Posted on 03/01/2025 11:04:27 AM PST by OneVike
This is a simple question, but one that needs you to seriously consider before you respond. This is because, when you think about it, you will then be confronted with the reality that most of the wars America has been in since the end of WWII have nothing to do with our national interests.
Now we could argue whether or not WWI was in our best interest. Yet since the end of WWII, other than a very few instance, our military actions have almost exclusively been because of problems caused by European nations. (Both Western and Eastern nations) Mind you, I speak historically, so you may have to go back to choices made by European countries years before a conflict began. Some problems fester quite some time before the lid blows, yet the original problem was created years earlier.
Many many American lives and trillions of dollars have been waisted over the last 100 years because Europeans seldom gets along with each other or even with the rest of the World. When I look into the genesis of wars we ended up in, especially since WWII, I continually see European countries convincing American war hawks to step in and help.
It is a fact that the vast majority of wars around the World in the 20th century has been caused by European colonialism due to their desire to expand their power and influence for resources which they themselves lack. Yes, I will add Eastern Europe into this, which means Russia also, whether it be as the Soviet Union or as Russia under Putin. Yes communism is a real threat, yet if you truly look at the way European countries went around the world colonizing countries for the specific purpose of gaining their resources, then you will see how the local citizens were easily persuaded to join the communist's in a desire to get their country back. OK, blame them for being ignorant of what communism means, yet at the time the bigger enemy was the Western European nations.
Now I do not claim America is totally guiltless, nor do I claim the communists were the good guys. I look at the genesis of the problems. A big moment in Europe was when Truman decided to do the European leaders a favor by agreeing drawing the lines of who will police which areas that were previously under Nazi control. Adding insult to injury, Truman then pushed for the Marshall plan that helped rebuild ONLY Western European countries. Amazing how they conveniently left the Eastern countries to depend upon the communist Soviet Union for help. It is well documented that the Marshall plan pushed Stalin into a corner, which led him to eventually lock Eastern Europe into slavery for the next 50 years which led to the Cold War. The 4 year Marshal plan from 1948 to 1951 was a $13.3 billion (equivalent to $173.8 billion in 2025) should never ever had taken place.
We could also go back to the end of WWI when European leaders decided to divide up the Middle East into various countries by putting their hand picked dictators in power, instead of setting up Democracies. A problem they doubles down on after WWII, by removing some and putting new dictators in power. Neither time did they demand democratic rule. To this day the Middle East continuously has problems because the vast majority were once oppressed by dictatorial leaders who benefited from Western money for the oil, then later by Islam rulers we helped to overthrow the dictators we put in place. So now Islam is rearing it's Dark Age ugly head by becoming the lesser of two evils between the Islamic leaders and the tyrannical dictatorships installed by Western Europeans after WWI and WWII.
Today, these Islamic extremists are moving into Africa, which have also suffered through the years from both Western European colonization and Eastern European expansion via the Soviet Union. Consider this, outside of the very Northern parts of Africa, most of Africa has been divided up and colonized by European countries to satisfy their hunger of natural resources they lack. Like the Middle East, the people would became tired of their tyrannical rulers, and started grumbling for freedom from their European Lords.
Yet for too long these European countries refused to allow those nations to be free from their rule. Eventually, wanting freedom from the Western European countries so bad they would find allies in the Soviet Union (a Western European country) who helped them fight for what they thought was freedom. Like the Far Eastern countries, these people were clueless of the ramifications of making deals with communists, because they just wanted freedom. After all, the colonizing nations of Europe had allowed the problems to fester so long and get so bad that most of the continent would eventually became an open sore. Yet today, we hear these leftists in Europe continually accuse the United States of creating the problems they are guilty of.
This is one of the reasons I blame Europeans for many of Americas internal problems. Both Western and Eastern European countries have supported leftists causes in the USA to benefit Europe by funding politicians in America that push for laws and regulations which limit our ability to use out own resources. Mind you, America is so resource rich that we have no need to depend on the rest of the World. Yet today America suffers from the way the Communist Democrats, and Deep State Republicans, have through the years pushed laws and regulations that force businesses to move over seas while, making it illegal to even use our own resources like oil, wood, fish, land, etc. etc. etc. This has created a situation where Europe, South America, the Middle East and Africa, have all benefited from these anti-American policies. Which eventually just added to the conflicts around the World.
Add all this together and we can see how America has become nothing more than a tool of the rest of the World, thanks to our so-called friends across the pond in Europe. Now I get into the wars we find ourselves continually in. We pulled Europe out if 2 World Wars, and after the second one, we ended up becoming the the big brother who stepped in every time they had a problem. Other than 9/11, which in a round about way was Europe's fault as I pointed out pretty much every war from Vietnam and forward has come from problems stemming from Western and Eastern countries.
It has gotten so bad that Eisenhower's warning came true, the industrial complex mentality, has led America to become involved in every stupid military scrimmage that raises it's ugly head. Even though we have no direct national interest in them. At 68 years old, I have seen my share of wars, that American politicians continually claim is our responsibility. Well I for one am 100% in agreement with Donald Trump. It is high time we let the World take care of their own problems, instead of expecting America to bail them out every time.
