Brass tacks discussion on Islam

[Jim Robinson]

Ok, let's get down to brass tacks.

How long has the Islam religion been around and have they always been so hateful and violent (like so many of them are today)?

I believe they claim to be direct descendants of Abraham but I also believe that Abraham was a favorite of our one true Judeo-Christian God, and was the father or grandfather of the Jewish and Christian religions.

I have a hard time believing that our loving Judeo-Christian God is also the Islam God, Allah, whose Muslim followers seem to be so misplaced.

Haven't the warlike Muslim tribes fanned out and violently conquered every nation in their 1400 year path of conquest?

Did God command them to conquer and dominate the entire world? Did he command them to demand infidels to submit, convert or die?

Who and what are these people and who is Allah?

This Muslim violence seems to have been going on worldwide for at least 1400 years.

Could it be that Islam IS the enemy (despite Obama's many denials)?

[FourPeas]

Have a nice day.

[CodeToad]

To Mad Mo and his Koran, all things belong to a god he named Allah, and anyone that denies this is subject to being killed. Pure and simple. It is the basis of their savage ways.

[amorphous]

Could it be Islam itself?

Yes, that's exactly what it is.

It's not the people themselves, per sey. It's the "teachings" handed down by Mohammed. It's also not productive to trace "genealogy". That doesn't have much to do with anything, after millenniums of interbreeding. Even the Jews, during the time of Joseph in Egypt, were known to travel to the land we now call Syria seeking brides, because of their legendary beauty.

We fight this based on ideology and based on the words of the Almighty - not based on a mockery or fake substitutes, or nationalities. And woe to those who do too much killing. Let's attack the other front as well, our own sins of immorality and slaughter of the unborn.

Don't count on help from above, if we do anything less. Count on maybe worse. Following the word of God and in deep consultation with him, is how our founders built this nation - once a golden cup in the Almighty's hand.

[amorphous]

Apologizes if I seemed to frank. Just getting down to brass tacks.

You have good day too.

[Mogger]

I’ve never believed that Obama is a Muslim, per se.

I believe he’s a humanist/atheist, but that before becoming such, he was probably a practicing Muslim, though not at all fanatical or even much interested in it.

That makes sense, and there's a high chance you are right.

At this point, there's no way to really know.

[mkjessup]

Amen. I'm beginning to see who the enemy really might be? Could it be Islam itself?

Is there really such a thing as "radical Islam?" Or is the basic premise of Islam itself completely radical and incompatible with Judeo-Christianity?

Yes to both Jim. It has already been established that Islam denies the fact that Jesus Christ is the Son of the Living God, and Islam teaches that Jesus was NOT crucified (denying he was crucified and resurrected), and that is addressed in 1 John 4:3 which states "And every spirit that confesseth not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh is not of God: and this is that spirit of antichrist, whereof ye have heard that it should come; and even now already is it in the world."

God's Word could not be more clear. It is the spirit of antichrist that refuses and denies the Divinity of Christ. So far as Islam is concerned, I would make the distinction that for millions of Muslims who effectively deny Christ in favor of Mohammed, that many of them are 'benign' in that they simply believe the Koran which contains the teachings of Mohammed, and they might not be prone to violence. However millions more ARE inclined to become violent, to engage in jihad, to seek the deaths and destruction of all infidels and all who do not submit to Islam.

But even those 'benign' Muslims cannot be fully trusted, for just like cancer, no one can predict when a benign tumor will suddenly become malignant and exhibit aggressive and destructive behavior.

So I would agree with you that ALL of Islam is theologically incompatible with Christianity, for if they deny Christ, then they are by default, antiChrist.

(That is not to say that in a geopolitical sense, that certain Islamic regimes cannot co-exist with Christian nations (Jordan and Egypt come to mind), and before the mullahs took over in Iran, the Shah was a great Islamic (but secular) ally to the U.S., and in fact had cordial relations with Israel as well.)

I think it is safe to say that if we stand with the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (which is the true bloodline of Jesus of Nazareth, the Christ), that we stand with righteousness, which is NOT what any Muslim can claim for their own warped and deluded beliefs.

[Maudeen]

What about ole Pat Boone and his wife

[caww]

What about them?...they mean nothing to me.

[Maudeen]

They frequent the Jim Bakker Show.

[caww]

Which means?

[caww]

Which means?

[SunkenCiv]

Note: this topic is from 11/18/2015. Thanks JimRob.

This looks like a good choice for weekly digest ping, though a bit early.

