Conservatives are now the "Blacks" of the Republican Party

vanity ^ | 12/17/03 | Destro

[Destro]

In a discussion on this thread Tom Ridge's Immigration Remarks Draw Fire a post regarding the conservative angst about the recent campaign finance reform that Bush signed into law and that the Supreme Court approved (and the approval was praised by the White House), on the heals of the Medicare entitlement enacted under a Republican controlled government the following was posted:

I'm hearing Rush now. He claims the republicans have ONLY one party to go to. He has put this issue squarely on the problem. We need to vote outside of this corrupt party apparatus.

12 posted on 12/11/2003 12:39:52 PM EST by Digger

I also heard this on Rush and my blood boiled. Rush said conservatives have no place else to go and thus will continue to vote as a block to the Republicans.....and then it hit me. That is exactly what we conservatives lament about Blacks and the Democratic party. Black Democrats who vote straight Democratic and are rewarded by being ignored.

In other words, Conservatives are now the "Blacks" of the Republican Party!!!

I urge the same solution to Republican conservatives that Black conservatives offer to Black Democrats. QUIT! Become independents and let the parties fight for our votes. If we can't take the GOP back we should leave the GOP.

I did not change. My party did. I thank God Ronald Reagan is unable to comprehend what is happening to the party he saved.

[Luis Gonzalez]

These guys think that 96% of the party should be governed by the political ideology of 4% of the party, and their attitude is that if the Party refuses to acquiesce to their demands, they will do whatever is needed to help the Democrats win elections as a "punishment" to the GOP.

Then they wonder why the Party could care less about them, and is looking to replace them by bringing new voters from the center of the political spectrum into the fold.

This tactic of leaving the GOP in order to force the GOP to change, is basically committing political suicide by achieving irrelevance.

[Bikers4Bush]

Exactly. I will not be held bound by my fears of what may happen when I would in fact be helping it along by continuing to blindly vote republican.

[af_vet_1981]

For instance, if Hillary demanded that we allow our houses to be burned down overnight, the Republican Congress would fight for the right to do it over 3 weeks instead.
If I have no place to go, shouldn't I just stay home?
GWB is a liberal, and people like me said so before the election for months.

By all means, go vote for Dean. We'll find someone to take your place in the battle. I would crawl over broken glass to keep Dean/Clark/Hillary out of the WH ...
The French will accept your surrender. You won't even have to leave your house.

[Sam Cree]

"You want me to boot GW Bush and the only party left with any patriotism at all ? Not going to happen."

No. I'm voting for Bush as well. I'm horrified with CFR, which he signed, but he's still better than the Dems, who no longer even pretend not to be socialists.

"The Constitution and Bill of Rights do not serve in Congress, the White House, or the Supreme Court. They do not issue orders, write legislation, or render opinions. Power rests in the hands of leaders from one party or the other. There is no independent third way. There is either the Republicans or the PartyOfTraitors. You will get Bush or Dean/Hillary/Gore/Clark."

Our leaders are sworn to protect those documents that you seem so blithely able to disregard. Those documents are what this country is about. While I agree that we have to vote Republican, I cannot help but be appalled at what seems to be happening to our country, on a Republican watch.

"Precisely identify and document your allegation.

My apologies, my allegation is incorrect. Posts 21 and 46 came close, IMO, but did not actually label the other posters as traitors and cowards. My point here is that it is understandable that some here are disillusioned or betrayed enough to consider withholding their votes. Doesn't mean they are making the right decision, but also doesn't mean they are legitimate targets for such scorn.

You didn't actually answer my request for your definition of conservatism, rather you correctly implied that Hillary, Dean and the Democrats will destroy it. But I am going to assume it means for you as it does for me: allegiance to our founding documents and the ideal of individual freedom which they stand for. My reason for asking was the ferocity with which you argued against those who seemed most appalled by CFR. I have seen a few FReepers who don't really mind CFR.

I am hoping, as you are, for a Republican sweep next year, since I think it's our only hope. But I am starting to wonder what even Republicans stand for these days. My gut feeling still tells me that GW is a good guy who sees a big picture. But I'm not as sure of it as I was. Didn't his guys just praise the Court's decision on CFR? If so, that puts GW squarely in the camp with Ginsberg, Breyer, Bader, Souter and O'Connor, instead of in the camp with Scalia, Rhenquist, Kennedy and Thomas.

[af_vet_1981]

I don't know anyone out of my friends, family, co-workers that are going to vote for Bush again.

