Antarctica 'Lost World' Found

Netscape News ^ | March 7, 2004

[pepsi_junkie]

Two teams of researchers, working separately thousands of miles from each other but both defeating incredible odds, have made stunning finds in frozen Antarctica -- so stunning that the National Science Foundation calls their discoveries evidence of a lost world.

The researchers found what they believe to be the fossilized remains of two species of dinosaurs previously unknown to science. One is a 70-million-year old quick-moving meat-eater found on the bottom of an Antarctic sea, while and the other is a 200-million-year-old giant plant-eater that was found on the top of a mountain, reports Reuters.

The lost world in which these two dinosaurs lived was very different from the Antarctica we know now. Their Antarctica was not frigid and frozen. Their Antarctica was warm and wet.

The 70-million-year-old carnivore was small for a dinosaur at just 6 to 8 feet tall. Scientists believe it is an entirely new species of carnivorous dinosaur that is related to the enormous meat-eating tyrannosaurs and the equally voracious, but smaller and swifter, velociraptors. Think "Jurassic Park." Now scream in terror! Found on James Ross Island off the coast of the Antarctic Peninsula by a team led by Judd Case from St. Mary's College of California, it likely floated out to sea after it died and then sank to the bottom of the Weddell Sea. Reuters explains that its bones and teeth show that it was a two-legged animal that survived in the Antarctic long after other predators took over elsewhere on the globe. "One of the surprising things is that animals with these more primitive characteristics generally haven't survived as long elsewhere as they have in Antarctica," Case told Reuters.

The 200-million-year-old herbivore, a primitive sauropod that had a long neck and four legs, was found by a team led by William Hummer from Augustana College in Rock Island, Illinois on the 13,000-foot high Mt. Kirkpatrick near the Beardmore Glacier. When this dino lived, the area was a soft riverbed. The team found dinosaur bones, specifically part of a huge pelvis and ilium. "This site is so far removed geographically from any site near its age, it's clearly a new dinosaur to Antarctica," Hammer told Reuters. This dinosaur was probably about 30 feet long, but was part of a lineage that went on to produce animals as large as 100 feet long.

Both excavations were supported by the National Science Foundation, an independent federal agency that supports fundamental research and education across all fields of science and engineering.

[Don Joe]

Which completely ignores the fact that even "ice" is considered a "fluid" in the same sense glass is. The weight of the plane alone would have caused to to sink. Especially once more snow started accumulating on top of it.

That conjecture has been disproven.

PS: the "glass is a liquid" urban legend is no better. It's been disproven six ways to sunday. If you buy into that -- let alone use it as a "proof" for your other claims, ahh... hoo hah!

[Don Joe]

PS: I presume your're talking about the "lost squadron" that made a forced landing on the ice during WWII, and then, decades later, when someone thought the nice pristine planes would be nice for display, he discovered them under hundreds of feet of ice.

If so, you're the only one I've encountered who actually believes they "sank" into the ice. I thought everyone acknowledged that it was accumulated snowfall that had buried them -- as it had the surrounding land.

[aruanan]

They should be digging for oil! There HAS to be hundreds of billions of barrels, considering that Antarctica used to be tropical/sub-tropical and covered with forests.

Presuming that oil is the product of buried tropical forests, much more likely to be untrue than not based on available evidence.

[Dead Corpse]

PS: the "glass is a liquid" urban legend is no better. It's been disproven six ways to sunday. If you buy into that -- let alone use it as a "proof" for your other claims, ahh... hoo hah!

So all those Newtonian viscosity tables can be thrown out now? I'm sure chemical engineers and phyisists everywhere will be over joyed to hear it.

Should I even dare ask if you have a link to proof of your assertion? Or will it be another one of those websites that also tries to prove the Earth is either Flat or Hollow?

[Alter Kaker]

Moreover, unlike Greenland, there is little snowfall for much of Antarctic, so core does represent great many years.

[RightWhale]

That would give us coal, not oil.

[Alter Kaker]

So all those Newtonian viscosity tables can be thrown out now? I'm sure chemical engineers and phyisists everywhere will be over joyed to hear it.

Glass is solid.

Link

[swarthyguy]

Great piece. Now to find out more about that covered lake referenced in some reports last year....

[Alter Kaker]

Even more clear: Glass is solid.

http://dwb.unl.edu/Teacher/NSF/C01/C01Links/www.ualberta.ca/~bderksen/florin.html

[ASA Vet]

a man lived over 920 years

920/12=76.6

[Dead Corpse]

Being an amorphous solid, glass still retins thermoplastic proerties. Here is another good information page on the subject of GLASS. Also, even your link has this in its conclusion:
There is no clear answer to the question "Is glass solid or liquid?".

