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A Reflection on Apostasy
The Diocese Report/DRBlog ^ | Wednesday, August 14, 2002 | Brian Mershon

Posted on 08/14/2002 6:48:27 AM PDT by narses

A Reflection on Apostasy

by Brian Mershon

As a Father of four who struggles continually to try to raise his children in a Catholic culture by homeschooling them who surrounds ourselves with other friends of like mind in this anti-culture of death, I was shocked to received a phone call from a friend in Boston yesterday on a business trip. Just for some short background, he and I as well as a couple of other friends have been discussing the prudence and actual applications of Bishops and even the Pope regarding ecumenical ventures and inter-religious dialogue, especially in comparison to what is actually authorized by Vatican II. This conversation that we have struggled with, and continue to struggle with, entails each of us trying to keep each other on the straight and narrow path of obedience to in faith and morals to the Magisterium. We have read the Vatican II documents on the topic and they appear to be much more measured and "conservative" if you will in their applications than any of the practical gatherings that our U.S. Bishops, the Pope at the two Assissi events, and even Cardinal Arinze with the Buddhists and Hindus, have managed to undertake.

Please understand we are dealing with complex problems, and aside from one of us who is completing his master's in theology, we are mere laymen who have read a lot, and are formed in our faith through reading, prayer and the sacraments, perhaps in a deeper stage than most 20 or 30-something year-old Catholic men in the U.S. today. In other words, our lifestyles and interests are not typical of today's Catholic man.

With that being said, we struggle with obedience to the magisterium of the Church and in wanting to not to exercise private judgment, however, when Cardinal Kasper, who has had his theological bouts with Cardinal Ratzinger, is appointed a cardinal by the Pope and put in charge of "Christian Unity," and further has stated (paraphrased) that the return of confessional Christians to Catholicism is "an outdated concept" and not in keeping with the theology of Vatican II, even those Catholics who are not of the "traditionalist" mindset should have cause for concern to at least question what it is exactly Cardinal Kasper (whom the Pope appointed) has in mind. Now, back to the story of my friend in Boston.

He called me from the airport and had the Boston Globe in his hand, and sputtered, "Did you read this in the Boston Globe today?!!" Being the person who ordinarily sends out articles on topics of the Church to a rather large e-mail list, I assumed he had wandered upon another Priestly scandal story.

"No. What is it?" I enquired. We got cut off, and while he was calling me back, I quickly pulled up the Boston Globe on the web, and there it was staring me in the face with the headline... "Catholics Reject Evangelization of Jews." Well, being a former reporter myself who nows deals with the media professionally, I decided to read the article and figure out what kind of misrepresentation on Church teaching the Globe was printing today. After reading the story, it appeared the headline was accurate, so quickly I went to the U.S. Bishops' website and pulled up the "commentary" on the reflection on some dialogue that had apparently been taking place between some Catholic Bishops (particularly Cardinal Keeler, whom certain homeschooling organizations have relied upon over the years as their representative to Rome--YIKES!) and prominent Jewish leaders in the U.S.

Sure enough, there it was, from our "bishops" the second paragraph states: "Citing the growing respect for the Jewish tradition that has unfolded since the Second Vatican Council, and the deepening Catholic appreciation of the eternal covenant between God and the Jewish people," the Catholic portion of the Reflections says that "campaigns that target Jews for conversion to Christianity are no longer theologically acceptable in the Catholic Church." http://www.usccb.org/comm/archives/2002/02-154.htm . Lots of footnotes, selectively pulled from writings of John Paul II, Vatican II, and of course, Cardinal Kasper. Now, without getting into the history of the claims of individuals within the Church of allegedly forcibly coercing Jews against their will, could this story really be true? My friend called back and we read parts of the article and reflection aloud.

"Steve," I said. "This is the evidence of the apostasy. Our bishops, (at least those who are in accord with this document) have said that Jesus Christ came to earth, was crucified by Jews through a gentile (Roman) political court and leader, and now, it really doesn't matter if the Jews become Catholic because, according to the document, both Jews and Christians are equal in God's eyes." In other words, Jesus Christ came and died on the cross, but did not redeem Israel because Israel did not need redeeming! "Tell that to the Israelites destroyed in the Temple!" said another friend of mine.

Rabbi Gilbert Rosenthal, Executive Director of the National Council of Synagogues, said: "The joint Catholic-Jewish statement on mission is yet another step in turning a new page in the often stormy relationship between the Jewish people and the Roman Catholic Church. Neither faith group believes that we should missionize among the other in order to save souls via conversion. Quite the contrary: we believe both faith groups are beloved of God and assured of His grace. The joint mission statement has articulated a new goal, namely the healing of a sick world and the imperative to repair the damage we humans have caused to God's creations. We believe we are partners in bringing blessings to all humankind for this is god's will."

Steve, on the other end of the phone, was dumbfounded. "I guess this means this battle that faithful lay Catholics face is going to get quite ugly and more difficult if this is what our bishops really think," he said. Silence on both ends...

