Click here: to donate by Credit Card
Or here: to donate by PayPal
Or by mail to: Free Republic, LLC - PO Box 9771 - Fresno, CA 93794
Thank you very much and God bless you.
Posted on 07/20/2025 6:46:05 PM PDT by nickcarraway
Homer’s Odyssey tells the story of Odysseus’ attempt to return home from Troy to Ithaca. Historians agree that Troy was in northwest Anatolia, while Ithaca was off Western Greece. However, a popular theory among some researchers today is that the Odyssey is actually set in the Baltic Sea around Scandinavia. What is the supposed evidence for this, and does it stand up to scrutiny?
Why might the Odyssey be set in Scandinavia? The basic reason for this theory is that, according to some researchers, there are many details in the Iliad and the Odyssey which do not correspond to the Mediterranean world. For instance, there are references to tides despite the fact that the Mediterranean Sea has no noticeable tides. Furthermore, there are numerous references to lush vegetation and extensive woodlands. Some researchers argue that this is inconsistent with a Mediterranean setting, given that much of Greece and Anatolia is very rugged in comparison with Northern Europe.
A map of the South Funen Archipelago in the Baltic Sea, Scandinavia, supposedly the location of Ithaca in the Odyssey A map of the South Funen Archipelago in the Baltic Sea, Scandinavia, supposedly the location of Ithaca in the Odyssey. Credit: Wikimedia Commons, Public domain Researcher Felice Vinci, the main proponent of this theory, argues that Homer consistently presents the world of his narratives as a cold and harsh place. He regularly makes mention of storms and even refers to snow. In the Odyssey, the sea—in addition to Troy, Ithaca, and various other locations—is described as “misty.” Some of Homer’s characters wear thick coats, again indicating a cold environment, and Vinci notes there are many details that align with Viking ships and customs. The use of chariots in the Iliad is likewise not reflective of Mycenaean Greek military practices but is more consistent with how ancient Celts employed chariots in warfare.
Vinci points out that there are numerous instances of geographical descriptions in the Odyssey which do not line up with the supposed locations in the Mediterranean. For instance, the land of the Laestrygonians supposedly had extremely long days. Based on this evidence, where do proponents of this theory place the Odyssey?
Odysseus’ route near Scandinavia According to Felice Vinci, the Odyssey is set in the Baltic Sea, the body of water in the midst of Scandinavia. He believes that the locations described in the Odyssey are reflective of this area. Odysseus’ starting location was Troy. Vinci claims that Troy was not Hisarlik in Anatolia but was actually Toija, which is about 62 miles (100 km) west of Helsinki, the capital of Finland.
Grecian Delight supports Greece The problem is that there is no evidence of a massive ancient city in this area. Nonetheless, Vinci claims that Homer’s description implies that the wall of Troy was simply a primitive wooden palisade—an architectural feature consistent with Nordic Bronze Age building practices.
Regarding Odysseus’ destination, Vinci claims that Ithaca and its three neighboring islands correspond to the South Funen Archipelago just off the coast of Denmark. According to his interpretation, the island of Doulichion (whose name means “long”) supposedly matches Langeland, the island of Same corresponds to Aerø, and the island of Zacynthus aligns with Tåsinge. Ithaca itself, Vinci says, brings to mind the island of Lyø. Homer speaks of an islet in the sea between Ithaca and Same, which, according to Vinci, corresponds to the island of Avernakø between Lyø (supposedly Ithaca) and Aerø (supposedly Same).
Environmental arguments for a northern setting Before examining the issues with this theoretical placement of the Odyssey in the waters of Scandinavia in detail, let us examine the alleged problems associated with a Mediterranean setting for Homer’s poems.
Firstly, the idea that lush vegetation and cold weather is out of place in the Mediterranean is nothing more than a matter of perspective. What can be considered “lush” vegetation and “extensive” woodlands depends entirely on the experience of the observer. If someone had only ever experienced life in the Mediterranean, then he would have no other reference point from which to describe the world.
However, to be clear, the countries surrounding the Mediterranean do indeed have plenty of lush vegetation and extensive woodlands, regardless of whether or not they are compared to Northern Europe. Furthermore, temperatures on Ithaca can drop to near freezing. The ancient Greeks did use fur clothing, and fur was an item of trade by the Phoenicians and other groups. Certain areas do also get snow. Mist, likewise, is perfectly common in the Mediterranean Sea, as are storms.
Cultural arguments for a northern setting Another major issue with Vinci’s theory is that much of the evidence he cites in support of his theory comes from the wrong time period. For instance, his repeated references to Viking customs obviously cannot be used as evidence for placing the Odyssey in Bronze Age Scandinavia, thousands of years prior to the Vikings.
As for the chariot argument, it is important to note that the Celts did not reside in Scandinavia. Therefore, Celtic chariot customs cannot be used to support the claim that Scandinavia is the setting of the Odyssey or the Iliad. Similarly, the peculiar length of days described in the land of the Laestrygonians does not necessarily indicate a northern destination. In fact, such an argument would undermine Vinci’s theory—if all of the Odyssey‘s locations were in the far north, there would be nothing extraordinary about the long days of the Laestrygonians.
