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Vanity: Enemy of the State

Posted on 11/24/2012 4:33:34 PM PST by chrisser

My wife and I were at my parents for Thanksgiving, along with my sister.

During dinner conversation, we discovered my sister was an enthusiastic Obama supporter. Unfortunately, the conversation ended up in a long political argument. My parents refused to say how they voted, but it was pretty obvious they're drinking the Koolaide too, along with my brother, who wasn't there.

As you can imagine, I've been thinking a lot about this since. There's more than a little bit of regret I have from the conversation, but beyond that, I think it was the first time I've actually come face to face with the mindset of the other side.

Most of you have probably been there and seen the unbelievable lack of information, complete ignorance of history, acceptance of propaganda as fact, and just the stupidity and immorality that otherwise good people can accept.

I'm saddened by the whole episode, but more than that, I'm more than a little afraid. I can't help but think about the history of Nazi and pre-Nazi Germany, of the Russian and Chinese "revolutions", and the other repeated examples of the horrors of socialism and the relative ease with which their countries' populations accepted them, even with enthusiasm.

Again, this is probably old hat to a lot of us here.

But, as I was out in the garage, patching up one of our old cars for the 3rd or 4th time, trying to keep it driveable so we don't have to spend money on a new one (even though we must be "the rich", since our taxes are going to go up even more), I had a lot of time to think, and I'm faced with the reality that, someday in the future, I am likely to be an enemy of the state.

I know I'm not going to be a member of the ruling elite in the coming new order. Nor will I be one of their supporters. That means I'll either be a member of the vocal dissent that gets killed off early on, the resistance that gets hunted down later (I suspect this is where I'll end up), or I can chose to be a slave to the state - and I refuse to be the latter.

It's a sobering thought. I love my country. I never thought I would ever take action against her. But I can't help feeling that, at some point, if I value freedom and my rights as an individual, then I will end up her enemy.

Anyone thought along similar lines? If so, how do you deal with it, 'cause I'm pretty darned depressed about the idea.


TOPICS: Miscellaneous; Society
KEYWORDS: cwii; sharing; stealing; thanksgiving; twoamericas; vanity
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To: dforest

“I really am upset that the bad guys always win. Why is that? Are the good guys just too ball-less to do anything? Do they lack the fortitude to stop this?”

Once upon a time, my old man would say a “good guy” wouldn’t say shit if he had a mouthful. Until you threw some at him. then you’d be screwed.

The Japanese found out about the sleeping giant. And remember this; i could take apart and reassemble a lot of things blindfolded in the dark that your average lib couldn’t even identify. I suspect there are more of us than there are of them.


61 posted on 11/24/2012 5:54:46 PM PST by jessduntno ("Socialism only works...in Heaven where they don't need it and hell where they have it." - RR)
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To: raybbr

Then be ye separate. Find folks who are like and think like you. They are your neighbors, and they’ll be there for your sons, too.

Prayers for you, rr.


62 posted on 11/24/2012 5:57:56 PM PST by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto!)
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To: chrisser

Enemies of the regime, yes; enemies of the country patriots fought and died for, never.


63 posted on 11/24/2012 5:58:11 PM PST by skr (May God confound the enemy)
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To: JRandomFreeper

Contrary to popular belief, the goal in Vietnam and Afghan were not the destruction of the Vietnamese or Muslim Afghanistans, but if some totalitarian regime arises off the blessings of a perverted Supreme Court, then no quater will be given and the strategy of COIN would not be implemented by those who seek to destroy liberty minded individuals. It will be Waco every hour on the hour.


64 posted on 11/24/2012 6:00:36 PM PST by rollo tomasi (Working hard to pay for deadbeats and corrupt politicians.)
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To: chrisser

In my opinion we are already in a “cold” civil war.


65 posted on 11/24/2012 6:01:06 PM PST by Steve Newton (And the Wolves will learn what we have shown before-We love our sheep we dogs of war. Vaughn)
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To: raybbr
The thought that my two sons (10 and 8) will suffer the hatred these people have fomented is what causes me to lose sleep and feel rage towards a group of people that i never imagined possible....the fears i have for my sons’ futures are virtually debilitating.

Please read my post #22 --- my daughters are 8, 9, & 11. I know exactly what you're feeling. I have a visceral, pulsing hatred for those who have destroyed the future my children might have had.