Ladies and gentlemen, the statement agreed upon by the U.S. Bishops committee and certain Jewish organizations is nothing short of denial of Jesus Christ for salvation and the necessity of his Church as the mediator of salvation. The statement by the Rabbi above, as wonderfully ecumenical and politically correct and harmless as it sounds, is nothing by reformulated Freemasonic principles, condemned multiple times by the Church. This battle for our true Faith has crossed the boundaries of sanity, and it is my hope and belief that the differences between technique and understanding that exists between "traditionalist" and "conservative" Catholics of the Steubenville variety will be resolved and overlooked so that the laymen can collectively struggle protect the Faith itself as at the times of the Arian crisis, along with those Priests and Bishops who still believe in the Great Commission and of the Church's necessity for salvation, and bond together to point out these errors, these heresies... this apostasy to the Bishops themselves.

While many even "traditionalist" Catholics did not like nor appreciate the "We Resist You to Your Face" manifesto that came from some prominent layment directed toward Rome a year or so ago, we lay Catholics must defend our Faith, the entire deposit, against Bishops who no longer believe it is our duty as baptized Catholics to become saints ourselves, and just as importantly, to lead others to holiness through the Church that only the Apostolic Roman Church can provide through the sacraments and prayer. Cardinal Keeler and any other bishops who believe we must no longer evangelize non-Christians must be publicly rebuked by the faithful flock. It is our duty!

Sister Lucia and the apparitions of Fatima warned of this apostasy. It is time for good-hearted laymen to rise up and call for a restoration of traditional Catholicism to all corners and parishes throughout the world!

"Neither faith group believes that we should missionize among the other in order to save souls via conversion. Quite the contrary: we believe both faith groups are beloved of God and assured of His grace." You have got to be kidding me. Forcible conversions against someone's will? Of course not! The Church has never taught in its magisterial capacity that this was acceptable practice. But, "both faith froups are beloved of God and assured of His grace?" What about the prayers at every single Mass in the pre-Vatican II rite that were specifically for the conversions of the Jewish people? Were we really wrong all those years? Were we? Or perhaps are the Bishops wrong now?

Finally, as depressing and "negative" as this may be, it may be time to take Pope Paul VI's warning to heart:

"The tail of the devil is functioning in the disintegration of the Catholic world. The darkness of Satan has entered and spread throughout the Catholic Church even to its summit. Apostasy, the loss of the faith, is spreading throughout the world and into the highest levels within the Church." Pope Paul VI, October 13, 1977, Address on the Sixtieth Anniversary of the Fatima Apparitions.

posted by Brian Barcaro 8/14/2002 01:06:45 PM


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Front Page News; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: catholiclist; ling
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1 posted on 08/14/2002 6:48:27 AM PDT by narses
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To: GatorGirl; tiki; maryz; *Catholic_list; afraidfortherepublic; Antoninus; Aquinasfan; Askel5; ...
Ping.
2 posted on 08/14/2002 6:49:01 AM PDT by narses
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To: narses
"The tail of the devil is functioning in the disintegration of the Catholic world. The darkness of Satan has entered and spread throughout the Catholic Church even to its summit. Apostasy, the loss of the faith, is spreading throughout the world and into the highest levels within the Church." Pope Paul VI, October 13, 1977, Address on the Sixtieth Anniversary of the Fatima Apparitions.

Well, I guess when you finally lose faith in the Church, there's always Jesus. :^D

3 posted on 08/14/2002 6:54:09 AM PDT by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: narses
read vaticanII? try the Bible. You dont need some God franchise to sell you salvation for a tithe and absolution. The Work is done. Get over it. Man can do nothing else. Live.
4 posted on 08/14/2002 7:00:46 AM PDT by galt-jw
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To: narses
Thanks for posting this. This new statement by the bishops puts everything we've been saying the past few weeks in a totally fresh perspective. It is so clearly a radical new doctrine.

5 posted on 08/14/2002 7:04:36 AM PDT by ultima ratio
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To: RedBloodedAmerican
Well, I guess when you finally lose faith in the Church, there's always Jesus. :^D

ex-RC bump ...

Still, the original poster does have a valid point: if salvation is to be found outside of Jesus Christ, then why bother being Christian? Other faiths permit the potent narcotic of self-righteousness and autosoteriology. I'm reminded of Romans 10:1-3, where the apostle speaks of those who, eager to establish their own righteousness, denigrate the righteousness of God in/through/by Jesus.