You are the people that gave us the Clintons.

[looscnnn]

Did I say that Zell was more conservative? No, I was just suggested that if people were not happy with the choices, they could write in someone elses name (Zell, Bart Simpson, Ted Nugent, Sean Hannity, etc.).

Besides, the way Bush is going, what makes you think he is more conservative than Zell?

[MissAmericanPie]

Nope, held my nose and voted for Bush Sr again, even after the "read my lips" clown act. I wont carry the guilt for anothers actions. It was Bush Sr. that gave you Clinton. Place the blame where it fairly belongs.

But hang in there, later you might check back and see if Bush Jr gives you Hillary.

[looscnnn]

Um, maybe because he is acting more like a moderate than a conservative is why people are talking about not voting for him. Some are saying that they want to leave the GOP, not only because of Bush, but because of the others in Congress. Also, some of those that are talking about leaving the party, are not saying that they won't vote for Bush. You can be an independent and still vote for Bush or whoever. Some people in this forum just don't seem to grasp that concept.

[tacticalogic]

Here's a clue for you. I, and I suspect many of the people you're disagreeing with here understand perfectly that politics is a dirty business, and that sometimes you have to compromise some principles to get what you want. We're just not willing to let you decide which ones we're going to compromise. Deal with it.

[looscnnn]

One thing you fail to realize is that if enough conservatives leave the GOP and go to, say, the Constitution Party, the Constitution Party becomes a serious contender. Especially considering the fact that the Dems are going to be hurting after this election.

[af_vet_1981]

You didn't actually answer my request for your definition of conservatism,

Conservatism is the struggle to retain whatever goodness remains in this country and by extension the world.

Government should be small enough so as not to interfere with life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness while being powerful enough to fight the evil that threatens it.

• The death penalty is not cruel and unusual punishment.
• Every perp deserves a fair trial and a fast hanging.
• There is no right to pornography in the Constitution.
• There is no right to homosexual behavior in the Constitution.
• There is no right to abortion in the Constitution.
• There is a right to bear arms in the Constitution.
• Taxes must be minimized to promote economic growth.
• Immigration should be promoted and controlled.

[RabidBartender]

"It must be tough watching the demise of the illusion.

The illusion is gone in my mind. If the election were held today, President Bush would not get my vote. It's one thing to compromise and steer the country more toward the conservative side. It's another to veer hard to liberal ideals and programs. What a shame.

[af_vet_1981]

But hang in there, later you might check back and see if Bush Jr gives you Hillary.

I don't know how you look a service member who is going to Iraq and Afghanistan in the eye. They may die is this war but they are not surrendering. I don't know how you do it. I couldn't. Never surrender to evil. Bush is the only good candidate in 2004.

[Protagoras]

Congratulations, you just joined the ranks of the hated and reveiled on this site. You are about to be excoriated, better gird your loins.

[Protagoras]

Every perp deserves a fair trial and a fast hanging. There is no right to pornography in the Constitution. There is no right to homosexual behavior in the Constitution.

More campaigning? LOL, I'm sure more people will be persuaded today by these statements.

[looscnnn]

Amen to that. Don't forget that he said he would sign the extension of the AWB (didn't he encourage the extension?).

[Sam Cree]

The death penalty is not cruel and unusual punishment.

Agreed. Although I have been personally against it. However, I kind of think 9/11 changed my mind.

Every perp deserves a fair trial and a fast hanging.

There is no right to pornography in the Constitution.

Define pornography. There is no authority in the Constitution to regulate it either.

There is no right to homosexual behavior in the Constitution.

Nor authority to control it either, again. However, this, and the previous issue are properly left up to the states, IMO.

There is no right to abortion in the Constitution.

There is a right to bear arms in the Constitution.

Yep. Not sure the Supreme Court thinks that right is for you and me, though.

Taxes must be minimized to promote economic growth.

Yep

Immigration should be promoted and controlled.

Inclined to agree, wouldn't mind an elaboration on this last point, regarding "promoted."

[Leatherneck_MT]

Good post, good point and maybe it's time.

[looscnnn]

Liberalism wasnt implemented in one fell swoop. It was done incrementally. If we are to advance Conservatism, we have to do it the same way. Just look at Partial Birth Abortion ban. Incremental. But it has changed the debate to focus on the unborn human for a change.

Look at increased gov. spending, talk of extending the AWB, the medicare drug bill. Incremental liberalism.