America’s Next Civil War Will Be Worse Than Our Last

The American Spectator ^ | 07/26/18 | H. W. Crocker III

[Enlightened1]

Of that we can be sure.

In the summer of 1862, just weeks before the Battle of Sharpsburg (or Antietam) — the bloodiest single day of fighting in American history — Union Captain George Armstrong Custer attended the wedding of Confederate Captain John “Gimlet” Lea at Bassett Hall in Williamsburg, Virginia, as best man. The Union officer was dressed in blue, the Confederate officer in grey, and Custer being Custer spent the next two weeks flirting with the Southern belle cousin of the bride, even joining her in singing “Dixie.”

At one point she told him, “You ought to be in our army.”

“What would you give me if I resigned my commission in the Northern army and joined the Southern?”

“You are not in earnest, are you?”

 

He wasn’t, of course. Custer was nothing if not loyal, and he believed that he was bound to the Union by the oath he had sworn at West Point, whatever his affection for Southern officers and their ladies.

Such gallantry seems unthinkable today, when members of the Trump administration are hounded from restaurants and theatres, and Confederate officers like John Lea, if they are remembered at all, are considered precursors of the German National Socialists, and their once famous and respected commanders like Robert E. Lee, Stonewall Jackson, and Jeb Stuart have their statues toppled and banished from public squares, their names stripped from public schools, and their memories spat upon and disgraced.

[ExTxMarine]

Had he survived, by any standard of that day, and by today’s standards, he’d have been court-martialed.

Au contraire, I believe that if Custer had been successful and squelched the "Indian uprisings," he would have probably ran for President. Rumor has it, that was one of the many reasons he went on that ill fated campaign.

The difference between today's standards and yesteryears standards are simple: Americans used to LOVE winners - PERIOD! We even loved those who didn't care about their troops, even those who were known drunkards, hell we even loved KNOWN adulterers through the 1990's!

[BroJoeK]

castlegreyskull: "Oh boy!
What was the Confederates’ objective??? ‘ Independence.
So there was some minor skirmishes in ND and Ohio.
The rest were in Union Border states/Territories."

Right, note your key word there: Union.
It was a Confederate war of aggression contesting for Union states & territories like:

1. New Mexico
2. Oklahoma
3. Kansas
4. Missouri
5. Kentucky
6. West Virginia
7. Maryland

Together those Union states & territories held nearly 4,000,000 people, enough to almost double the Confederacy's free population.
But they weren't the only states Confederates invaded or had guerilla groups in:

1. California
2. Colorado
3. Indiana
4. Ohio
5. Pennsylvania
6. Vermont

Those states & territories held another 7 million making the total 11 million in Union states threatened by Confederate military forces = 1/2 the Union's population.

Relatively minor incidents, skirmishes & terrorist attacks also happened in:

Maine, New York, Minnesota, Dakota, Arizona & Washington territories.

So you wish to claim: but, but, most battles were fought in the Confederacy!
Sure, overall, but in the war's first 12 months 30 of 52 battles were fought in Union states & territories, it was not until July 1862 that the numbers balanced & shifted to majority in the Confederacy.

[castlegreyskull]

Those were all slave states and border states. Except Kansas and California. The United States Invaded the South the South struck back. They should not have. I think Robert E. Lee was a general fighting with horrible vision.

I am not defending the Confederates. They had a bad cause, and really were fighting to keep the institution slavery. However, had they won the war, they would have been a seperate nation, they did not have any designs on taking over the rest of the Union.

[BroJoeK]

FLT-bird: "No, it’s what’s going on in your mind."

You have no idea "what's going on" in my mind since your own mind is chock full of confusion & Lost Causer lies.

FLT-bird: "Witness how you always show up in these threads."

But did you never notice that not one of us ever "shows up" until long after you Lost Causers have started yet again posting your own Godawful lies?
We're only here for one reason and that's to oppose your own endless lies with the truth.

Indeed, you can get rid of us today, we'll never come back.
All you have to do is stop lying about the Civil War.
You tell no lies and we have no reason to be here.

Get it?