Merry Christmas!

the Birmingham Koran keyword:

• Inside the abandoned City of Libraries
• 'Birmingham Koran' fragment could shake Islam, carbon-dating suggests it is OLDER than Muhammad
• Oldest Koran 'Destabilises' Islamic History, Scientists Say It Pre-dates Mohammed
• The BBC Really Wants You To Believe The Qur'an Is Authentic [Will bend truth to convince you]
• 'Oldest' Koran Fragments Found in Birmingham University
• The Yemeni Koran
• Higher Criticism of the Koran Resisted
• What is the Koran?

more sidebars:

• How Timbuktu's manuscripts were smuggled to safety
• NBC News Covers For Muslims' Vicious Destruction of Non-Islamic Artifacts
• Mali: Timbuktu Locals Saved Some of City's Ancient Manuscripts from Islamists
• Timbuktu mayor: Mali rebels torched library of historic manuscripts
• Timbuktu mayor: Mali rebels torched library of ancient manuscripts
• Islamists in Mali renew attacks on Timbuktu tombs
• Timbuktu mausoleums "destroyed"
• Islamists destroy 2 more tombs in Mali's Timbuktu
• Islamist rebels destroy UNESCO World Heritage sites in historic Mali city of Timbuktu
• Mali: Islamists destroy Timbuktu heritage sites
• The Rush to Save Timbuktu's Crumbling Manuscripts
• Libraries in the sand reveal Africa's academic past
• Libraries in the sand reveal Africa's academic past
• From the Desert, a Wellspring of Ancient Manuscripts

[gleeaikin]

There were many arguments in early Christianity over the existence of the Trinity and other doctrines. Constantinople and Alexandria were significant strongholds of distinct doctrines. Finally the emperor Constantine decided that Christianity would be a useful unifying doctrine for the Roman Empire. He told the Christians to decide on one doctrine (Google “Nicea”)and after the attending Bishops voted, then declared that this was the official doctrine for the Empire.

Since then there have continued to be a number of interpretations (heresies) of the nature of God, Jesus, salvation, heaven, hell, etc. These arguments have sometimes become so severe that hundreds of thousands of people have died because of the wars engendered. The Islamic world is now going through what the Christian world went through 300 to 500 years ago. Unfortunately, the doctrine being sent far an wide through the Islamic world is the Wahabi one, which arose in the most primitive backward area of Saudi Arabia.

As much as possible we should let them fight it out among themselves. Intervene mainly when extreme versions like ISIL gain power and try to invade other areas. ISIL is doing a really good job of pixxing off most of the major countries of the world. Good!! Let the US, China, Russia, etc. focus on fighting ISIL instead of each other. Merry Christmas.

[gleeaikin]

I believe he is a humanist/atheist/agnostic/deist which or how much of each, who knows. His early school years were in Indonesia which is predominantly Muslim, but a milder variety than the Saudi kind. I don’t know if when he was a child over 40 years ago the Saudis had started financing their Wahabi based madrassas throughout the Islamic world. Then he was moved to Hawaii and lived with grandparents. IS there any information on whether they were agnostic/atheist like his mother/father?

[gleeaikin]

What did your bible course do about the two different stories of God’s creation of man and woman. According to the one, God formed man and woman out of the earth/mud but in the second version forms woman out of the rib of Adam. The first interpretation suggests the equality of man and woman, but the second version which is the one widely taught in patriarchal Christian settings shows the subordination and/or inferiority of woman.

[gleeaikin]

In the madrassas and I suspect other Islamic schools, almost the only thing taught is the Koran, and it is taught and mostly memorized in Arabic even if the local language is not Arabic. What with praying and prostrating 5 times a day, and following all the many rituals and rules of behavior prescribed, the poor little kids are totally brain washed by the time they are 8 or 9 years old. In this country we should be observing what is taught to American Muslims in Mosques. If they are recommending killing and other illegal activities, then they should be charged with contributing to the delinquency of minors and legal steps taken.

[To Hell With Poverty]

No no, Eve is, according to Adam himself, “flesh of my flesh and bone of my bones.” That and the fact that she was taken from his side, not the feet or back which might suggest a lower status, reveals that she was meant to be of equal value to him, not beneath or behind him. They were to tend the garden side by side.

[gleeaikin]

But doesn’t it enhance women’s status to have been created simultaneous with man from the same soil? Go to your bible and read the two different versions.

[amorphous]

If they are recommending killing and other illegal activities, then they should be charged with contributing to the delinquency of minors and legal steps taken.

Agree, but a better solution would be to outlaw Islam, which is a cult - NOT a religion.

Cult - "Secretive group that brainwashes its members into engaging in obscene and harmful practices for the sake of a charismatic leader [Mohammed]."

Religion - "Method of thought that is meant to give meaning to man's life by putting him in communion with a higher power through stories, rituals, and beliefs."