Peggy Noonan and The WSJ Editorial - It's Time to Revolt!

Red State ^ | June 1, 2007

[Clintonfatigued]

However, now I do not feel alone. Peggy Noonan has a new column up in the Wall Street Journal Opinion Journal. She has clearly said what has been getting me down. I think I knew what was up, but couldn't put a finger on it. I knew it centered around the immigration debate, and the way our congressional leaders are behaving. That sentiment especially includes Mr. Bush too, but when I read this column, I felt like Charlie Brown yelling at Lucy at her Psychology booth when he yells, "That's it!" when trying to identify why he can't get into the Christmas spirit.

Try this clip on for size :

The White House doesn't need its traditional supporters anymore, because its problems are way beyond being solved by the base. And the people in the administration don't even much like the base. Desperate straits have left them liberated, and they are acting out their disdain. Leading Democrats often think their base is slightly mad but at least their heart is in the right place. This White House thinks its base is stupid and that its heart is in the wrong place.

For almost three years, arguably longer, conservative Bush supporters have felt like sufferers of battered wife syndrome. You don't like endless gushing spending, the kind that assumes a high and unstoppable affluence will always exist, and the tax receipts will always flow in? Too bad! You don't like expanding governmental authority and power? Too bad. You think the war was wrong or is wrong? Too bad.

But on immigration it has changed from "Too bad" to "You're bad."

The president has taken to suggesting that opponents of his immigration bill are unpatriotic--they "don't want to do what's right for America." His ally Sen. Lindsey Graham has said,

[jveritas]

AuntB:

Since rollo failed to give me his plan on how to "physically deport" the 1000 illegal immigrants in a housing complex in L.A as I asked him to do in an earlier post, and he agreed that it does not work by saying that we do not have to use it, please put yourself in the place of the officer in charge of this deportation operation and let us see how you are going to do it (TV cameras are still filiming your actions and broadcasting live).

[rolling_stone]

I ask you again why would anyone want to “deport 1,000 illegal aliens from a housing complex in LA?

[jveritas]

It will be much more than 5 cents. The inrease will be like 50%, as this will be on many other products as well. The economy is a chain, you can separate on sector from another. A 20% or more inflation rate on consumer products will cause an economic disaster.

Let me say this and end this conversation because I have to go now, the best you guys can do is to kill the current illegal immigration bill but this will not solve anything, it will not solve the problem of the illegal immigrants who are already here and it will not solve the border security problem. There is no bill that will become a law according to what you and the majority here want, you will remain angry for the rest of your life because of this.

[Political Junkie Too]

If John Smith has a construction firm and hires 12 illegal immigrants from Mexico and you after John Smith fining or jailing him for hiring the illegal immigrants and ask him to fire the illegal immigrants as well, he will lose his business and he will be out of work and his family will suffer as well. Multiply John Smith and his family by a million and here you have an economic depression.

Answer this: after amnesty, do you still expect these small businesses who hire "now documented" former illegal aliens to continue paying below-minimum cash wages under the table, or will the newly documented workers be forced to file W-4's, have income taxes, FICA, unemployment insurance, etc, deducted from their wages? Do you imagine that "documented" wages might put these people into a net-loss vs. what they were receiving via unreported cash wages? Isn't that what "coming out of the shadows" really means?

Or, after amnesty, do you still expect businesses to continue paying slave wages in order to keep the low cost of business that you say they are enjoying now?

-PJ

[rolling_stone]

excellent!

[jveritas]

LOL... because that what many of you guys want: “physical deportation of illegal immigrants”. Why when I gave you this scenario in the previous post, suddenly many of you guys are reluctant to apply the LAWS that are already in the books which call for the “physical deportation of illegal immigrants”? The answer is simple, “Reality trumps everything”.

[investigateworld]

President “Do Wrong”

Posted by investigateworld to MNJohnnie
On Bloggers & Personal 06/02/2007 12:39:54 PM PDT · 80 of 85

Let me explain reality to you. I’ll try keeping it in dollars and cents so you can make the human costs equivalent (if possible).
After the five year waiting period for the 86 Amnesty recipients to collect welfare was over, guess what happened to the local and state government budgets? It got so bad, the Democrat state legislators reached down and took the city’s and county’s portions of traffic fines and forfeitures.

