Posted on 07/02/2004 10:52:00 AM PDT by ahadams2
IMPOSSIBLE TO OVERRATE ILL HEALTH OF ECUSA, SAYS GLOBAL STRATEGIST
By David W. Virtue
BEDFORD, TX- (6/28/2004)--It is impossible to overrate the ill health of The Episcopal Church. The difficulty nowadays is to make a caricature of the institution. The biggest concern is not that the parts are in ill health but the impact it has on those of us who have good health, says a leading orthodox Episcopal leader who travels the globe interfacing with the Global South bishops.
"We [the orthodox] have been tremendously impacted by what is going on," said Canon Bill Atwood, general secretary of Ekklesia, an organization that links First World Orthodox bishops with bishops in the Global South.
"A full page article in a Texas Newspaper said the consecration of V. Gene Robinson had not caused schism. This is nonsense when 21 of the 38 provinces are in impaired or broken communion. That is not schism?"
"These Global South bishops have gone on record saying we will not eat with you [Griswold], we will not speak with you [Griswold], and we don't want your money, and that is not schism?"
Atwood told deputies to the 16th Annual Assembly of Forward in Faith NA that the leadership of the Episcopal Church was trying to say those things are not there, they are not happening.
"But it's a lie, they are happening, and they will continue to happen till Frank Griswold is formally DISCIPLINED by the world's Anglican Primates."
"Orthodox people in the ECUSA should be clear about what is happening and going to happen. If we hand together as Anglicans then the Episcopal Church and its leader Frank Griswold must be disciplined with a minimum 'no voice, no vote.' It is impossible to think otherwise."
Atwood urged his hearers to talk in their families about what fidelity to the gospel means. "When the family is in crisis it is imperative to be clear. Stand up and be accountable, the stakes are very high."
"The direction the Episcopal Church is going is leading people away from Jesus Christ. We are supposed to be leading people to Christ and be transformed by His grace and power. This is an evangelistic imperative; this is a struggle about eternity."
"When you understand this then you know why the Global South is so outraged, and they will not be complicit in one person being lead away from Christ and lead to hell. That is the core and heart of the issue of the Global South," he said.
Atwood pointed to the paper delivered by West Indies Primate Drexel Gomez which pointed to the theological foundations of realignment.
"There are three things that he identifies. The first is that this is a salvation issue. Peoples' eternal souls are being imperiled therefore the wider Anglican Communion cannot be silent."
Atwood said that in the Province of Canada, the promise was made for adequate episcopal oversight, and they said they would provide that oversight, but they haven't. It comes with so many strings, that it is not worth the paper it is printed on. The evidence is that Michael Ingham in Vancouver now wants the properties of the faithful and wants them gone. That is tyranny of the worst sort, he told Virtuosity.
"We tend to focus on the temporal when we should be focusing on the eternal."
Atwood said he had even thought about digging up his parents from a parish that was now revisionist and putting them in more hallowed ground.
Atwood said there are African Archbishops laying down their lives for the gospel.
"Bishop Objwan in Northern Uganda was recently kidnapped by members of the Lord's Resistance Army. His livestock was stolen his property ransacked. He was rescued by an anti-guerrilla forces in Uganda. He was beaten nearly to death. He is not shrinking back from his diocese because he sees things in terms of eternity."
"We can't make our decision on what the outcome of the property will be, but on what the gospels teach and how precious people are."
Atwood said people can change the church. "Like raindrops forming a flood, we can change it one drop at a time. The Anglican Communion is in crisis. The Primates will no longer tolerate Western innovations. There have been attempts to sabotage and hijack the African Church with money and offers of education for African priests in revisionist ECUSA seminaries, but they have failed. Gays love to tell touching anecdotal stories about their lives and how they are changing the course of The Faith, but we have a responsibility to really love them...to say no to behaviors hat dramatically shorten their lives. The debate needs to be about accountability.
Atwood expressed concern about the communion's, four instruments of unity. "These instruments of unity must all step up to the plate or they will no longer continue to be the yardstick of the life and health of the communion. They have lost their moral ground to be called instruments of unity.
"What is going to happen? It is impossible to say for sure. The Episcopal Church should repent and at the minimum given 'no voice no vote.' The ECUSA needs to return to the faith once delivered. What happens next...let it be written let it be done."
Atwood said the signs are terrifying. "It is agonizing to discipline, but it must be done. If the commission comes through with tremendous resolve then the communion will survive. If it doesn't go through and ECUSA is still defined as a constituent member then the communion as we know it is finished."
"The Global South bishops see the issue in simple terms. It might seem bad and schismatic, but they will not pitch their future with ECUSA, the gospel is too important to leave in the hands of revisionist diocese, who have no gospel."
Atwood said the Global South bishops are looking to the Network rather than 815 2nd avenue (ECUSA's national headquarters) as they way forward. "They will affiliate with the Network."