6 posted on 08/14/2002 7:06:43 AM PDT by TomSmedley
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To: galt-jw
The catholic church getting to be too much these days. I'm going to convert and accept the Lord Jesus Christ as my savior. Trouble is which church to join.
7 posted on 08/14/2002 7:11:34 AM PDT by jjm2111
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To: RedBloodedAmerican
What makes you think this wasn't always the case with those in the Church? Do you suppose devout Catholics don't turn to Jesus daily? If you suppose this, you do not appreciate the faith they practice, despite the hijacking of their Church hierarchy by modernists and heretics.
8 posted on 08/14/2002 7:15:04 AM PDT by ultima ratio
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To: narses
The doctrine that tickles the ear is spreading, and a new form of PC is taking over every area of our lives.
9 posted on 08/14/2002 7:17:18 AM PDT by ladyinred
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To: ladyinred
Yes, I fear exactly that.
10 posted on 08/14/2002 7:20:48 AM PDT by narses
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To: jjm2111
"The catholic church getting to be too much these days. I'm going to convert and accept the Lord Jesus Christ as my savior. Trouble is which church to join."

If your Catholic and you haven't accepted Jesus as your savior, than something's not right, despite what Protestants would insinuate. (no offense meant to Protestants, but a lot of what they say about the RC church is bunk and fluff)

I'm RC, but I've seriously looked into the Orthodox church. It's the only church other than RC who can claim any historical ancestry to the early church. The schism occurred before both Inquisitions and the Crusades, so they don't have the "blood on their hands" most non-RC Christians attribute to Catholicism.

However, its not as easy as just show up, have faith, and read the Bible. Anyone familiar with the traditions of the Catholic church (especially pre VaticanII) compared to the vast majority of Protestant churches will find the Orthodox church on the other end of the spectrum, past the Catholics.

Strangely enough, the Orthodox faith is pretty darn close to that of the RC church (minus the Pope).
11 posted on 08/14/2002 7:26:53 AM PDT by babyface00
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To: ultima ratio
Evangelical Christians believe, from the Bible, that the Second Coming of Jesus Christ will come when Israel accepts Jesus as their Messiah. That is the "trigger" that Jesus is waiting for before He chooses to return.

If you were Satan, what would be your strategy to prevent this? It's not too difficult to formulate one...

First of all, kill all the Jews (via Inquisition and Nazi Holocaust) . Okay, that didn't work...

Next, prevent the re-creation of Israel as a nation, via Pope Pius XII applying political pressure to FDR to NOT let Israel come back to their Biblical Homeland (Here's the link to Pius's letter to FDR --

http://www.angelfire.com/ky/dodone/Pius.html

Okay THAT didn't work... Then, as a last resort, at all costs, keep the Jews from accepting Jesus as their Messiah. by convincing them that they don't NEED to. That's what the Roman Catholic Church is up to nowadays.

The pattern is grossly obvious, but to point it out is to be flamed as a "Catholic-hating bigot".

12 posted on 08/14/2002 7:35:13 AM PDT by berned
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To: babyface00
I've seriously looked into the Orthodox church. It's the only church other than RC who can claim any historical ancestry to the early church.

I know as a Roman Catholic you probably won't agree, but all Protestant churches claim an "historical ancestry" to the early church. The earliest reformers of the 16th Century sincerely sought using the best scholarship of the day, to return the Church to its earliest theological and organizational roots--which by 1500 was very different from AD 100. Those first reformers were thrown out of the Roman church by the very corrupt leadership of the time (the corruption of which is now fully acknowledged by scholars, Roman or not...) and yet they sought hard to REFORM not revolutionize Jesus' Church.

While it is true organizationally only the Orthodox (and perhaps the Egyptian Copts too...) can trace an unbroken lineage of "apostolic succession" like the Roman church... it WAS broken, from Rome...just like those Protestants were later. Even the apostolic succession thing isn't totally exclusive--as recall that Henry VIII's Anglican church kept the same people in power taken from Rome--and can be said to have had that apostolic succession ever since.

St. Augustine's arguments against the Donatists ca. AD 400 pretty well eliminated the vital importance of succession anyway--proving all believers receive grace from Christ Himself--and an unbroken line of godly priests (however desirable that may be...) is not required for our salvation.

13 posted on 08/14/2002 7:55:52 AM PDT by AnalogReigns
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Comment #14 Removed by Moderator

To: ultima ratio
No, I don't suppose that. And my comment was somewhat toungue in cheek. Somewhat. Having grown up in RC Church (St Thomas Moore, Portland, OR) I can attest to my comment. Some will know what I mean, some will likely be offended.
15 posted on 08/14/2002 7:59:45 AM PDT by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: TomSmedley
Yep, valid point.
16 posted on 08/14/2002 8:00:19 AM PDT by RedBloodedAmerican
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To: allend
A nice slection, but you forgot examples of smug, sanctimonious, and self-righteous. On the other hand, since those underlie all the posts you link, maybe you really have covered the waterfront.
17 posted on 08/14/2002 8:09:59 AM PDT by j.havenfarm
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Comment #19 Removed by Moderator

To: RedBloodedAmerican
LOL! Just what command tells us to follow the church? Follow Christ.
20 posted on 08/14/2002 8:27:48 AM PDT by widowithfoursons
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