Calling All Christians: Luke 22:36 is NOT license to fight the government. (VANITY)

Me | 03/19/2013 | Me

[ROTB]

Hello Brothers and Sisters –

There’s an insidious heresy going around the Body of Christ. It sounds something like this:

“[Because of the license given by the LORD Jesus to believers in Luke 22:36-38 to carry and use deadly weapons, I say, “Better the death of Masada than the death of Dachau when the government illegally violates the 2^nd amendment, and lawlessly comes to confiscate my gun(s)]”.

Before we begin, let’s remember that Scripture has no contradictions per John 10:35, and per 2 Timothy 2:15 there is a right and wrong way to interpret scripture. It is even possible per 2 Peter 3:16 to twist scripture to our own destruction.

Let’s look at Luke 22:36-38 more closely. I always put scripture in bold, and the words of the LORD Jesus are in bold red.

Then said he unto them, “But now, he that hath a purse, let him take [it], and likewise [his] scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one. For I say unto you, that this that is written must yet be accomplished in me, And he was reckoned among the transgressors: for the things concerning me have an end.” And they said, Lord, behold, here [are] two swords. And he said unto them, “It is enough.”

Luke 22:36-38

We will now break down the above three verses laboriously so we understand exactly what is being said in each part:

“He that has no sword … let him buy one”		the disciples should acquire swords
that this that is written		so the Scripture I am about to quote
must yet be accomplished in me		must and will happen right now to me
And he		Isaiah 53:12 being quoted: he = Jesus
was reckoned among the transgressors		Isaiah 53:12 being quoted: was counted with sinners
And they said, “Lord, behold, here [are] two swords”		the disciples tell Jesus they have two swords
Jesus says, “It is enough”		Jesus confirms the disciples have enough swords to fulfill Isaiah 53:12

I have parsed Luke 22:36-38 in a way that is consistent with classic commentaries on Luke 22:36-38 by Matthew Henry and Jamieson Fausset & Brown, and you will find they don’t give any license at all to taking up arms against authorities.

Jesus wanted the disciples to buy swords, so scripture could be fulfilled when His disciples wielded swords and made themselves "transgressors" for Jesus to be "reckoned among the transgressors."

So, if you also want to be a “transgressor”, despite scripture telling us to be “perfect” in Matthew 5:48, Matthew 19:21, Luke 6:40, John 17:23, 1 Corinthians 2:6, 2 Corinthians 13:11, Philippians 3:15, 1 Thessalonians 3:10, 2 Timothy 3:17, Hebrews 13:21, don’t pray for yourself to grow and for others to be saved, drop your Bible, pick up your gun, and steel yourself to fight the government agents who may come for it.

Jesus said the word never contradicts itself in John 10:35. So when Jesus, who is the Word, and LORD, and the 2nd person of the Godhead, said in Matthew 26:52, “Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword,” it is in perfect harmony with the above interpretation of Luke 22:36-38.

Otherwise, you would have to think that the LORD God, who made every star, world, plant and animal in all their glorious majesty and order in 6 days, and is called Master, and LORD, the Rock, and The Good Shepherd, would so plainly contradict Himself.

So when scripture says very plainly in 1 Peter 2:13 that we should, “Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme; Or unto governors, as to them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well”, no license is given to us to rebel against governing authorities. If you think you’re only supposed to submit to a nation’s laws if the laws are “good” and “not evil” in your eyes, please show me the Scriptures that justify this point of view. I could have missed them.

If despite all the above scripture, your attitude is still that of “God will forgive me for rebelling and fighting the government when they come for my guns” then ask yourself if God would also forgive witchcraft given 1 Samuel 15:23 says “rebellion is as the sin of witchcraft”. If your response is that “The context of 1 Samuel 15:23 is rebellion against God, not against government.” Then I must point you to Romans 13:4 which that government “bears not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to [execute] wrath upon him that does evil”. Government is a minister of God. Therefore, if rebellion against God is sin per 1 Samuel 15:23, why is rebellion against a “minister of God” per Romans 13:4 NOT sin? If government forces kill you when you rebel with arms, it’s with God’s backing and approval. Titus 3:1 echoes Romans 13:4 and 1 Peter 2:13 in that we as Christians are to be subject to whatever government is placed by God over us. Jude 1:8 even associates those who “despise dominion” with a host of other unsavory and damnable sins.

Many a self-professed Christian “patriot” who would think nothing of pointing a gun at a government agent and squeezing the trigger, would quickly and decisively declare they would never partake in witchcraft, since it is so clearly a damnable sin committed by the arch-enemies of Jesus Christ.

Yet, the rebellion you still desire “is as” damnable witchcraft in God’s eyes.