"What happens if the communion or Rowan Williams are insufficient in their solutions, or they speak sufficiently and ECUSA refuses to repent, there will be a formal separation with many provinces going their own way and forming a new communion."
"It is incredibly costly leadership. The question must be asked; Where is your hope? If you have it fixed in a bishop or a priest you have it all wrong. Our only hope is God."
"ALL WE CAN DO NOW IS WAIT AND PRAY."
END
Ping.
what really stands out is the complete lack of leadership from the AofC...it's a ceremonial title to a large extent, but it will NOT survive this crisis in its existing format..what does that portend for the worldwide communion?
I think there's a fundamental problem with this approach -- it says that if science can find a way to extend the average lifespan of a homosexual beyond some (arbitrary) duration, then homosexuality suddenly becomes "OK."
That clearly doesn't work.
One difficulty we face is that we orthodox have a very difficult time articulating exactly what it is about homosexuality that we oppose. Yes, Scripture says "don't do it," but that does not help us answer those who ask "why not?"
The booklet True Union in the Body attempts to address the questions on a theological level, and its arguments are pretty good. But high-minded theological tracts don't really seem to work when a good friend lets it be known that he's a practicing homosexual.
I think this sort of scenario points out our major weakness on this issue: we don't do a good job of saying, on a person-to-person level, why this issue matters at all. We can stomp our feet and point to Scripture and call it a sin, but why is it different from other sins?
I think a better approach has to deal with the fundamental "disordered-ness" of homosexual desire and practice. It's not what God would have us do -- simple physiology lets us know what He intended.
That still doesn't help much with how we apply that knowledge, though. Do we allow practicing homosexuals in the church doors? Do we allow them to be baptized or confirmed? What do, or don't, we allow homosexuals to do with regard to the Church?
I think the "legal" answer is that we do nothing which legitimizes the practice of homosexuality -- we can't bless a disordered sexuality (of any sort), so "gay marriage" is taken care of. Celibacy for homosexual priests is probably OK -- and the general requirements for sex within marriage takes care of the rest.
As to the interpersonal aspect -- I think we have to love homosexuals as humans, feel sorry for their disorder, and pray that they can work past it. What we can't do, is let them attempt to legitimize their disorder.
The status of the ABC is in the hands of Rowan Williams. Rowan Williams could end this crisis tomorrow, simply by saying in public that the ECUSA and Canada have departed from Anglican teaching, and need to return to them. His problem is that he cannot surrender his personal views for the (percieved) good of the Communion.
What it portends is that the center of gravity of the Communion shifts to the Global South. Drexel Gomez or (less likely) Peter Akinola becomes the head of the new Anglican body, and the American, British, and Canadian churches are left to wither and die.
Orthodox parishes and dioceses realign somehow with the new body, while the ECUSA probably maintains its assets and gathers in all of the property.
having the status of the ABC in Williams' \hands is abotu a useful as having it held by the Venus de Milo..the gravity of the worldwide communion has already shifted..my quesry was more to the questio of whether or not the AofC as an institution, disappears...
The answer to your question for me is this. Everything in the bible that prescribes behavior does so for our benefit, not our detriment. God has given us a handbook on how to live our lives that allows for the greatest freedom with the greatest joy possible. He would not give us laws and rules that hurt us. So, when it comes to homosexuality I assume the best life a homosexual could lead is to lead a life of celibacy.
Williams has pretty much cooked his goose with his endorsement of the new revisionist "Bible." His claim now that he didn't know what he was endorsing rings hollow.
Williams is part of the problem, and I don't see how the Anglican Communion will survive unless he is removed along with the revisionist American and Canadian bishops. Since that is well-nigh impossible, I think one can write off the Anglican communion, at least in its present form. Perhaps a new communion will arise, led by the Africans and Asians.
I guess I would wonder whether it would even grow as far as the "traditional confines of Anglicanism." Looking at it from a high-church perspective (at least the APCK looks mighty high compared to what I grew up in, though the wife tells me it's nowhere even close to "nose-bleed high"), I'm not sure there is any high church among the African churches. I know less about the Southern Cone.
But I would be ecstatic if they did grow beyond, to somehow absorb and reunite the splintered Anglican faithful.
You wrote "it's a ceremonial title to a large extent, but it will NOT survive this crisis in its existing format..what does that portend for the worldwide communion?"
gee, Ken, thanks for the real softball question there! </irony>
The correct answer for now is that I don't think anyone really knows. A lot depends on what the Eames Commission recommends and what rowan the fuzzy does with that recommendation. If rowan does nothing to punish ecusa and the other wayward Global North groups, then He ends up being in charge of a rapidly dying, apostate, Global North, while the rest of us go with whatever the Global South folks have come up with [at a guess probably some sort of decision making body based on a council of the various Primates - though that is *just* a guess].
