Once and for all, proof that Macs are cheaper than PCs

Machinist.Salon ^ | By Farhad Manjoo

[Swordmaker]

If you want on or off the Mac Ping List, Freepmail me.

[A_Tradition_Continues]

Let’s see...I’ve got a 3.2 gigahertz Intel processor, 2 gigs RAM, LITE-ON DVDRW SHW-160P6S [CD-ROM drive]
TSSTcorp CD-R/RW TS-H292C [CD-ROM drive], 160 gigabytes of HD, Creative Sound Blaster 5.1, HP vs 19” monitor with XP Pro with less than $400.00 invested. Apple can’t beat that.

[Filo]

The article presents a stupid argument. Most folks don’t sell their PCs every year. Purchase price is the only real gauge of what you’re paying and the Mac will set you back at least 50% more than the comparably equipped PC.

Aside from the logo you really don’t get that much more for your money.

Worse, if you become a “Mac person” you’ll end up virtually computer illiterate and unable to use real PCs in the real world.

Most PC folks can at least get by on a Mac. The reverse is, in my experience, rarely true.

I have both Macs and PCs scattered around the house. Macs are nice, but not worth the price.

Unfortunately I’m just about to shell out 3K+ for a Mac tower because my wife can’t seem to do her job on the PC that we just bought for 1/3 of that. . .

[GRRRRR]

What brand or did you build it yourself from spare parts?. XP Pro alone is almost $200 isn’t it? Intel Celeron CPU at 3.2 is 50 bucks. Now, what about DVD burning software like TOAST, photography software like Photoshop, movie making software like Pinnacle etc.

These software packages all come Standard in Leopard.

Don’t get Mac if you don’t want one, but it IS the best value for the moola! This comes from someone who’s been building their own Windows machines for about ten years and just got tired of all the crapola with Windows everytime I built one, drivers, HD’s not being recognized etc.

They do work!

[discostu]

This is pretty goofy “proof”. For one thing people don’t replace computers every year, or even every two years. And even in things that people do replace regularly analysts know that high resale value doesn’t make it cheaper, it makes the second more affordable but that’s different. Then of course there’s the lame assumption that Windows users just throw away computers when they’re replaced, simply not true, we might not resell them but that doesn’t mean they stop being used, my wife has my previous machine, and the one before that will go to one of a variety of friends and relatives.

[The_Reader_David]

. . .if you become a “Mac person” you’ll end up virtually computer Windows illiterate and unable to use real Windows-based PCs in the real world environments with insular IT departments.

Computer illiterate? Except for those of us who can write code, or maybe only code in some dialect of C, we're all bloody computer illiterate.

Basically if you use a Mac you don't learn to navigate the ghastly counter-intuitive structure of Windows where all the defaults assume the user is stupid, and the ways to change them are burried (a problem with all MS products, including Office, which even us Mac users have to suffer with), unless you're forced to use a machine with one of the wretched OS on it.

That's a bit like sneering that one is 'tax code illiterate' if one has had the good fortune to only have to fill out Pennsylvania state income tax forms, rather than California state income tax forms.

[Severa]

Or if you're like me, you can get a no OS operating system from Tigerdirect complete with 17 in LCD monitor (Intel P4 3.0Ghz, 1GB RAM, 80GB HD, $700) and load Ubuntu Linux on it. *s*

Really though, BUY WHAT SUITS YOUR NEEDS. My husband has a Sony Vaio with XP (He's a gamer). Linux works for me (basic email, websurfing, and my Avon business). Someone else may need to buy a Mac for what they need. To each his (or her) own.

[Yossarian]

Unfortunately I’m just about to shell out 3K+ for a Mac tower because my wife can’t seem to do her job on the PC that we just bought for 1/3 of that. . .

If I were you, I'd wait a few weeks before springing for the Mac Pro tower - the current models are out of date, and they are due to get upgrades to Intel's Penryn chip very soon.

[HAL9000]

Let’s see...I’ve got a 3.2 gigahertz Intel processor, 2 gigs RAM, LITE-ON DVDRW SHW-160P6S [CD-ROM drive] TSSTcorp CD-R/RW TS-H292C [CD-ROM drive], 160 gigabytes of HD, Creative Sound Blaster 5.1, HP vs 19” monitor with XP Pro with less than $400.00 invested. Apple can’t beat that.

You omitted the most important specification - the operating system. That factor is far more important than the hardware nowadays.

If the operating system is some low-quality crap like Desktop Linux or Microsoft Windows, then Apple is a much better value.

[wardaddy]

too many lib genx and echo boomers use macs.

great screens though

[HAL9000]

Oops - I see that you did specify the OS - XP Pro. Sorry I missed that.

[Mr. Blonde]

Purchase price is the only real gauge of what you’re paying

I would say total cost of ownership is the real guage of what you are paying. Apple wins that. They are useful for longer and you don't have to worry about messing with viruses and malware.

Worse, if you become a “Mac person” you’ll end up virtually computer illiterate and unable to use real PCs in the real world.

It can be hard going from an enjoyable user experience to a painful one like you get on Windows. However, most Mac users can in fact get by on a Windows machine. Chances are they have had to use them at some point extensively and that is why they are now on Mac.