Also, again, when you rebel with arms, you invite China/Russia/etc parking a few subs off our coasts or carriers, and nuking our ICBM fields and military bases during the confusion caused by CW2. China/Russia/etc would be fools not to take advantage of your rebellion, and they are not fools.

Furthermore, it is not necessary at all to fight tyrannical government with physical arms if we:

1. take up the New Covenant defensive and offensive spiritual weapons of God per Ephesians 6:12 and 2 Corinthians 10:3-4 against evil spirits that stir up our elected and appointed officials to do evil

2. we pray with faith since God can control and guide the hearts of President Obama, Congress, the Supreme Court, government bureaucrats, governors, mayors, state legislators, city councils, the Police, and our Armed Forces per Proverbs 21:1, and we are commanded to pray for them per 1 Timothy 2:1-3. We pray that many witnesses of the Gospel be sent to them per Matthew 9:37, they be convicted of sin like in Acts 2:37, and that God grants them repentance per 2 Timothy 2:25

Only then will our politicians lead us with ever increasing prudence, and Godly wisdom. I'm talking about prayer for President Obama, Congress, and others in government.

I have carefully interpreted Luke 22:36-38, and found two classic Christian commentaries that agree with my interpretation.

We're Christians, so if our feelings contradict Scripture, they are error.

After I stood face to face with a Mormon and tore down Joseph Smith and/or the reliability of the Book of Mormon, he put his hands on his chest, looked at me very earnestly, and told me that the Holy Spirit tells him the Book of Mormon is of God. In truth, that was a lying deceiving spirit in that Mormon. Mormonism was founded on the premise that the Church founded in the 1^st century with the LORD'S promise in Matthew 16:18 that it would never fall, actually did fall, making Jesus who is the truth, into a liar.

Therefore, to avoid error we need to give scriptural reasons for why we believe what we believe, and do what we do.

To give a scriptural reply of substance you might:

1. Parse Luke 22:36-38 in an intelligible way where the disciples are NOT transgressors

2. Find a reputable commentary that agrees with your position

3. Given John 10:35 says scripture has no contradictions, please explain how your interpretation of Luke 22:36-38 does not conflict with:

   1. Matthew 26:52 which says, “Then said Jesus unto him, ‘Put up again thy sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.’ ”

2. Matthew 5:44 which says, “Love your enemies.”

3. Titus 3:1-2 which says, “Put them in mind to be subject to principalities and powers, to obey magistrates, to be ready to every good work, To speak evil of no man, to be no brawlers, [but] gentle, shewing all meekness unto all men.”

4. 1 Peter 2:13-14 which says, “Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme; Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evildoers, and for the praise of them that do well.”

5. Romans 13:1-2 which says, “Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. Whosoever therefore resists the power, resists the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation.”

Too many times have I posted calls to prayer for the conviction, salvation to saving faith in Jesus Christ, and repentance of our politicians, the Democrats, the Communists, the Muslims, and other assorted 5^th column type people in the USA, and the response here on FreeRepublic.com has typically been, “[I’m not going to pray for them, this country is going down the tubes, Jesus said in Luke 22:36 I’m allowed to shoot people, so when the government sends soldiers or police for my guns, there’ll be hell to pay.]”

I pray the Holy Spirit convict us, so we return to the true faith of Jesus Christ, that our nation be saved. Luke 22:36 was never meant as license for Christians to take up arms.

[sport]

How long have you been working for obama?

[taxcontrol]

When good men do nothing, evil prevails. Taking up arms against evil and tyranny is not only necessary when there are no other avenues of resistance.

[GenXteacher]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W87k64HU9gE

Our liberties are a priceless legacy, paid for in the blood of every man who died in every war, or in the blood of those killed by us in every war. And when Caesar comes to take away that which is NOT his, what then? The Lord did say something about “Thou shalt not steal”, and those who filch our rights are thieves....

As for the Russians and the Chinese, well, if we can’t defend ourselves from godless communist usurpers at home, then we have less chance with godless communist usurpers abroad.

[Fiji Hill]

Furthermore, it is not necessary at all to fight tyrannical government with physical arms if we:

take up the New Covenant defensive and offensive spiritual weapons of God per Ephesians 6:12 and 2 Corinthians 10:3-4 against evil spirits that stir up our elected and appointed officials to do evil

we pray with faith since God can control and guide the hearts of President Obama, Congress, the Supreme Court, government bureaucrats, governors, mayors, state legislators, city councils, the Police, and our Armed Forces per Proverbs 21:1, and we are commanded to pray for them per 1 Timothy 2:1-3. We pray that many witnesses of the Gospel be sent to them per Matthew 9:37, they be convicted of sin like in Acts 2:37, and that God grants them repentance per 2 Timothy 2:25

Prayer isn't always enough. Sometimes we have to beat our pruning hooks into spears and our plowshares into swords and be Old Testament warriors in the tradition of Joshua, Gideon and Ehud.