Yes, we must again become isolated when it comes to war. We can still have the top notch best military to defend ourselves and keep the bad guys quaking in their boots, but it won't cost as much because we won't be supplying weapons the rest of the World needs to continue their warmongering ways. Besides, every time we step to help others in trouble, we are the ones who are always blamed, because in every war there is a loser, and the losers will eventually want to come after the ones dropping the bombs. AKA 9/11.
So, I say we should let them fight their own wars, and stop letting them turn is into the bad guy after we pull their ass out of the fire time and time again. Then, and only then can we truly make America great again. Which is why we elected Donald Trump.
Your thoughts?
Europe has the most dangerous people on Earth.
Up til now Europe had the most destructive tech on Earth.
Both are why Europe effectively conquered the Earth after 1492. You Americans are the heirs to that btw.
The US is the wealthiest, most lethal state on Earth.
So when the Very Very dangerous Euros make a mess, who stops it? Its the US or nobody. If you want people to stop bothering you, theres an easy fix - become weaker.
No, we need to stop feeling obligated to try to *solve* everyone else’s problems.
And the problem also comes in that some of what is involved in these *wars* is us trying for a regime change in another country. So we end up supporting the *rebels* who often (usually) end up as bad as they guys they’re rebelling against.
We have enough problems here at home to manage without managing someone else’s too.
If we focused on being energy independent and food and medicine independent and did much of our own manufacturing, we wouldn’t be so easily derailed when other countries had problems.
And our economy would be booming and people would have jobs and thereby housing.
I sort of disagree with how you phrase the post WWI problem:
“We could also go back to the end of WWI when European leaders decided to divide up the Middle East into various countries by putting their hand picked dictators in power, instead of setting up Democracies.”
Wilson did justify the US entering WWI in order to make the world safe for democracy, so the European divvy-up later made a liar out of him. But I would have altered your summary a bit:
“We could also go back to the end of WWI when European leaders decided to divide up the Middle East into various countries by putting their hand picked dictators in power, instead of MINDING THEIR OWN BUSINESS.”
Just a minor difference.
And I would emphasize your statement of the America First policy to be clear that we will be strong enough punish those that harm us even indirectly. Venezuela opens its prisons to send criminals to the US? Drone swarms destroy the Venezuelan government. Mexican government allows cartels to funnel drugs to the US? We take out the cartels and a great portion of the Mexican government. Then, of course we leave, saying “That’s for nothing. Don’t try to start anything. Hope you have money for repairs.”
My thoughts are that the only time Article 5 has ever been invoked is by the USA after 9-11 and that there are many Canadians, Brits and Europeans are dead because they got dragged into the war in Afghanistan.
Shame on me for not keeping my eyes open during that disaster.
They both should have been hung out to dry.
How much did they steal. Trillions?
And got our soldiers murdered and 10s of thosusands more with horrific brain injuries.
Never again.
I agree, but it begins by wanting to fix things we have no bossiness fixing.
Exactly.
I added the caveat for 9/11
Well a lot of posters here seem to have forgotten that.
Oh come on. The real reason was the streets of NY were paved in gold (allegedly). More to the point, there was also free land. Money talks to rich people and poor. Its unnecessary to look for noble reasons.
You can examine your own assertion. Why for instance did the Italians come? No forever wars or religious persecution. It was just that the Italians were poor.
Yup. If we’re attacked directly, that’s a whole ‘nother ball game.
It’s the involvement with affairs that we have no business being in.
I personally believe in “An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure”.
You can call it being “the worlds policeman”.
I call it avoiding the next world war.
Our yearly military costs are WAY cheaper than a war.
Democrats are notoriously bad at this because they rule from their Gonads. EG Vietnam and Middle East wars, just to name a few.
What is happening in the Ukraine and South and far east Asia
is just a continuation of civil and not so civil wars that have happened for centuries.
America although not perfect has a framework of somewhat voluntary cooperation. Not many other large populations have that. That is our power.
As an example, I was born and raised in CA state, lived and worked 20+ years in WA state, and now reside in Hawaii.
How do I identify myself?
I’m an American!
Now if you Ask a guy born and raised in the UK, Whoe worked in Germany for 20+ myears nad then went tom Spain how would he identify?
Probably as an Englishman, not a european.
They have no connection to each other.
If you read all I wrote, you would see I believe in the most bad ass military on the planet. We don’t need to practice by getting into skirmishes’ we have no interest in. A bad ass military can and has scared others from doing stupid things.
We need it for protection and retaliation when attacked, but not every wars others get into just because they know America will come along and foot the bill with arms and lives.
I can count on one hand the wars we had to be in ion the last 100 years. The rest were none of out business.
Silly, they are with OJ’s wife’s killer.
We have no interest in Russian desires for greater hegemony? In China’s?
The US has interests in every spot on earth. The issue is tactics, strategy, and budget.
I did understand,
but here is my observation,
“practice makes perfect”
Russia fell flat on it’s butt in the Ukraine, because they had little real world experience fighting with a determined adversary.
were it not for their practice of just throwing bodies at
the enemy. They would not succeed.
The future will tell just how much they damaged their society killing off so many of their young working class
men.
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