Posted on 08/02/2009 1:35:53 AM PDT by rxsid
Edited on 08/06/2009 12:10:02 AM PDT by John Robinson. [history]
Attorney Taitz filed a NOTICE OF MOTION AND MOTION to Expedite authentication, MOTION for Issuance of Letters Rogatory for authenticity of Kenyan birth certificate filed by Plaintiff Alan Keyes PhD.
http://www.orlytaitzesq.com/blog1/ (site has been the target of hackers, proceed with caution — John)
BUMP for the truth.
You were supposed to want to copy the text, paste it into Word, and have the luxury of searching for text. It was no data dump. I did it so that people who were less inclined to look for Wong themselves might actually read the majority decision.
Yes indeed. As we know his mother was too young to convey “citizenship” to him if born outside the U.S.
Dual citizenship would have been an interesting question for SCOTUS, but nobody wanted to do it.
The idiocy of the situation is really starting to get to me.
We can send a man to the moon, but we cannot determine who is eligible to be our president.
That, my friends, is truly INSANE.
There is/was some confusion that Orly only submitted to the court the image of the Kenyan Registration of Birth as exhibit 'A', but she must have the real hard copy of it. If the court did accept images of documents as evidence, then one could as easily submit for court authentication Barack Obama's COLB just the same. ...That would nice. ;-)
No. Former Reagan Attorney General Edwin Meese was the editor who oversaw the conclusion of the many Constitutional scholars who created The Heritage Guide to the Constitution, which apparently runs contrary to your so far baseless assumption.
So, the English had natural born subjects in the relevant period.
As were the American colonists who inherited and adapted the British Common Law. So your accusation against me was both false AND irrational.
It was a Navy base, and how do you know he was born in Colon. Forged birth records were around before B. Hussein you know, and a quick look shows the "long form" Certificate to be fake, while the abstract is likely also fake.
McCain and his mother, who should know, maintain he was born on the Coco Solo Naval Base. Yes, I know they didn't have a hospital, but so what? In 1936 home births were still common in the US, let alone on US Naval Base. The father in law of the mother to be was an Admiral. The Doctor, and there was one at the Base, *would* make a house call. He probably did so routinely. He had a dispensery to work out of but in those days, birth at home was pretty much the "default". I know that while the hospital I was born in (in '49) was pretty much complete by 1930, their first birth was not until 1942, just 7 years before my own.The other, then smaller, hospital in the town also did not "do births" in the 1930s, AFAIK. And this was in the state capital and second largest city in the state.
The McCain birth certificate, one long form, one short, are likely as fake as B.H.O.'s COLB.
And how many types of born citizens are there? And how many types of naturalized citizens are there? It's not as if, by mentioning born and naturalized, this Amendment enumerated the only allowed types of citizenship. There clearly are citizens naturalized by statute. There are naturalized citizens who undergo a process of naturalization. There are citizens born of nonresident aliens, who are not anything but citizens per the plain language of the Amendment. There are citizens born overseas of citzen parents, per the language from 1795. There are citizens born on US soil of citizens, who are natural born citizens.
The 14th extended the rights and obligations of citizenship to former slaves. It did not in any way redefine the requirements for eligibility to the office of President.
Wong Kim Ark was not found to be a natural born citizen. Show me where the decision states that he was. You can't, because he wasn't.
Therefore, there was nothing in Ark to "supercede" Happersett. What is problematic for your contention, regarding the purported impact of the 14th, is that Happersett provides a definition for the term natural born citizen that is not conducive at all, to such a contention. Two citizen parents, plural, born of the soil, and never in doubt.
I’ve just read about half of 12 U.S. 253, and I cannot see the relevancy of that case to natural-born citizenship. What am I missing?
If I never see another lol :) on FR again, I’ll die a happy woman....
I agree, and after having destroyed my eyesight reading not only this thread, but everything elsr from here to Zanzibar, I am putting all but one egg in this basket.
I am saving the last one for breakfast.
Correct. The dicta which much of the opinion is made up of in Wong Ark is latched onto by the he is a natural born citizen crowd. And you have to wade through the dicta to find the 'core legal reasoning' that supports the holding of the majority opinion.
The U.S. Code tells us who is a citizen at birth!!!!
“There are citizens born on US soil of citizens, who are natural born citizens.”
Provide me with an undisputed authority on that statement, and I will be delighted.
The 14th says nothing about presidential eligibility, yes. But it does say there are two kind of citizens. Born and naturalized. If you are not BORN a citizen, you must be naturalized. Wong held that if you are BORN in the U.S., you are a citizen at birth. The 14th Amendment says there are two kinds of citizens: born and naturalized. On or off. That’s it. Anyone not BORN a citizen (and the U.S. Code tells us who IS born a citizen) must be naturalized. How many ways there are to be naturalized is totally irrelevant.
Citizen at birth and natural born citizen and native-born citizen are used interchangeably by the Supreme Court.
Look, if you are are a citizen at birth, you cannot be a naturalized citizen, right. So if that’s true, that is, if you are not a naturalized citizen, then there’s only one other kind you can be, according to the 14th Amendment. And that other kind is BORN. And if you are born a citizen, you must be natural born.
The statute says if you are born in the U.S. you are a citizen at birth.
