Posted on 08/17/2016 5:02:55 AM PDT by MeneMeneTekelUpharsin
People at work were talking about getting to work and back home the other day. In the conversation, they mentioned the toll roads in Austin, Texas and the cost thereof. I was in shock. The amount per month spent on toll roads for people ranged from $300-600 per MONTH. Then it hit me!
The poor can not afford to pay those charges. So, the regular roads in Austin are in bumper-to-bumper traffic overload. The well-to-do go to and fro with great convenience while the lower classes suffer pretty badly with some having a 2-hour trip EACH WAY from home to work. This for some reason smacks of discrimination. I'm not big on playing the discrimination card, but it seems that people are taxed to death over everything, including roads, and then have to pay an exorbitant price AGAIN to be able to get to work to make some money to pay the taxes. Something just doesn't seem right about the whole thing.
And rich people can afford their own airplanes instead of having to schlep in Economy class...WAAAAAH, LIFE’S UNFAIR!
Then, he Georgia Governor couldn’t touch the hem of Dick Daly’s robe.
:-)
+1, love that toll road that bypasses Austin.
But the Georgia Toll Road 400 is no more. Something rarely done, IMO.
Thanks...I am getting tired of trying to persuade people to see what is happening to them. I am not opposed to the rich. It is that the thought came to me that the poorer people in Austin can NOT afford to get on the toll roads. Therefore, the upper classes can enjoy convenience on their level, while the peons slave below. That's all. I do NOT advocate Socialism, but something is wrong with this toll road system.
The government should quit misspending our tax money and build better roads with the taxes instead of having a private company do it and as a consequence make the quick, convenient way available to the people of means, and not the poor. The problem is, I believe, one of mismanagement of tax funds by the government. Perhaps the issue is one of the government not controlling costs and planning adequately to provide roads and the band aid solution became toll roads. Perhaps the solution is to, within a city's limits, have ALL people pay a toll to use ALL of the roads and control costs to keep the toll affordable.
This has nothing to do with airplanes. Frequently air travel is a luxury. Travel by roads is a necessity. Apples to oranges. Good try.
I absolutely agree with you.
The potential to track everywhere you go is disturbing on several levels.
When I lived in Singapore I saw this first hand because all the freeways are toll roads. I believe that an electronic toll pass thingamabob is required or at least I didn’t know anyone that didn’t have one. If someone robs a 7/11 and leaves the scene of the crime in a white Camry but nobody saw the license plate the first thing the police do is check the tolls system for any toll tag registered to a person with a white Camry. They then start knocking on the doors of every white Camry owner who happened to be on the road in that area, at that time. I understand the crime fighting element but the total lack of privacy and lack of a presumption of innocence is disconcerting at a minimum and frightening when I thought about it.
That said owners of electric vehicles are getting price brakes through government subsidies to the cost of vehicle and they pay no road maintenance tax. Thus, the present system is just as intrusive is some important respects because it creates a privileged class of drivers who are directly subsidized by other drivers, often of lower socioeconomic classes who can’t afford the still expensive even after subsidy Tesla. Tesla drivers need to pay the $1100 dollar a year they owe in road tax. The average gasoline powered car owner does this electric and hybrid owners should too because. When you consider the government incentives drivers in hybrid and electric vehicles are really driving vehicles that are very expensive to operate, they just get other people to pay for part of the operation cost. That is not just and it should not be so.
If I convert my Mazda to propane and don’t pay the road tax as if I was running on gasoline I go to jail. Why should a “Model S” Tesla driver not be arrested for doing the same thing?
The only real alternative to the wide spread use of toll roads if hybrid and electric vehicles continue to become more common is some form of straight “Transportation tax” accessed to all vehicle owners (Not drivers but owners) that is based not upon distance traveled but upon the weight of the vehicle owned. This has its own problems not the least of which is suddenly charging people $1100 dollars a year just to have a valid driving license tag.
It's certainly a boon for Divorce Lawyers.
Nobody is stopping them from traveling on roads, they just get there a bit slower.
A tax on miles driven is already being discussed in various places around the country as an alternative to gas taxes and tolls. I’m opposed to it for the reasons you listed, and because politicians never eliminate a tax. They only know how to impose more taxes. The gas tax will never go away.
There’s no question that people avoid toll roads when they’re hurting financially.
They also avoid nice restaurants, clubs, sporting events, new car dealerships, high end clothing stores, jewelry shops, and vacations.
What am I missing?
I assume you are implying private endeavor with competition.
There was a big stink back when this tool road started about the state granting the Spanish company a monopoly on the route. No new free roads were allowed to be built that might compete, and existing roads were restricted in what maintenance could be done (no widening, e.g.).
The price would not be that high if competition were allowed.
“The government should quit misspending our tax money and build better roads with the taxes instead of having a private company do it”
That is what they do.
The government sends out bids for contractors to respond to and if they win, they build and get paid by tax dollars.
Toll roads are built and in some cases the company that builds the road gets paid back (with a profit) over time and the toll is over, sometimes the toll stands because of maintenance and upgrade requirements.
The “government” does not build roads, especially interstate or major roads. Government do limited maintenance but they do not do the actual building. . .so, when obummer says you didn’t build your business, that government built the roads you use, he is an idiot.
Government selects the contractor, a private business, that built the road.
“Roads are promised to become FREE ROADS after the bonds are paid off, usually in ten years. “
Not always, as some tolls remain in some cases for upgrades and maintenance and staffing.
Why does San Antonio have better roads and no tolls?
Why does any place have better roads? This wasn’t about San Antonio.
“Yes, but they put an 85 mph speed limit on it to attract more customers. You can sure go like he!! on it for ten bucks.”
Actually you can legally drive 85mph for free out in west Texas.
I-10 from Kerrville on out towards El Paso has an 85mph speed limit.
And a part of I-20 in the same area is 85mph.
Yee Haw!
A quick search of "trucks vs cars road wear" found that an 80,000 18-wheeler causes 9,600 times the damage as a 4,000 pound car! Source
The article states the damage is exponential. The weight doubles 4.322 times from 4,000 to 80,000. (See MATH NOTE below.) The increased damage from one doubling is 8.345 times. So even an 8-ton (16,000 pound) truck would cause about 70 times the damage as a 4,000 pound car (8.345 x 8.345)!
If fuel taxes were actually based on road wear caused, trucks should pay almost all the tax. As usual, anything politicians and government do is messed up.
MATH NOTE: The doubling factor would at first appear to be 4.25 since 4,000 --2x--> 8,000 --2x--> 16,000 --2x--> 32,000 --2x--> 64,000 --1.25x--> 80,000. However, since the change is exponential 2^4.322=20, which is the ratio needed for 80,000/4,000.
“If fuel taxes were actually based on road wear caused, trucks should pay almost all the tax.”
And that cost will be passed along to the consumer, as most trucks are transporting goods for consumers.
In the 70s my grandfather was telling me that when the bond hucksters
were pushing them for the Turner Turnpike-—1950s-—between OKC and Tulsa that the promise was that they would remove the toll booths
when the 20 year bonds were paid off. Ha Ha Ha!
They had to keep—and raise-— the tolls for “maintenance”.
Really though it was to hit out of state traffic.
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