii=wiki= wikipedia
Bending and twisting facts, and braking the law, are liberal traits.
Nice try though.
You talk about the Constitution, so let's look at it, the Second Amendment specifically:
"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed".
Hum, I wonder why the Founding Fathers (those liberal hacks /s) put in this specific language:
A WELL REGULATED MILITIA
Could it be that they thought roving personal armies attacking fellow Americans over the least little disagreement would be a bad thing?
There is a reason that a Mayor has to call the Governor of a state to activate a national guard unit, even if it is based in his own city and staffed by its citizens. There is a reason a nation guard unit commander cannot just muster his men because he doesn't like the fact parking tickets went up in price.
An activated militia operating without the command of the Governor is extra legal, even by, and especially by, the US Constitution. It is the first step to rebellion, and a treasonous act (oddly, what Smith was charged with).
So endeth the lesson for today.
Oh!
Get OUT of the city!
If I had known how much FUN is was, living out in the country, I would have moved YEARS - no DECADES - ago!
Gov. Boggs and Gov. Ford. Anti-Mormons favorite Democrats.
_____________________________________________
I know you are not talking about me...
I am not for the Democrats then or now..
I’m for the Republican political platform of the time...
The Twin Pillars of Evil...
Slavery of the Africans and the white slavery trade of polygamy amongst the anti-Christians AKA the mormons...
I, like many others in my state, did not like the Democratic Governor we once had. However we still obeyed the rules and did not seek to overthrow him but getting some of our local national guard guys together...
It doesn't matter what party a politician belongs to, we still follow the law.
Unfortunately, Elsie, I had significant problems making a living in the country. I was trying to support a wife, four kids, some foster kids three dogs, two cats and a hundred fifty thousand (more or less) honey bees.
These days I’m down to a wife, a grandchild and three dogs. Nowhere near as much fun.
But probably a LOT easier to find your tools!
No, all my tools got stacked at the bottom of the pile in the garage, topped off with everyone else’s junk. I handed off the bees to some other folks in the co-op, along with the equipment. Still have about four gallons of honey.
What anti-mormon site? It’s an apologetic site, as far as I can tell.
I posted a link, instead of the text of the ritual (and the secrete “Adamanic,” handshakes, and all) because I understand Mormons go the gnostic route and want to keep “how to get into heaven” temple ritual secret.
Would you prefer I just post the information here?
Also, if you want to post anything you want about Christians, feel free. Christians, like the true Christ, have nothing to hide, theology-wise.
Dear TTR, I am having too nice a day to want to get into a theological or otherwise argument with you. Please take it seriously and to heart when I say to you that I love you as a friend and want you to have just as wonderful a day as I am having. I would rather talk about families, farms and critters. Have you ever seen one of your favorite dogs chase a deer across the road, and then a minute later seen the deer chase the dog back across the road? I have.
You should have no problem keeping sweet! ;^)
Some days are like that.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.