Posted on 04/06/2021 9:46:53 AM PDT by Red Badger
I took a cosmology course (as opposed to cosmotology) in Graduate school decades ago. Was an elective to my Aeronautics/Astronautics major. I dont recall much but since you seem current on such phenomena, I will ask, “how can anything, even x-rays and radiation, escape the gravity well where not even light can escape?”
Then there is the Great Attractor, toward which the entire Universe is moving. Is it a super mega gigantic stupendous ultra dense massive black hole? We don’t know because it is obscured by dust clouds from our Earthly vantage point.
Or is it some sort of construction by some ultra advanced beings who have existed since the beginning of the Universe, made to open a gateway between multiple Universes? See Stephen Baxter’s “Xeelee” series for hard science speculation on such a thing.
Particle-antiparticle creation on the cusp of the event horizon? One falls in leaving the other to avoid an annihilation event, thus it continues existence in this universe as a real particle.
Hawking Radiation
What’s the point though? May as well just look at a cue ball. It is round and dense. The end.
They aren’t coming from inside the event horizon, but rather from close to it. Much like the water in your bath tub doesn’t simply flow directly into the drain - but rather swirls around it - matter will tend to do the same with a black hole (or really any object with mass). Consider as well that a black hole that doesn’t spin (a Schwarzschild black hole) probably doesn’t exist. So you add frame-dragging into the mix as well and you have even more reason to pull matter into the plane of spin rather than directly into the black hole.
Now when we talk about Hawking radiation, this is where the quantum world meets the observable universe in a weird way. Those quantum effects (essentially random particle-antiparticle pair creation) happen everywhere, but at the event horizon of the black hole, they can happen in such a way that they become real (rather than virtual particles), sending a particle of matter or antimatter flying off away from the black hole (just outside the event horizon) at close to the speed of light. The larger the black hole, the more surface area there is for the event horizon, which is the only place this should ever happen.
The reason you aren’t getting anything out of the black hole’s event horizon is that inside that, time itself points toward the singularity at the center. So it isn’t a matter of coming up with sufficient power to escape since the future itself - from the perspective of the observer inside the event horizon - is toward the singularity. We can normally distinguish between our three spacial dimensions and a time dimension, but the interior of the black hole is such an extreme environment that all must be considered together. You can no more go from inside the black hole to outside than you can go from April 6th 2021 to April 5th 2021. You’re going toward April 7th 2021 no matter what you do. With sufficient speed, you can slow that journey (from an outside observer’s perspective), but you’ll never reach April 5th. Moving from inside the event horizon to the outside would - by definition - require you to go back in time.
Oh come on, I know I wasn't the only one thinking it.
Well, nobody emerges from a black hole.
The radiation isn’t actually coming from inside the black hole, so it isn’t “escaping”. It’s being radiated from the outside of the black hole.
Thanks, that sounds like particle physics beyond my area of expertise.
Virtual particles are weird to begin with, but get worse when you look at force messenger virtual particles. It almost feels like a really lazy solution to the problems that come up (e.g. inability to transmit forces inside a sufficient gravity well - oh but wait nevermind, because Feynman said virtual particles don’t need to obey any rules in nature except causality.)
“The door swings both ways.” —Egon Spengler
I'm going to go find my Delorean with Mr Fusion now...
“It almost feels like a really lazy solution to the problems that come up”
More like mathematical shorthand than a lazy solution. We can describe the phenomenon with the same math that works to describe particles, so we use it. Same as with “pseudoparticles” like phonons.
Personally, I think in the end we’ll figure out that the “real” particles are exactly the same, just emergent phenomenon of wave/field mechanics that we can describe as particles in certain situations for expediency.
Like a fly trapped in amber is the way I heard it described.
Of course, the radiation would have killed them on the way there.
That actually makes a lot of sense to me as well. I think the distinction bugs me more than anything; as I doubt nature does any such thing. That we're seeing any distinction just tells me we're likely missing part of that puzzle. Still fascinating to me to consider the level of complexity and persistence that can be achieved with the random variations and fluctuations at the quantum level. The smoothing that must take place at the macro levels to support things like planetary formation is incredible. Everything around us appears to be an average of averages of randomness, yet it all works predictably.
Ask Joe
Heck, just go to Chicago.
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