It caught a lot of Sheriff’s Departments that contracted with cities off guard, they were counting on that money for their budgets.

The largest single effect was drunk driving arrests. On Third watch, the patrol folks were expected to have their DUI quota’s made by 9 o’clock in the evening so there would be little or no overtime. In-fact, there was pressure from supervisors to avoid any calls that would generate overtime, the public be damned!

It was never put into writing, but it became policy that any arrest within 3 hours of end of watch would be considered a sneaky way to get overtime(something like $28.00 p/h back then), and the officer’s annual efficiency report would reflect that.

It reduced the number of arrests so badly, the tow truck companies, crooks all, began to be very generous with certain upper management types.

Ugly?

But that’s reality in action. These illegals create far more costs than they do in revenue. All of Bush’s whining and insults can’t change that.

---

Post Reply | Private Reply | To 75 | View Replies
Gotta work today so I can pay my taxes, so forgive the cut and paste job Mr. Jvertias

[Palladin]

...and don’t forget that other lesson from history when the English deported over 20 million Irish over about ten years. They stole their lands, burnt down their homes, loaded them onto the “coffin ships”, headed for Boston, New York, and Australia, and thus solved “The Irish Problem”.

jveritas is not a very well-educated person; is not even an American citizen; has no knowledge of American or World History, and yet he insists on lecturing FReepers who are older, wiser, and infinitely more knowledgable than he.

[rolling_stone]

Like I said you know nothing about law enfocement and are making a straw argument. What makes you think all 1,000 people are illegal? That has to be determined before they can be arrested.

[Palladin]

Good one, and very appropriate for the non-citizens trying to infest this board lately.

[ozarkgirl]

I don’t know why I bother, I guess I just hate to see people spew “facts” that are false. There have been many studies done. And Aunt B is correct. I just grabbed this site because it has the studies listed together and providing back up where to find it. I have seen that study and it may be included here, I just don’t want to waste more time.

Hey, 99% of statistics are made up by the person stating them. You have given several statistics here, not backing up a single one with a source despite repeated calls to cite your back up. Does make one wonder about your “translations”. I didn’t doubt them before but I have to tell you, judging by your lack of back up and false information for what you’ve stated in this thread, I am beginning to doubt.

http://www.fairus.org/site/PageServer?pagename=iic_wagesofagworkers

[jrooney]

If he is not a conservative, (I will put up Roberts and Alito against O’Connor that Reagan gave us on SCOTUS - thus giving us the only victory against abortion that O’Connor was always voting against), then why did Noonan WANT TO WORK FOR HIM AS A SPEECH WRITER?? She is on a vendetta because she was told her services were not wanted. Noonan is a HAS BEEN riding a speech writing job from 20 years ago, who is less of a conservative than GW because she complained of him referencing God in the SOTU speech three years ago. What type of conservative complains of God being referenced? Noonan is a JOKE and a LOSER.

[ozarkgirl]

Also you have attributed words on this thread that people did not say (myself included). Your honesty, in my mind, is in serious jeopardy. I feel I cannot believe anything else you have to say. Oh, and you’ve threatened to sue people (a very liberal tactic) especially on a forum like this. This is AMERICA! We should be able to give our opinion without worrying about foreigners suing us. I absolutely do not understand you.

[Diocletian]

Speaking as an outside observer, isn’t a War supposed to defend a nation’s sovereignty against invasion? Your Commander-in-Chief is ceding your nation’s sovereignty in a time of war by granting amnesty to invaders. Some would call it treason.

[rollo tomasi]

“Man, I already destroyed in one post half of your solution for illegal immigration when you agreed with President Bush that “Mass Physical deportation” will not work.”

Where? Copy and paste please.

For the record, mass physical deportation can work in tandem with strict harboring laws but there are more efficient ways of solving this problem.

History is far from agreeing with your point of view my friend.

"For example in Massachusetts, few months ago, they raided a factory that hire illegal immigrants"

Is the owner of the fish processing plant rotting in jail yet? Please answer the question. If not it does not match the solution being proposed now, does it.

[Political Junkie Too]

I don't know if you know who jveritas is, but I wouldn't use such strong language to impugn his integrity.

jveritas has been doing this country a supreme service that the MSM refuses to do by translating all of the captured Iraqi documents regarding Saddam's WMD programs, that is, before the government shut down the website with the public documents.

