Bush circles the wagons as approval ratings slip

The Washington Times ^ | June 3, 2006 | Joseph Curl

[namvet66]

With just five months to go before the midterm elections, President Bush, whose once-faithful base has abandoned him in droves, is turning to the same conservative hot-button issues that won him re-election in 2004 -- homosexual "marriage" and judicial nominees. The president, now fully aware that his plummeting approval ratings could cost the Republicans control of one or both congressional chambers in November, will use his radio address today and a speech Monday to push a constitutional amendment banning same-sex "marriage," just as the Senate prepares to vote on the issue. The crux of his argument is simple: A majority of Americans support the idea that marriage is exclusively between a man and a woman, and activist judges across the country are thwarting the will of the people.

[gathersnomoss]

Thank you for your candid response and first hand report. I am here in Virginia and to be quite frank, I have no idea what you folks are going through next to the border.

I pray for this country virtually every day and for the life of me, I cannot figure out why this country is destined for a social uprising.

History has proven that world powers rarely last as long as America has. I pray that my four girls see a bright future for themselves. I hope that my gut feeling is just a symptom of a negative thought.

This is a frustrating period that to be quite frank came a bit sooner than I thought. Socialism and the multicultural squeeze upon this society may be too much for this country and it's constitution and people.

I have a feeling that unless we see a sudden shift in the direction that this countries government is headed, there may be no turning back. The sad thing is, where can someone take his family to live outside of the US. I have to consider my options.

[Once-Ler]

I'm aware they are Liberal but that's your problem.

No SS, it's all our problem. What's your alternative to the imperfect GOP?

The rats. No thank you.

[SevenMinusOne]

What temporary worker program? There is none now. Bush proposed creating one, not "reforming" any.

What? You are so clearly uninformed it is mind boggling - There is currently several ways for "guest workers" to receive visas to enter the United States legally and work for a specific amount of time - Yearly around 300,000 - 400,000 are given out in total of the current guest workers / temporary worker program.

Absolute foolishness to say one does not exist - The very problem with the current system is there is no effective process at making sure those here on temporary visas either leave..or in finding their whereabouts and deporting them if they don't - A sizable portion of the current 12 million illegals came here on this terribly flawed guest / temporary worker program -

GWB is trying to reform this current system to do such -

You post NOTHING in regard to those who are currently here! - You showed where GWB was talking about reforming the ALREADY in place guest worker program.

My God you don't even know what you are talking! Do you seriously believe we currently don't have any guest worker programs?? (you cannot be serious) -

The situation with the current guest worker program (which you cited) and the situation of the current 12 million illegals that are currently here (and have come in the last 20 years) are two SEPERATE situations now that must be dealt with.

Three situations in total.

1. Border security

2. The current EXISTING terribly flawed guest worker visa / temporary worker program

3. What to do with the illegals that are here now - The current apprx 12 million who have come by one means or another over the last 20 years -

You are terribly confused - You are citing information about what GWB proposed regarding the #2 problem listed above - What his ideas were regarding reforming the temporary worker program! - Of course no where in that proposal did he need to state what he was going to do with the current 12 million illegals currently here (because that is a complete different problem that needs to be addressed).

Furthermore GWB is not proposing making those who come via a new reformed temporary worker program legal - He is simply saying we need an effective and accountable system for those who come here via the guest worker route -

Those GWB is talking giving a path to citizenship are those 12 million who are currently already here....and have come here over the last 20 years (they will have to meet certain requirements, pay fines, etc, etc).

You are terribly confused and surprisingly ill informed for someone who acts as if this issue is so important to you.

[Proud2BAmerican]

Look around FR. Seems like he has reason enough to believe that.

[Proud2BAmerican]

In 2004, illegal alien threats against the American social and political structure was not a campaign issue. Why? Because it didn't happen yet.

The threats against American social and political structure most certainly DID happen prior to 2004; they've been going on a long time. This problem has been DECADES in the making.

[Maynerd]

Bush: Now, it's very important for our citizens to also know that I don't believe we ought to have amnesty. I don't think we ought to reward illegal behavior. There are plenty of people standing in line to become a citizen. And we ought not to crowd these people ahead of them in line.

Most excellent post which bears repeating.

Excepting Harriet Miers I've been a loyal Bush supporter. However, this immigration cluster has turned me against Bush. What's the point of the WOT if the country commits multicultural suicide?

If we had a parlimentary system. Bush would have already lost a no confidence vote and elections would be imminent. Unless he and Rove wake up Bush is an extrmely lame duck served with salsa.

[Plutarch]

You showed where GWB was talking about reforming the ALREADY in place guest worker program.

No, the opposite is true.

In the 2004 Temporary Worker proposal, Bush doesn't mention existing temporary worker programs (e.g. H-1, H-2) whatsoever. He doesn't say he is going to reform them. No, he says he is going to create an entirely new program.

I propose a new temporary worker program that will match willing foreign workers with willing American employers, when no Americans can be found to fill the jobs. This program will offer legal status, as temporary workers, to the millions of undocumented men and women now employed in the United States...

Existing visa programs are generally applied to from outside the US. Bush's temporary program was thus not a "reform" of an existing visa program, but entirely new because it included those 12 million now in the US illegally. Prior to the 2004 election Bush emphasized the temporary status, upon expiration of which the visa holder would need go home, and he would be given financial incentives to do so.

Now that Bush was reelected by conservative votes and energy, Bush has dropped the temporary designation, and cheerleads for the Senate permanent residence immediate for all 12 million. Bush's intent all along was to provide amnesty. He initially dressed it up as a temporary work program that would devolve into permanence under the the next administration. Now, the Senate has provided him the immediate amnesty for which he has longed, and he is falling all over himself to embrace it.