If citizen at birth does not mean natural born, then something is very wrong. This is insane.
The 14th Amendment leaves us with no other choice. There are no “native” and “natural born” or “citizen at birth” according to the 14th Amendment. There are just BORN and NATURALIZED.
NO OTHER CHOICES.
If “natural born” is SUPPOSED to REALLY mean something else, then someone had better say it, because right now it does not mean that at all.
The American colonists revolted against England, and were particularly chafed by the monarchy. The Founders were known to be highly impressed with The Law Of Nations, it was being cited as early as 1764 by Samuel Adams, John Adams and James Otis, the framers were in possession of it at the Philadelphia Convention, numerous signers of the Constitution quoted it, several quoting specifically from the natural born citizen definition provided therein, and the first Chief Justice of the Supreme Court, John Jay, was the very person who suggested that the natural born citizen requirement be inserted into the Constitution prior to ratification, and he cited Vattel in his own decisions as Chief Justice.
So, if you prefer to be governed by feudal concepts of citizenship under a monarchy, go right ahead. I'm still a sovereign citizen, natural born of the soil and of two citizen parents, which is the understanding of the term that multiple individuals involved in creating our Constitutional Republic embraced upon the advice of John Jay.
The only mystery and the only vagueness about the term is promulgated and perpetuated by individuals and groups who wish to undermine and eventually abandon the requirement.
DON’T MISS THIS ... I don’t know if “convert” applies exactly, but Kerchner discusses in detail his theory about the birth cert, and mentioned that there would be a decision on his case this week. Also gets into McCain’s status as a citizen.
__________________________________________________
Monday, August 3, 2009
Charles Kerchner, Lead Plaintiff in the Kerchner v Obama & Congress Lawsuit, converts Bill Cunningham into a Birther
Charles Kerchner, Lead Plaintiff in the Kerchner v Obama & Congress Lawsuit, converts Talk Show Radio Host Bill Cunningham of 700 WLW of Cincinnati, Ohio into a Birther.
Hi all.
I waited 1 1/2 hours on the line but got on during the last hour of the Bill Cunningham Show out of Cincinnati, Ohio, on Sunday night, 2 Aug 2009. “Willie” Cunningham was challenging people to give him a credible explanation as to how those two birth announcements got into the Honolulu newspapers if Obama was not born in Hawaii.
So I decided to try and get on the show to explain it to him. It was a long, long wait, but I finally got on in the last 15 minutes of the show.
I finally got on during the last 10-15 minutes of the third hour of his show. Below is the link to the podcast. Use the scroll bar to fast advance to the last 15 minutes of the show if you don’t wish to listen to the whole 3rd hour segment of the show.
((Scroll forward to about 3/4 of the way thru the selection ))
Summarizing what I explained to Willie:
I explained to Willie how those two newspaper advertisements in the Honolulu Advertiser and the other paper have no independent probative value. It’s the garbage in garbage out data effect.
If the birth registration was a fraud perpetrated by the grandmother, then those newspaper filings made by the HI Health Dept to those two newspapers (which was standard practice for all births registered) are therefore fraudulent evidence too. I told him the reason grandma did it was to simply get her new Kenyan born grandson retro-active U.S. citizenship, a valued and desirable thing to have even back then.
Of course grandma when doing this never anticipated that her grandson would grow up to be the President one day and have this fraud and lie by her exposed. But it now is being exposed and that is what Obama is afraid of.
Grandma Dunham in Hawaii was a shrewd banker and business lady and had lots of lawyer friends at her bank and elsewhere to tell her how easy it was to do, i.e., file a phony birth record in Honolulu for her new grandson.
They surely told her the Hawaiian laws were so lax it would be very easy for grandma to do it via a simple mail-in birth registration form. No one from the Health Department ever checked the veracity of the facts for such filings by families back then registering a birth occurring at home, with no witnesses other than a family member.
So over the course of the discussion with Willie, I told him, yes there is probably a birth registered for Obama in Hawaii in the vital records database, but this vital record is a false registration in there, and that I did not believe that Obama was really born there in Hawaii based on the contradictory evidence being provided in Kenya by Obama’s Kenyan relatives.
And thus, Obama does not want the original birth registration documents released because it does not show he was born in any hospital, nor does it show any 3rd party independent non-family member witnesses, and this lack of corroborating evidence in the Hawaii records, will dispute what Obama has been telling everyone, i.e., that he was born in the Kapi’ olani Hospital.
Thus he’d be caught in another lie he’s telling to cover up the real truth. And thus, the testimony in Kenya will gain even more credibility if what Obama is saying happened in Hawaii does not check out via the original birth registration documents.
Willie got it. It sunk in. At the end of my segment with Willie he says he’s converting to a Birther. Maybe Willie will pass on what he’s learned to Hannity and some of his other talk radio friends.
Charles F. Kerchner, Jr.
CDR USNR Retired
Lead Plaintiff
Kerchner v Obama & Congress
For more details on the lawsuit see: http://puzo1.blogspot.com/
P.S. And if you want to help the current advertising and educational project also visit: http://www.protectourliberty.org/
It’s got to be a fatherhood issue.
Barry and his mom and mom’s father are facially related.
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