-PJ

[rollo tomasi]

Also these raids are meaningless without strict laws attached and SEVERE PUNISHMENT OF THE EMPLOYER/OWNER.

These recent “crackdowns” are probably orchestrated to con people like you into believing “amnesty” is the only solution. Of course unlike you I will admit it’s an opinion not fact but knowing the history of corrupt societies it is not out of the question.

[txrangerette]

SerpentDove:

Thanks for calling me cheap and dishonest. Not.

I see signs of hate in front of me, by the needless ugliness shown to the President and others who have taken the wrong view in this debate, and I call hate.

Why would I try to stifle "dissent"? I TOTALLY OPPOSE THE BILL AND HAVE SAID SO AND SAID WHAT I THINK WE NEED INSTEAD. It isn't dissent that's the problem.

It's hate speech, profane, demeaning, ugly as sin, X rated and the rest. You name it. I've read it. The "F" bomb repeatedly thrown at the President, and bragging about it. Desire to spit in his face if only they could. Kiss my bleep, over and over. Saying if he's impeached, fine. One world order. Daddy's boy. Liar. Traitor. That's "dissent"??? Where? In a DU sewer??

My views on the illegal immigration issue are available here, on this very thread. Here they are:

To: Radix; NordP; jrooney

Radix:

Thanks for your reply. I hope you read that part of my post that states my opposition to the bill. I also have been supporting Duncan Hunter from well before he announced his run for President.

I'm glad you stated that there's no reason to hate anyone over this. Hate is dripping like molten venom from most threads now.

As to your simple point about what's so hard to comprehend about the key word, ILLEGAL,

I'll say this. We need to get things in the right order. A border fence and other measures to secure what needs securing.

After that, there's a problem with what to do since untold millions of people are here who came illegally, originally. I think that's the part that truly flummoxes those who have come up with this bill. There's the additional need for some type of regulated work permits going forward, and what would the details of that be.

They can't seem to grasp that no matter those connected, troubling issues,

they need to do the enforcement until people can see with their own eyes that the government is trustworthy to do it.

Until then, the rest of their talk and bill crafting is just pouring salt on a hemorraghing wound.

[AuntB]

It will be much more than 5 cents. The inrease will be like 50%, as this will be on many other products as well. The economy is a chain, you can separate on sector from another. A 20% or more inflation rate on consumer products will cause an economic disaster.

I'm beginning to think you've paid not one bit of attention to the facts in this debate. I think you know better than what you just wrote and everytime you do it, I'm going to show you the facts. Now, pay attention, I know you're not stupid.

What do you suppose the cost is for the infrastructure to accommodate up to 20 million people aka illegal aliens? New roads, schools, medical facilities, welfare/social services, houses, on and on.....

Now, for the cost of produce.

______________

Without illegal aliens, the price of agricultural products and other goods and services will NOT soar. The definitive study on this subject is the University of Iowa's "How Much Is That Tomato?" The study concludes that 'since labor is such a small component of the end-price of agricultural products (which includes price to the growers, transportation costs, processing /storage costs, grocers' profit, etc.), using minimum wage workers instead of illegal aliens would increase prices of agricultural products by approximately 3 percent in the summer and 4 percent in the winter ... hardly the making of $10 heads of lettuce, $25 hamburgers, $1,000 per night Days Inn hotel rooms like the pro-illegal alien lobby claims.

http://www.theamericanresistance.com/articles/art2004jan04.html

_____

"If you look at strawberries, they're picked right into the little plastic containers," said Martin. "The farmers only get about 18 cents on the dollar for strawberries. If (the consumer) spends $1 on a pint of strawberries, the farmer's getting 18 cents. He gives about one-third of that to farmworkers, so they make 6 cents." So even if the labor cost were to double, that would still only be a 6 cent increase per pint.

Martin's estimate is that if the immigration influx -- currently a net of about 500,000 people per year -- were cut by 40 percent, the average American family would wind up spending about 2.5 percent more on fresh fruits and vegetables.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2006/05/21/MNGFQIVN991.DTL&type=politics

[AuntB]

you will remain angry for the rest of your life because of this.

So, now you can see into the future? You won't even take past history as fact! I'm sorry, Jv, I'd hoped there was a part of you that could be reasoned with. You are one scarry dude. Don't freepmail me again.