[Mr. Jeeves]

Worse, if you become a “Mac person” you’ll end up virtually computer illiterate and unable to use real PCs in the real world.

You might become "Windows illiterate", but Windows literacy consists largely of memorizing hundreds of hacks and workarounds specific to remediating the endemic flaws of the operating system. A Mac user would have no particular problem switching to a Linux PC. ;)

[scottdeus12]

“too many lib genx and echo boomers use macs.”

Guess that makes me an echo boomer...I’ve used both for years, Macs are superior.

[x]

Thanks to Apple's relentless flash -- the John Hodgman ads, the iPods, the iPhones -- its Macintosh business is now in league with that of the biggest PC companies in the world.

John Hodgman is PC.

Justin Long is Mac.

It's ironic if the clueless PC guy is the ads' real star.

[Filo]

Computer illiterate? Except for those of us who can write code, or maybe only code in some dialect of C, we're all bloody computer illiterate.

Be that as it may (and I am a 20+ year SW engineer) I've been around the block and have seen what Mac people can do on non-Mac machines and what PC people can do on non-PC machines. Mac people are usually completely lost on anything but a Mac.

I’ve dealt with literally thousands of users to come to this conclusion.

Basically if you use a Mac you don't learn to navigate the ghastly counter-intuitive structure of Windows [...]

MacOS and Windows got their start from the same source. They are very similar and neither has a monopoly on intuitive interface or ease of use.

The Mac (correctly) assumes far more stupidity than the PC.

I would say total cost of ownership is the real guage of what you are paying. Apple wins that.

Even if I were to agree with that I'd still disagree that Macs win.

The base machine usually costs 2 to 3 times as much for the same stuff and Mac upgrades are usually at least twice as expensive. Need more RAM? You can't buy the standard sticks, you need the parity stuff for $100s more - and so on.

Plus Mac software tends to cost more.

As for the virus and malware argument, the real issue is that the coders don’t bother with Macs because nobody uses them. . . that's hardly a real advantage. It can be hard going from an enjoyable user experience to a painful one like you get on Windows.

I'm sorry but I've been using Macs since the original Macintosh and I've been using Windows since version 1. I've found both OSs to be buggy, painful, counter intuitive and annoying at times. I can't make the call which is worse.

Macs are somewhat easier on the basics but if you try to do anything advanced you'll end up cursing more on a Mac than a PC, from my experience.

[Sunnyflorida]

“To each his (or her) own.”

Exactly. I for one look around my life and I’m sure there is a cheaper product for everything. What a life were you can never choose quality over price. People that do that have a sad existence.

[HAL9000]

Worse, if you become a “Mac person” you’ll end up virtually computer illiterate and unable to use real PCs in the real world.

I strongly disagree. In my experience, the average Mac user has better computer literacy than the average Windows user. I frequently work with Windows users, and they are generally ignorant about the workings of computers. When something goes wrong and their in-house "experts" can't figure it out, they contact me - a guy who knows very little about Windows, but still gets their problems solved. Ironically, they wouldn't be having the problem in the first place if they used a Mac.

[Crusher138]

Bought an XP system just over two years ago for $1800. It had a high end video card (that I had to replace last year because of an intermittent problem the manufacture would acknowledge) 2 GB of RAM, a 500GB hard drive. I had to purchase anti-virus and anti-spyware software. Office set me back about $200. Even with updated definitions, something got through and deleted my Windows directory. Yes, I could reinstall and restore, but it would take hours. I had my data backed up, but all the games, applications, drivers, etc., were going to have to be reinstalled. Ugh. As I was doing just that - and cursing mightily - my wife suggested that it may just be easier to purchase a new computer.

This machine was for the kids (15 and 11) so I took the eldest to CompUSA to help pick out a computer. On a Saturday there were about a dozen shoppers and little staff. We looked at the HP's, Compaqs, Acers, and store brands. A couple of machines were higher-end, but pricey. Few of them were fully functional. We couldn't find anyone to help us. When I started adding up all that we would need (new version of Office, new anti-virus, etc.) it was closing in on $2K. We could have cheaped out, but Vista ran like a dog on machines with less than 2 GB of RAM and built in graphics. My son really didn't like Vista. He was used to XP and called Vista "confusing." We then went to the Apple Store. Same day, but a world of difference. There were about a dozen employees servicing at least two dozen customers. The store was clean. The machines were all working. We were assisted right away. We ended up with a 20" IMac with 2 GB of RAM for about $1400. We did add IWorks for $79 which includes Office compatible word processing, spreadsheet, and presentation software. The new Leopard OSX is amazing and, according to my son, easy to use. If we feel an urge to use XP, the Mac comes with with Boot Camp and after installing his old copy of XP, it runs much faster than his old computer.

I have been a Wintel person since before Windows. I have owned many computers and have managed NT and Server 2003 networks with over 30 users. Between an expensive OS, constant threat of viruses and spyware, driver issues, hardware issues, etc., Microsoft has pushed me over to the other side. I will probably still deal with Windows at work (when I am on someone else's dime) but for my money, my time, and my sanity, I am buying Macs from now on.