66 posted on 11/24/2012 6:04:12 PM PST by workerbee (The President of the United States is DOMESTIC ENEMY #1)
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To: JRandomFreeper

That is why he is quietly building an air force of drone aircraft. It is just a step away from arming them.


67 posted on 11/24/2012 6:04:25 PM PST by Blood of Tyrants (Why is the government more concerned about protecting a microbe on Mars than an unborn baby here?)
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To: JRandomFreeper
"...the strategy of COIN would not be implemented by those..."

sorry, should be "on those"
68 posted on 11/24/2012 6:06:01 PM PST by rollo tomasi (Working hard to pay for deadbeats and corrupt politicians.)
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To: rollo tomasi
No quarter goes both ways. There are more of us than them. The US military just isn't large enough to do much, unless they want to nuke fly-over country. There's a price to pay for that, as well.

I'll keep my faith in God, and not fear evil.

/johnny

69 posted on 11/24/2012 6:11:04 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: GBA
No argument. No fighting. Humor or soft ridicule or emotionless matter of fact, all very short, no speeches, and quit. No more beating up anyone. Instead, be a resource, not a sparing partner, that's my new approach.

These people need education and it's hard to get them to lower their shields enough for them to see that.

Once that's accomplished, it's all about selling and you already have the best products! Learn how to sell.

Agree Wholeheartedly
My husband and I are doing this now to people we talk to out and about, people posting to on message boards, etc. No flame wars, no arguing to the nth degree.

Humor, short answers, facts, research suggestions...well wishes of "well, have fun with that...hope it works out for you..."
Walk away
In person they look at you strange - yearning for the fight - they aren't getting it anymore - they are very disappointed and trying to figure out what's going on...as we walk away

Consider yourself a teacher in the inner city - you aren't going to make them learn - they have to want to learn and seek you out...be funny, short, give dribbles of interesting info, don't teach the unteachable-kick them out of your class - make them ask for more, not challenge your lesson plan....to do otherwise, you're just a burnt-out tenured teacher going through the motions.

70 posted on 11/24/2012 6:12:35 PM PST by libertarian27 (Check my profile page for the FReeper Online Cookbook 2011)
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To: sauropod

No it isn’t


71 posted on 11/24/2012 6:13:01 PM PST by norton
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To: Blood of Tyrants
'He' isn't building them. Americans in fly-over country are building them. He and his couldn't assemble a plastic model aircraft.

They can't have a war unless red states provide their arms. And we built any arms they have.

Even 10,000 drone aircraft won't do much against a country as large as ours, and a population as dispersed.

Logistics, logistics, logistics.

/johnny

72 posted on 11/24/2012 6:15:07 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: chrisser
I'm not as worried about the military as I am of my fellow citizens. The government won't have to hunt us down, our friends, neighbors and family will happily serve us up to them, once we're sufficiently demonized.

That is why, as soon as I found out who of my friends voted for obama, I cut off contact. (90% of my family voted conservative/Republican.) I will get off Facebook, too. No good thing will come of me giving my strong opinion or showing my hand. You, alone, cannot fix stupid. They will literally have to have a true "come to Jesus moment,"

73 posted on 11/24/2012 6:16:27 PM PST by madison10
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To: wastedyears
Except they have armored vehicles, air superiority, control of the internet, and nukes.

Our forefathers won a war against the military might of the most powerful empire on earth, with little more than untrained farmers with muskets and guts.

The US military was tied up in Iraq for more than eight years by a few thousand uneducated camel jockeys with AK-47s and improvised explosive devices.

And you think a force of 90 million well armed Americans has any reason to fear ANY army? Get a grip on the reality of the situation.

74 posted on 11/24/2012 6:16:35 PM PST by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: JRandomFreeper
Off the grid because technology will cover a multiple logistics/personnel obstacles. And you are 100% correct about your final part. My kids are what I worry about the most going out into the mess ours and previous generations voted for willingly.
75 posted on 11/24/2012 6:16:35 PM PST by rollo tomasi (Working hard to pay for deadbeats and corrupt politicians.)
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To: chrisser
Well...if it comes to that, here's a tip that's backed up by history. Tyrants start off by killing their political rivals, not dissidents. They then busy themselves cracking out orders, and rely on the relief reflex (as well as propaganda) to get their ordinary subjects to like and identify with them. They lay low for a while so as to let the shock from the massacre of their rivals to dissipate. During that time, they tend to play nice to ordinary folks. They also need that breathing space to make sure their henchmen are well prepared to, ah, 'govern'.