[Sloth]

If you think you’re only supposed to submit to a nation’s laws if the laws are “good” and “not evil” in your eyes, please show me the Scriptures that justify this point of view.

Daniel 6:10.

[MeganC]

“Give ‘em Watts, boys!” - Rev. James Caldwell

[INVAR]

Again and again you felt he need to scream at Conservative Christians with your own particular understanding?

If your stance is biblical - then God blessed Christians who sinned against His Word (and defying Romans 13) in their rebellion against the lawful, legal authority of the Crown by taking up arms against them.

Historically and biblically - your argument is moot except for those who like the Quakers, lectured for over a decade that the Colonists needed to simply submit to tyranny because they deserved it, rather than take a stand against it.

I’ll take Franklin’s admonition over your insistences: “Disobedience to tyrants, is obedience to God”. Our own history proved that out.

Submitting to the authority of tyrants, is breaking the First Commandment , something you are unwittingly advocating.

[Pox]

I don’t care what YOU say nor do I care what YOUR interpretations may be, however, I decided that posting a response to your gibberish would be a useful idea if you’re interested in learning something about yourself.

You are a coward and a fool.

If you actually care why I label you as such, reply and I’ll elaborate.

[Longbow1969]

Prayer is excellent, but sometimes you need to actually do stuff beyond that.

Your posts and interpretations of the Bible seem like a regular call to surrender to Obama and whatever policies the left wishes to impose on the people. That is bad advice and a poor reading of the Lord's word.

Also, this is a political site and the vast, overwhelming majority of folks are talking about strategies to defeat the left in the court of public opinion and at the ballot box. It seems like you are trying to bait people with your silly posts.

[CatherineofAragon]

I’ve never seen anyone try to interpret Luke 22:36 the way you are doing. Every commentary I’ve seen says that Jesus was trying to prepare His disciples for life after He was gone——they would be going out into a very dangerous world, and would need to defend themselves.

Your tone seems to indicate you believe you’re instructing morons here, but your interpretation of the passage is wrong.

[tacticalogic]

Matthew 22:21

Sometimes Caesar is due an ass kicking.

[DuncanWaring]

Submitting to the authority of tyrants, is breaking the First Commandment , something you are unwittingly advocating.

Good point.

[ArrogantBustard]

Sometimes we have to beat our pruning hooks into spears and our plowshares into swords

Looks like I'm not the only one who has read the Prophet Joel.

[Hayride]

The gov’t has decloaked and it’s plain to see they are involved in an organized criminal operation on steroids. What should the Christian do when the gov’t classifies Christianity as a hate crime and outlaws it? If you think they’d never do such a thing, read up on the NDAA and ask yourself if there is anything they’re not capable of.

[45Auto]

There is nothing in Scripture that prohibits self defense. I don't know about Protestant denominations, but the Catholic Catechism is very specific about self defense:

CCC#2264 "Love toward oneself remains a fundamental principle of morality. Therefore it is legitimate to insist on respect for one's own right to life. Someone who defends his life is not guilty of murder even if he is forced to deal his aggressor a lethal blow: If a man in self-defense uses more than necessary violence, it will be unlawful: whereas if he repels force with moderation, his defense will be lawful. . . . Nor is it necessary for salvation that a man omit the act of moderate self-defense to avoid killing the other man, since one is bound to take more care of one's own life than of another's."

CCC #2265 "Legitimate defense can be not only a right but a grave duty for one who is responsible for the lives of others. The defense of the common good requires that an unjust aggressor be rendered unable to cause harm. For this reason, those who legitimately hold authority also (but not exclusively) have the right to use arms to repel aggressors against the civil community entrusted to their responsibility."

[txrefugee]

God is changeless. He directed Israel in Old Testament times to kill everything that moved when they were attacking their enemies. That’s my interpretation.

[DesertRhino]

Wrong. Government is not Gods work, it is mans. Nazis, NKVD men, Che’, Moslem Brotherhood, Mao,, all are deserving of the sword of resistance. (as approved by our lord)

And should some government buy 2700 MRAPS, a billion 40 hollow points, intercept and store every electronic message we send, claim the entire nation as a “battlefield”, claim a right to kill it’s citizens with drones, and ultimately complete it’s descent into a police state, they will deserve the same courtesy.

[DesertRhino]

Then by your logic, the founding fathers were sinning by not submitting to King George.

[Marcella]

You are back, spouting the same drivel again. You have been called a hieratic before on another one of your threads and that Freeper was right. I hope your thread, this one, gets pulled. You keep posting that link for us to go to and sign up or support your cause, so you are a blog pimp.

[Marcella]

ping to this thread.