If, on the other hand, rowan disciplines the heretics (who are his buddies) he is then left in charge of an Anglican Communion which teaches and practices tradtional Christianity - something he distains...so he'll probably end up resigning.
either way, I personally can see no happy ending for rowan; I'm just wondering if *he* has figured that out yet.
two issues here which require understanding:
There has always been some tension between the Evangelical and Anglo-Catholic wings of the Anglican Communion. There has always been some tension between the high church and low church portions of both Evangelicalism and Anglo-Catholicism. That much is normal. The fact that you have folks who represent both sides of both wings [oh, and all of us Charismatics too] are working together on the same side of this issue is an astounding show of unity in and of itself.
Additionally all of the above groups are represented within the group of Global South Primates, so that's not a problem either.
One of the questions which still exists in my mind is whether the various small Anglican groups (in North America and elsewhere) will be able to set aside their own polarized agendas long enough to make use of the current opportunity for reunion - so far I've only seen APA and the REC really making an effort in that regard...I guess time will tell....
>>Atwood told deputies to the 16th Annual Assembly of Forward in Faith NA that the leadership of the Episcopal Church was trying to say those things are not there, they are not happening.<<
Reminds me of the press conference with "Bagdad Bob" when he was told that the US forces had taken over the airport and tanks were rolling down main street toward him. His response..."This is not true! This is a lie!"
>>The new Anglican Body - Does it remain a wounded rump or, finally free of the liberals, can it grow beyond the traditional confines of Anglicanism to unite high and low churches and incorporate the faithful parishes and congregants of other mainline denominations?<<
There are efforts underway at reuniting the "continuing" Anglican churches. It will not be easy. There are obstacles. The biggest being the Bishops who become corrupted and prideful because of their new found unfettered autonomy. They refuse to submit to any primatial authority or even a titular head of the Church, like the ABC, or to act for the greater good of the worldwide communion. This has been evident in the continuing churches over the past 35 years with terrible consequences.
>>ECUSA probably maintains its assets and gathers in all of the property.
Probably true, and the New Anglican Body needs to address the structural problems which made the present apostasy so financially damaging to the Christian remnant.<<
Most of the continuing churches have addressed this issue by declaring in their canons that the Diocese has no legal interest or control over the temporal affairs of the individual parishes. It's my opinion that the revisionists would never have succeeded in taking over ECUSA had the membership refused years ago to "give" their churches and everything in them to their Bishops. This is how these revisionist bishops keep the membership from leaving the church in droves...extortion. They hold their parishes and missions hostage because the people can't bear to walk away empty-handed.
You wrote "There are obstacles. The biggest being the Bishops who become corrupted and prideful because of their new found unfettered autonomy."
Not all of the bishops, but for some that is definitely one of the problems. Another is that if and when the Continuum reunites with the rest of the Anglican Communion there will be no need for that many purple shirts. Most of the Continuum, due to their geographically dispersed nature, have bishops assigned to cover geographic areas (yeah, I know that's what a diocese is, but most 'normal' dioceses don't cover five or six states). Thus generally they have a higher ratio of bishops to parishes than is common in the rest of the Anglican Communion.
This problem is not insoluable. I'm personally aware of a small Evangelical member of the Continuum which amicably disolved itself with two of the bishops leading the majority of the group into the REC, another taking many of the rest into part of the ongoing 'Convergence Movement' and yet another bishop simply retiring as a bishop in order to take his parish into the AMIA as it's rector. In other words this sort of problem can be dealt with in a godly manner, *if* all concerned are willing to do so. I expect that the current REC/APA merger is causing folks in those groups to deal with the same issues - perhaps when they've finished merging, their actions can be used as a model by the remaining portions of the Continuum.
Don't wish to take the pessimistic view. In fact, I have been greatly encouraged by the talks that have been taking place between folks like Forward in Faith, APA, REC, etc. Hopefully, we can all learn from the past and avoid becoming just a bunch of disparate splinter groups (not only out of communion with Canterbury, but with one another) as happened with the folks who split from ECUSA over women's ordination. All we can do is pray.
In my opinion, the Anglican Church of Canada, ECUSA, and the Church of England, with their present leadership, are all dead and decaying. If, as some say, this is symbolic of the bloated and dying Laodicean church in the Book of Revelation, then I can see why these entities would stick like a fishbone in God's throat and He would vomit them out. There may be hope in trying to bring them to repentance, like what happened in Ninevah after Jonah preached there, but I've don't see it happening now or ever.
What I have seen in less than a year is a miracle. Since the Robinson ordination, I've seen a new western Anglican church rise out of the ashes of the dead one. It's still slow in forming for people like me who want things done instantly but it's come a long way. There is hope in the new Network, in the AMia, in ACiNW/ACiC, in the coming together of some splinter groups against the common apostasy enemy. I've seen some godly anglican leaders rise up and speak, and felt good about what they say in light of the Scriptures. I believe there is a future for strong, Bible-based western anglicanism, lead by godly leaders in the US, Canada, Africa, and Asia. Finally there's some hope. God can pull down the old structures. I don't care anymore about that. It's the new coming together of the 'Anglican diaspora' that's very exciting to watch.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.