FLT-bird: "Witness how you go out of your way to try to ping me for weeks afterwards to draw me in so you can white knight for big government some more."

Listen to that lie -- go back and think about it, what really happened?
You well know what happened.
You made post after post of endlessly long lies.
I went through them correcting -- one, by one, by one...
And what did you do?
You did the same thing DiogenesLamp does when confronted by the truth.
You went nuts, refusing to respond, saying in effect: "don't tell me the truth, I can't stand truth, I only want to see my own lies confirmed".

I pinged you on nothing -- zero, zip, nada pings -- except in response to your own posts, pal.

FLT-bird: "It’s obvious you’re more in line with the Democrats - they’re the party of big government today."

I've never been a Democrat, never voted for a Democrat.
Southern Democrats were never conservatives when it came to voting money for their own districts.
Southern Democrats were never "free enterprise" when it came to taxing those rich Northerners.
Southern Democrats were at the front of the line in ratifying the 16th, 17th & 18th amendments.
So much for "small government" Democrats.

You sound to me like a typical old-time Southern Democrat and you want me to think they were more Southern than Democrats, but I'm here to report more accurately they were far more typical Democrat than Southerners!

[rockrr]

You’ll have to forgive flt-birdie. It must be tough going through life with rose-colored eyeballs.

[BroJoeK]

castlegreyskull: "Those were all slave states and border states. Except Kansas and California."

They were Union states & territories which Confederates invaded and attempted to take.
Confederates in Union Missouri and in Union Maryland attacked Union troops and tried to take over those states long before any Union army invaded a single Confederate state.

Civil War began in the Union and was still fought there until its final months.

castlegreyskull: "However, had they won the war, they would have been a seperate nation, they did not have any designs on taking over the rest of the Union."

Nonsense, Confederates wanted to destroy and absorb as much of the United States as they possibly could, nor would they stop there:

[FLT-bird]

You sound to me like a modern Democrat. You’re far more concerned - obsessed really - with defending big government in whatever usurpations of power it wishes to engage in. You sound like the “living constitution” Leftists who think the power of the federal government should not be constrained be the constitution because it’s “old”.

[Ohioan]

Cheers! As expected, you pick the apt words to quote.

The hatred of true nobility is a sickness largely confined to the most despicable Leftists. But it is not really surprising that the Revolutionary breed would want to deny their intended victims, role models who inspire our higher aspirations.

Actually the most hate driven academic loons, today, are pushing new behavioral norms, which would have the effect of making the honest little boy in The Emperors New Clothes, the villain of the fable.

Just as the 1793 "Reign Of Terror," Tulip bubble & 17th Century witch hunts finally came to an end, one can only hope that the present excesses may actually be the final death throes of egalitarian insanity in the West.

[hoagy62]

Just one thing to remember, FRiend. There are no uniforms for either side. By that, I mean that you cannot tell when one is a member of the “Leech Class simply by race or the color of one’s skin. How are you going to tell who is who?
Not everyone you may think is an enemy really might be one.

[castlegreyskull]

Alright, I get it. You hate the South, and you are a big know it all. But you are still wrong. Bye.

[jmacusa]

Custer should never have been given a commission.

[ExTxMarine]

On THIS we can absolutely agree!

His infamy as WELL-DESERVED “goat” for his last-in-the-class at West Point should have been enough to disqualify him. Unfortunately, the Union needed officers so bad, that they commissioned a bad officer! It just got worse from there!

[DiogenesLamp]

Nonsense, Confederates wanted to destroy and absorb as much of the United States as they possibly could, nor would they stop there:

Well here I agree with you, except with your choice of the word "Destroy." I have long argued that with the windfall of all the extra money from Europe, acquiring all of the border states was just a matter of time, and so would have been taking over all the territories. The economic focus of the Continent would have shifted from New York/Washington to New Orleans/Mobile.

Once the economic interests of the border states and territories were better realized through the CSA, they would have joined it. Eventually the New York/Washington Axis would have become the leadership of a smaller Rump Country.

Lincoln himself noted that if they lose Kentucky, they've lost it all.