[SerpentDove]

Rove? Guru? HA!

Some guru.

[jammer]

You're correct. That labeling is just ad hominem desperation for the intellectually bankrupt. Woops. I withdraw that (ad hominem). Let's just say that it substitutes for argument of the issues.

[SevenMinusOne]

You are too ill-informed to continue you - And too foolishly wrap up in semantics over the notion of reforming a system or creating a new one (in terms of fixing a problem).

When in 1994 (and before actually) when the GOP congress said we need a new form of welfare (system) did they mean they wanted to create a complete new welfare system (that has nothing to do with those either on the old system or those eligible for the old system in the future?

Of course not -

As I said (and as Rush Limbaugh rightfully says...though he doesn't completely agree with GWB on this issue) GWB has not changed his position on immigration, nor those currently here since 2000 -

There are three issues in this 40 (20) year in the making problem -

1. Border security

2. The current terribly flawed guest / temporary worker programs

3. The situation with what to do with what to do with the current 12 million illegals who are here now (which have come here by one means or another over the last 20 years).

That some of those currently here would fall into a new reformed temporary workers program (during their process to see if they can attain citizenship) is just commonsense....in the terms of GWB wanting to correct the currently terribly flawed guest / temporary worker program....along with at the same time looking for a comprehensive way of dealing with the current 12 million illegals that are currently here -

The new temporary worker program that GWB is proposing would completely address the current policies for which H-1, H-2 visas are given out....and how those people are handled once within our borders.

[isthisnickcool]

The threats against American social and political structure most certainly DID happen prior to 2004; they've been going on a long time. This problem has been DECADES in the making.

THIS (see above) never happened before this year. If you had a slow growth you were aware of in your body then discovered that it was cancer would you not attempt to kill it or have it removed? Or would you just let it grow and overwhelm you because "it's been going on for a long time"?

[SerpentDove]

>>Very true. This is another in a long line of signs that Bush doesn't have much respect for the base that got him elected and thinks that all he has to do is to throw us an occasional bone and we'll stay quiet.<<

GWB tried to get Harriet Miers on the SC, and Lindsey Graham told us to "shut up."

[Chgogal]

Thank you for your responses. I am just curious what other calm and thoughtful Freepers are pondering regarding this issue. Miss Marple, when you have time, please forward me the link you mentioned. It would be very much appreciated.

[ConservativeMind]

You ask a good set of questions.

We have a good start with the extensive work involved with H-1B visas.

There is a small limit to them (relative to perceived need), they must be highly qualified (I only know of master's degreed student getting them (friends from my master's program), they must be sponsored by an employer (who is accountable for them), and are generally paid what the labor market demands, and if they are here illegally, I don't think it is easy for them to be given one.

As for the actual impact, I know the employment numbers make it look like it would be impossible to handle a mass exodus, but this is definitely not the case. Those unemployment numbers are collected by those getting unemployment compensation, if I correctly remember. That means many millions of people who are no longer collecting (or never collected), are on welfare or disability, collecting Social Security, are students or of student age, are stay-at-home spouses, etc. are all not in that number. So, what looks scary is far from it. Especially since I believe Welfare should be abolished.

Also, you underestimate the ability of mechanized equipment filling in for manual labor. There would be an investment in machinery that has not happened in many circumstances. If the labor is so cheap, why invest? That equipment would be bought in/from the US, doubly helping the economy.

There are many people devoted to handling the repercussions of the illegals as it is, including therapists (I recently heard over a million US citizens have been victims of illegals' violent crimes), court personnel, hospital staff, etc. Their demand would decrease, shifting to more productive areas. Additionally, citizens working in professions which illegals have jobs would be able to demand more money or shift occupations themselves (home builders, landscapers, etc.).

In the end, I am not worried about too much of a consequence. When we get rid of the illegals here (scaring them by enforcing laws on them and employers), we will be able to choose from a more educated labor force from other countries (India, Russia, etc.) than we are left with now. Additionally, we would have a much better handle on their criminal background, leading to a safer future for us all.

[GregoryFul]

cutting the free flow of labor could be problematic for future economic growth

I've been thinking about that angle, also. China is growing gangbusters using cheap labor - if the US could get a big pool of cheap labor, the US would have a chance at balancing the trade deficit. We have no chance with highly paid, lazy, job-rule bound, union workers, paying taxes and whatnot.

What's even neater - these modern day slaves are self importing - no slave traders to pay off. The more the merrier, I say.

[MadIvan]

My instincts tell me that Bush is trying to reconcile two diametically opposing views - on the one hand, he is trying to appeal to law and order conservatives, who want the illegals out and the border sealed. On the other hand, he is trying to ensure that the economy isn't hindered, and does not want to alienate the potentially huge Hispanic vote. What we are seeing is his attempt steer a middle course.

In my opinion, this is not going to work. He has to take a strong position for a very simple reason - any legitimisation of the illegal immigration weakens the system. Our dear President Reagan discovered this. It sets a dangerous precedent, whereby any law can be nullified if enough people break it.

I believe many of Bush's problems come from this desire to reconcile. He wants to work with the House and Senate, and thus agrees with earmarks which he should reject out of hand. This desire for "smooth" governance, led his father to make that terrible bargain with congressional Democrats that raised taxes. It's a pity he has inherited this quality.

Regards, Ivan

[stands2reason]

I didn't. I voted against Kerry.

[stands2reason]

Hey! I hear they're dusting off the old faithful Flag Burning Amendment!

[stands2reason]

You're right! This is all the liberal's doing!

I guess that means amnesty is a good idea after all!


NOT.

[Gaffer]

I also agree. He needs to get right on immigration. I don't know what "hair he got up his ###" that makes him thing we'd buy this Senate Illegal Alien Abortion bill, but he's got another think comin'!