Posted on 01/30/2012 9:35:38 AM PST by Daffynition
SILVERTON — Turkish sheepdogs prized for their fierceness are raising concerns they may be a little too tough for the southwest Colorado communities where ranchers are using them.
The Akbash dogs weigh up to 120 pounds and are especially aggressive toward animals near the sheep they guard. But that can include hikers and other backcountry tourists, prompting debate about whether the breed should be regulated.
The Durango Herald reports that Silverton town trustees met last week to discuss Akbash conflictsU.S. Forest Service officials, sheepherders and outdoors enthusiasts have also entered the debate over regulations surrounding the use of the breed.
(Excerpt) Read more at gazette.com ...
Just don’t shoot a dog because he barks at you is all I’d say. That’s what cops are for, I understand.
You need to be prepared/practiced to avoid and protect yourself in the case of non-avoidance.
Yep, dogs like to challenge. It’s all about the response.
“So you’re saying your are armed while hiking?”
For the sake of argument, I’ll say Yes
“Do you have a permit?”
Same answer, and I’ll add that I shouldn’t need a permit other than the 2nd ammendmnt
“Is that allowed on BLM land?”
Did the BLM somehow repeal the 2nd ammendment?
“You’re saying you’ll shoot his dog?”
If it attacks me, hell yes. If the shepherd attacks, I’d shoot him too.
“In open timber you could walk right into a herd of sheep and probably not know it - it just depends on how spread out they are.”
In the San Juans up there, you can literally turn a corner and find them filling the dirt road in front of you, with sheep 40 or 50 yards on either side of the road. You can head up a narrow valley as a hiker and have the same thing happen.
Welfare ranchers graze for a pittance, compared to what it would be to lease graze rights in a private property state such as Texas. They have a 10 acre “ranch” and lease huge swaths of public land. The permit allows you to graze, fine, but then they fantasize that they own that public land. They are not landowners who can become a menace to other legitimate users.
Well then, I guess you’re all set, aren’t you....mind the sheepherder, though....he might be armed, too!
Though dogs are not all that bright, they are generally predictable. Don’t F with them on their own territory without really good treat offerings.
This reminds me of an issue we had when we lived in the country. A neighbor whose property was right behind ours leased space to bee keepers to put their bees there (I think they moved the bees from one place to the other during the year). But there was apparently no water close by for the bees, so they swarmed into MY yard (I had a couple of acres) and used my koi pond for drinking. It was a problem for me because the large number of bees actually brought the level of the pond down daily —it wasn’t a huge pond, just an ornamental pond with a water fall and 4 large koi. This meant I was constantly having to fill it up. Plus the fact that I’m allergic to bees and I had to wade thru them to do it. I just didn’t think that was my job, since my neighbors were making money to keep the bees on their property not me.
But lots of people are not good neighbors.
“So you’re saying your are armed while hiking? Do you have a permit? Is that allowed on BLM land?”
LOL,, omg, you REALLY aren’t from around here, are you? No permit needed. Not on BLM or Nat Forests in New Mexico and Colorado. Only national parks had some restrictions, and those are mostly gone now too. So yes, i pack a very slick 1911 45acp. In fact im horrified at hiking without.
Well,,,, at least I did one thing right today! I’d bet it’s a quote from that guy!
Doesn’t seem like a large problem. Keep your fish indoors for a year while ‘splainin’ to the neighbor and encouraging him to build his own pond. (If he is not engageable, build a bee killing trap.)
From what I know, first hand, the fear is both religious, coupled with fear of rabies.
(A respectful) DUH!
“You’re saying you’ll shoot his dog?”
Well I’d prefer not to. And if i can avoid it, i sure would. It isn’t the dogs fault, but that doesnt mean i’ll get mauled out of softheartedness. So i would likely try to back away if possible, or fire a shot in front of it to hopefully dissuade it if it continued being aggressive.
But as a last yes, resort i have no obligation to get bitten. Especially since i will never do anything to bother livestock. For everyone who says back away,, that doesn’t always work. It can make a dog more agressive when they see you backing down. So he might wind up getting his lamp blowed out.
Very sad for the dog,, but i blame the owner. And im surprised at people who think it’s just fine to release an aggressive animal on public land and then screech if someone defends theirself.
Muslims should not keep dogs as pets. Muhammed made some exceptions for dogs that serve a useful purpose. Any black dog of any breed should be killed. - Tom
From Muslim #3814-- Ibn Mughaffal reported: Allah's messenger ordered the killing of dogs and then said, "what is the trouble with them (the people of Medina? How dogs are nuisances to them (the citizens of Medina)? He then permitted keeping of dogs for hunting and (the protection of) herds. ...[and for] for the protection of cultivated land.
“Your right to tramp about in the woods is no greater than a grazing lease holder’s right to protect his stock.”
I know,, it’s exactly the same, not greater. If another hiker went crazed and came after me with a hatchet, because he mistakenly thought i stole his lawnchair,,, then i can defend myself.
Likewise,, if the dog says “say,,that human over there is probably a rustler, i had better attack him”, then i can defend myself if he doesn’t stop his attack.
The sheepherders security system needs to reflect reality. Just as he cannot fire shots at anyone passing by on a mountain bike or ATV,, his dog may not attack me.
He knew that when he started to graze in an area that is already densely used for recreation, long before he became a “rancher”.
They are predictable (most of the time —a few especially Chows don’t nec follow the rules) but I find many people these days don’t read dog body language well. I think that accounts for the high bite rate.
“then doesn’t that make it private land for the term of the lease?”
NO, it means they can have animals out there to eat the grass. In some cases they might be allowed to make improvements such as improving water. But Forest or BLM most assuredly remains public land with full rights for everyone else. The only exclusitivity the lease gives is that nobody else may graze livestock there.
“Just don’t shoot a dog because he barks at you is all I’d say.”
Of course not. But if it attacks someone not harrassing livestock, that has to be stopped. And respect for a dog asks for that. But in the end,,, if you are trying to avoid, and a dog mistakenly goes after you,, you sadly do what you have to do.
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