[jmacusa]

That idiot was told in no uncertain terms what lay ahead of him that fateful morning of The Big Horn Battle but he plowed ahead anyway and his entire command was wiped out. He also managed that day to get not only himself and his men killed, but his brother, his brother-in-law and his nephew. Major Reno Benteen, who narrowly escaped with his life that day said of Custer “I’m only to proud to say I despised him’’.

[ExTxMarine]

If I remember correctly, Custer had one of the highest, if not THE HIGHEST, death rates of American soldiers under his command during the Civil War - he did not care how many of his own men died during battle!!

The only reason that there were not MORE American Soldiers killed at Little Big Horn, since Custer split his command into three groups in an effort to attack from three different directions, was because (at least I believe) the two other sub-commanders so despised Custer that they failed to press the attack or come to his defense once Custer was surrounded.

I’m not sure that they “wanted” him killed, but I will bet that they were not “upset” that he was killed!!

[gogeo]

I think everyone has a list.

[BDParrish]

Thanks for your response BroJoeK, but I wondered if you missed the point of my comment. Are you re-igniting the pointless debate on the causes of the civil war, or are you suggesting that the Northern people did not fight in response to legitimate authority, that they fought only because they felt invaded and today we would not fight unless we felt invaded.

[BroJoeK]

PARrish: "Are you re-igniting the pointless debate on the causes of the civil war, or are you suggesting that the Northern people did not fight in response to legitimate authority, that they fought only because they felt invaded and today we would not fight unless we felt invaded."

Well, I wouldn't "reignite" anything, just respond to numerous claims about an alleged "right of secession" or "right of rebellion", etc.
Our many Lost Causers argue the Declaration of Independence guarantees a right to secede and to rebel, so all Confederates really wanted was independence and to be left alone.

Problem is, none of that is true, in this instance I pointed to numerous Confederate invasions of Union states & territories, some even before any Union force "invaded" the Confederacy.

The Confederate response to Lincoln's call up of 75,000 troops after Fort Sumter, and to his declaration of blockade of Southern ports was a declaration of war against the United States.
Congress declared Confederate States in rebellion and war was on.

So, is something wrong with my legal understanding?

[BroJoeK]

FLT-bird: "You sound to me like a modern Democrat. You’re far more concerned - obsessed really - with defending big government in whatever usurpations of power it wishes to engage in."

Nonsense, I certainly don't defend big government's:

• Dred Scot decision denying a state's right to declare slaves emancipated, giving them citizenship.
  Do you?

• 1850 Compromise making big Federal government, not states, responsible for capturing fugitive slaves.
  Do you?

• Secretary of War Jefferson Davis' Gadsden Purchase ($10 million, nearly 20% of the Federal budget, equivalent to $1 trillion today) and efforts of Senator Davis to have Federal government to construct the first transcendental railroad on the Southern route.
  Do you?

• Southern Democrats first-in-line support for the 16th & 17th amendments.
  Do you?

• Southern Democrats support for progressive big government programs under FDR's New Deal.
  Do you?

As for Lincoln's responses to the Confederate rebellion and declaration of war against the United States, none of that was "big government" and virtually all wartime measures -- including the income tax -- were abolished after the war.
Federal government consumed 2.6% of GDP in 1858, 2.5% in 1871, excluding war-debt payments.
That's the very definition of small government.

"Progressive" non-military big government didn't get under way until 50+ years later with full throated support from Southern Democrats.

But all that big government is A-OK with Flt-bird, right?

[BroJoeK]

castlegreyskull: "Alright, I get it.
You hate the South.."

Nonsense, my mother and half my larger family was/are Southerners, scattered from Texas to Florida, the Carolinas, Virginia & Maryland.
Six of the ten states I've lived in were Southern.

The truth is nobody "hates" Southerners, but we do hate the Godawful lies some Southerners tell each other and us about the Civil War.

castlegreyskull: "you are a big know it all.
But you are still wrong. "

No, I certainly don't "know it all", but must know more that some of you.
Here's the key difference: what I know can be referenced to legitimate sources, while what you claim to know is ultimately pure fantasy.

castlegreyskull: "Bye."

Buh-bye