So, if you see opposing politicians being hauled to the hoosegow, publicly offed or "disappearing," you'll have some time to take stock and decide whether or not to get out of Dodge - or to refine a plan for protecting yourself if you choose to stay.

Joining up with like-minded compadres is risky. On the one hand, a dictator may decide to tolerate a large cluster of dissidents or sit and wait to see if the opposition will throw the first punch. (Then, of course, a massacre can be justified as 'defensive'.) On the other hand, a dictator determined to off a cluster of dissidents will find it easy because they're all in one place.

Going it alone has parallel risks. On the one hand, there's the chance of being sized up as the lone nut that's not worth bothering with. On the other hand, being alone in a crowd of supporters makes it easy for the secret police to pick you off and bundle you away (or kill you.) And, of course, all of your neighbours will understand why and likely shrug their shoulders.

The trouble with sticking together with a small community of fellow dissidents is the ease at which they can be pegged as a criminal gang. Offing those dissident groups or packing them off to a concentration camp seems little different to the propagandized than the round-up of a motorcycle gang.

Given America, unless you decide to bug out, I'd say that your best chance will come with joining a very large group of like-minded dissidents. Americans are joiners, and they respect strength in numbers. They won't change that even in an America governed by a dictator.

But make very sure that the group is not seriously preparing to mount a revolution! Massacres can be whitewashed if they're done under the cover of "civil war." If there's no such pretext, they'll be recognized as political genocides. The resultant hostility on the world stage might well be enough to deter the dictator from starting a massacre.

So, the best group to join would be the largest group of like-minded patriots who: a) say "Here I stand [opposed], I can do no other;" b) confine their opposition to words.

If you're interested, the quiet anti-Nazis found a welcome home in Cologne provided they did not openly cause trouble for the Nazis. Konrad Adenauer, West Germany's first Premier, was Mayor there during the Nazi interregnum and he helped shelter (prudent) opponents of the regime.

A side note: if you're thinking of joining the resistance, it would be best to appear as helpless/hapless as possible. Dictators' henchmen are brutes. Like all brutes, they despise the "weak" and tend to think they're no threat. The most effective Resistancer will be the mouse: the guy who everyone swears doesn't have it in him. Swaggerers will be watched very closely. People hidden in plain view, because they are deemed inferior (but still useful,) won't be.

76 posted on 11/24/2012 6:19:20 PM PST by danielmryan
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To: Windflier

Without France financing a huge part of the Revolution, those untrained farmers would of been destroyed eventually. Heck, before Franklin appeased France for more assistance the revolutionaries were running thin on supplies. First rule of revolutions, find a country that is well off and wishes to finance your cause while feeling out other countries as well.


77 posted on 11/24/2012 6:23:12 PM PST by rollo tomasi (Working hard to pay for deadbeats and corrupt politicians.)
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To: rollo tomasi
My kids are what I worry about

Prayers for you and yours.

I am blessed that mine are grown and gone, and the grandkids have at least met me.

I'm not afraid of that dark night, but I don't expect I'll go quietly.

There are advantages to being single.

/johnny

78 posted on 11/24/2012 6:24:30 PM PST by JRandomFreeper (Gone Galt)
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To: rollo tomasi
Without France financing a huge part of the Revolution, those untrained farmers would of been destroyed eventually. Heck, before Franklin appeased France for more assistance the revolutionaries were running thin on supplies. First rule of revolutions, find a country that is well off and wishes to finance your cause while feeling out other countries as well.

Interesting point. You do realize that the red states are responsible for most of the real economic production and wealth creation in this country, don't you? We're the ones supporting the beast we want to disconnect from - not the other way around.

Secession by several states won't require foreign financial assistance because we won't be fighting a war over this.

79 posted on 11/24/2012 6:27:34 PM PST by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: Windflier

Yea, but are you willing to take out your own family? They could very well be the ones who rat you out. The America experiment is over, not that a lot of us won’t go out fighting, but it will never be the same.


80 posted on 11/24/2012 6:28:27 PM PST by stevio (God, guns, guts.)
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