However, the plane did not sink/melt its way into GLASS now did it? Check out the numbers on water ice and get back to me will you?

[Dead Corpse]

Once again, still came to the conclusion that glass is an amorphous solid and not a crystaline solid. Do look up the difference sometime. Thanks.

[Don Joe]

Let it rest, Mr. Corpse. Mr. Kaker has already entertained your need to argue with far more patience than I'd be willing to supply.

You're clinging to fringe "science" and folklore, and beating us over the head with it to get us to accept your comical attempts at "proofs" for your arguments.

It ain't gonna wash.

[Dead Corpse]

Fringe? Aren't you on the side of the nutcases trying to claim a "young Earth"?

And you have the stones to call me fringe?

fine. Whatever trips your trigger. Have fun talking amongst yourselves then. Just be aware that the Bible also alludes to a "flat Earth" as well.

[DannyTN]

"Leaving aside radiometric dating, tree rings alone get us back 10,000+ years."

I agree with Cowgirl that there is probably an explanation for the tree rings. But even if there isn't 10,000 fits with the Biblical model much better than the evolutionist's model. Don't you think it's strange that tree rings can't take you back further than 10,000? Shouldn't you be able to dig down find a fossilized tree, match the rings and keep going. You should be able to account for millions of years with tree rings. 10,000 given the evolutionist model is laughable.

[Don Joe]

Once again, still came to the conclusion that glass is an amorphous solid and not a crystaline solid. Do look up the difference sometime.

Perhaps you should have looked it up before pontificating on the topic.

From http://www.agsci.ubc.ca/courses/fnh/301/carb/carb1.htm, we see that when glass, as an amorphous solid, "is warmed it softens and eventually becomes fluid. This is not a first order transition and therefore occurs over a range of temperatures called the 'glass transition temperature'."

In other words, glass does not have a solid-liquid transistion temperature, but rather a range of temperatures, with its softness depending on temperature, increasing with the increased heat, until its melting point is reached. Instead of transitioning from solid to liquid as it's heated, it transitions from solid to soft to liquid.

At room temperature, glass is solid.

There are precision optics that are well over a hundred years old, that still maintain their original figure.

The standard "proof" of the "fact" that "glass is a fluid" (your original claim, by the way, in post 98), consists of "old" windowpanes that are thiner at the top than the bottom.

Of course, all but the densest of "glass is a fluid" believers understands that plate glass of that period was made via a method that guaranteed that it would be thinner at one edge (i.e., lifted out of a pool of molten glass), and only the most foolish of glaziers would putty them in with the thin edge toward the bottom.

Thanks.

You're quite welcome.

[Don Joe]

Fringe? Aren't you on the side of the nutcases trying to claim a "young Earth"?

Actually, I'm one of the "nutcases" trying to claim that glass at room temperature is a solid, and that the well-documented case of the "lost squadron" is indeed a case of a hell of a lot of snow burying some airplanes.

I guess that puts me in pretty good company. And I guess it makes you, once again, today's winner of the Wiley Coyotee award. You can pick it up at the bottom of yonder canyon.

Just a suggestion -- not that I'm worried that you might take it -- but next time, you might want to avoid quite so much shooting from the hip, quite so much guessing as to what people are saying (especially when what they're saying is right there in black and white), and perhaps, quite so much sticking to your guns even when proven wrong.

[Modernman]

Don't you think it's strange that tree rings can't take you back further than 10,000?

Trees live a long time, but not millions of years. The 10,000 year figure was just an example.

In any event, there are several different dating technologies that work well for truly long time frames. Of course, many creationists do not accept them.

Shouldn't you be able to dig down find a fossilized tree, match the rings and keep going.

Um... What?

You should be able to account for millions of years with tree rings.

How?

[Dead Corpse]

Here's an experiment for you Einstein. In the middle of the Winter when you get a good solid cold snap. Take a dark colored rock and set it on the ice. Come back in a few weeks.

THAT was my original contention moron. A dark substance absorbs radiant HEAT, more so than the surrounding ICE would. See my post #29. Also, WEIGHT can cause compressive HEAT which increase local thermoplasticity.

You can continue to argue against Newton, I just don't have the time.

As for using the whole Greenland Airplane under Ice to support your Young Earth theory of Biblical accuracy, here's some more flat earth stuff for you...

[Ernest_at_the_Beach]

Fascinating!