In reality, Homer’s description of the unusual days and nights experienced by the Laestrygonians closely resembles Hesiod’s account of the entrance to the Underworld. This parallel suggests that their land may have been situated near Cape Taenarum, traditionally believed to be the gateway to the Underworld.
Problems with evidence placing the Odyssey in Scandinavia But what about Vinci’s arguments for linking the Odyssey‘s locations to Scandinavia? His placement of the narrative actually makes little geographic sense in light of the narrative details in the Iliad and Odyssey. For instance, Toija is quite distant from the sea, yet, in the Iliad, Troy is located near the coast.
The idea that Avernakø could possibly be the islet between Ithaca and Same is clearly not viable. First of all, it is not a small islet but is roughly the size of Lyø, Vinci’s Ithaca. Secondly, it is also not situated between Lyø and Aerø (Vinci’s Same). Therefore, Avernakø does not match up with the Asteris described in the Odyssey. Similar objections can be raised against many other identifications proposed within this theory as well.
In conclusion, there is little justification for rejecting the widely accepted Mediterranean setting of the Odyssey, and no convincing evidence supports placing the story in Scandinavia.
|
|
Click here: to donate by Credit Card Or here: to donate by PayPal Or by mail to: Free Republic, LLC - PO Box 9771 - Fresno, CA 93794 Thank you very much and God bless you. |
Not buying it.
The next theory is that it was either set in Africa, or based on an African tale.
Egg heads being egg heads.
https://faimao.blogspot.com/2024/09/i-watched-documentary-on-illiad-and.html
Knowing the braindead lefties, that won’t be so far off.
Years ago I remember reading a similar article but only remember one point. There was something about floating rocks in the Odyssey actually being ice. I read the Odyssey 65 years ago so I don’t remember details like that. It was one of my favorites.
Next they’ll claim Hamlet was set in Denmark.
If the passage is taken as referring to a solar eclipse, Scandinavia had them in 1169 BC, then not another for another century. They had had them in 1185 BC, 1230 and 1239 BC.
I’m not sure if any of them fit the other clues.
Whoever believes that will also have to believe that the Baltic was much warmer in ancient times than today.
Oh, yeah. Absolutely.
Nobody ever mentions Homer's last name, either. It was Simpson. And the only place I can see matching all of his geographical descriptions is Texas. Ulysses was really from San Antonio. If you've ever staggered along the River Walk there you'll agree.
Edo Nyland (sp?) advocated this waaaaay back in the 1990s. Spoiler alert, the answer's no. If memory serves, I first learned of this thanks to a different guy who claimed Homer's events had actually happened in Scotland instead.
What the article fails to mention is some recent evidence of climatic differences at that time. If we presume the Trojan war to be around 3200 BC, there is recent evidence that prior to that time there was significantly more rainfall in and around Anatolia, which would have resulted in much more vegetation. Historians looking at events leading up to the Bronze Age Collapse now believe that rainfall-driven agriculture was much more widespread and relied-upon due to the greater rainfall at that time.
From sediment cores in the Mediterranean, there’s also recent evidence of a sharp cooling trend right before the Bronze Age Collapse, which would have resulted in a sudden drop in rainfall due to much lower evaporation from the seas. There are Cuneiform tablets detailing pleas for food shipments from places in Anatolia (i.e. Hittite Empire) because of crop failures. It’s now thought that famines from that cooling trend might have precipitated the warfare that led to the collapse. Only the Egyptians managed to survive it, mainly because they had the Nile river to rely upon, but there’s evidence that even the Nile was affected by the sudden drop in rainfall and it resulted in Egyptian civil unrest. The Egyptians never fully recovered.
As for the Trojan War, my thinking is that if it actually happened, perhaps it was one of the first symptoms of the impending Bronze Age Collapse. If the cooling trend had already begun and rainfall had dropped off, it’s not a great stretch to envision Myceneans warring with one another when lack of food began to stress their civilization, the first ripples in a tide that eventually consumed nearly everyone in the eastern Mediterranean.
Correction: 1200 BC, 3200 years ago.
You're probably thinking of the "planctae" ("drifting" or "clashing" rocks) - Odysseus encounters them after passing Scylla and Charybdis.
Circe warns Odysseus, explaining that they're the same ones which Jason and the Argonauts encountered during their (earlier) adventures.
The Symplegades .
Regards,
King David (around 1000 BC) used the famed cedar trees of Lebanon to build the temple. I just read that some king in 200AD noticed the depletion of the trees and decreed a ban on cutting them. (It didn’t last long). The forests were huge at one time.
Like trying to figure out where the Hobbit takes place.
On a side note, just re-read the Odyssey earlier this year - more fun than when I had to read it in high school 50+ years ago.
Um, not exactly so. They once thought Troy was fiction. It’s something like historical fiction, but that is an anachronistic category.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.
