Posted on 08/11/2015 1:11:21 PM PDT by iowamark
What caused the Civil War? That seems like the sort of simple, straightforward question that any elementary school child should be able to answer. Yet many Americans—including, mostly, my fellow Southerners—claim that that the cause was economic or state’s rights or just about anything other than slavery.
But slavery was indisputably the primary cause, explains Colonel Ty Seidule, Professor of History at the United States Military Academy at West Point.
The abolition of slavery was the single greatest act of liberty-promotion in the history of America. Because of that fact, it’s natural for people who love freedom, love tradition, and love the South to want to believe that the continued enslavement of our neighbors could not have possibly been the motivation for succession. But we should love truth even more than liberty and heritage, which is why we should not only acknowledge the truth about the cause of the war but be thankful that the Confederacy lost and that freedom won.
(Excerpt) Read more at blog.acton.org ...
Thank you for showing that they weren’t “buddies”.
Thanks for a great post, very impressive, sir.
PeaRidge: “...Shame on your censorship.”
Thanks for posting the rest of Davis’ paragraph.
I try to keep my own posts as short & to the point as possible.
So I do sometimes end up leaving out otherwise important material.
But in this particular case, history showed us that Davis’ appeal for peace was totally insincere, while his threat of war came from the heart.
In fact, Davis made no serious efforts to either keep the peace in 1861, or to restore it afterward.
Tau Food: “Most of their ancestors work...”
It never ceases to astonish me how many people can’t keep straight in their minds the distinction between ancestors and descendants.
You even hear it from wise - guy commentators on TV.
And it’s just as annoying as people who can’t keep straight the difference between millions and billions.
But I’m hoping a tiny embarrassment this time could help you the next time, right?
NKP_Vet: “How many communists from Europe, the “Forty-Niners” you think fought for Lincoln.”
Ha! The Forty-Niners are a football team in San Francisco, named after California gold seakers of 1849.
The Revolution of 1848 in Europe was a very different matter.
And no, it was not primarily communist in either it’s purpose or effects.
Rather, it was middle class and democratic and did achieve some lasting good results.
So most of those who came to the USA in those years were just like other immigrants at other times — looking for a new life and opportunities in the New World.
But certainly one thing they absolutely, positively opposed was slavery, and so hundreds of thousands of them did serve the Union Army.
If you aren’t interested in discussing something seriously, I don’t know why you would expect me to do it either.
It was you (see posts 232, 291) who first suggested that Abraham Lincoln was responsible for the legalization of homosexual marriages. And, when I say that you were the first to suggest that connection, I don't just mean that you were the first to suggest it on this thread or at this website. I believe that you are the first person anywhere in the world to make that connection.
The interesting question for me is why you would make that connection. I have some thoughts on that matter. I suspect that you are very unhappy about some of the things that are going on in your life and I suspect that you do not want to look for causes for these problems anywhere that might involve an expectation that you make changes in your life to correct the problems. I suspect that you feel it is safer to blame these problems on some person (Lincoln) or event (civil war) so remote that no one can expect you to take steps to correct the problems. Fixing blame on the civil war or on someone who has been dead for more than 150 years leads to the apparently comfortable conclusion is that none of these problems are your fault and there is nothing you can do to fix them. You are a victim trapped in a world designed by Abraham Lincoln.
I think that you should face squarely the reality that neither Abraham Lincoln nor the civil war has any significant influence on your life or your happiness. I'm not sure that you can do that, though.
If you want to solve your problems, whatever they may be, or to improve your circumstances, then you are going to have to make changes that you can make. You can only change things that are close to you and you can only change things in the future. Forget about Abraham Lincoln and the civil war.
Thank you for that correction. Ancestors, descendants - you know, when you come from a neighborhood where there are so many mothers/sisters, it’s not easy to keep all these relationships perfectly straight. ;-)
In the same manner that Jimmy Carter is responsible for the deaths of a Million people. Had he supported the Shah of Iran, the Iran/Iraq war would never have happened.
The consequences of Lincoln turning the law on it's head eventually led to the court abusing the 14th amendment to push these "discrimination" arguments. Lincoln is indirectly responsible for much crap we are dealing with today.
I don't just mean that you were the first to suggest it on this thread or at this website. I believe that you are the first person anywhere in the world to make that connection.
Some people see deeper than others. Many of the arguments that I get into are the result of other people's shallow thinking and shallow perception; people who simply do not have sufficient scope of thought to perceive what has happened and what it will eventually lead to.
The very day Paul Bremer announced the plan to disband the Iraq army and prohibit "bathe party" members from holding any government jobs or positions, I immediately started screaming at the radio about what a colossally stupid thing that was, that it would turn our victory into ashes and bung up Iraq in an unbelievable manner.
I knew they would get an immediate and violent response. I bemoaned the fact that out of all those War College graduates, none of them seemed to have the wit to tell the civilians that this would be an incredibly stupid move.
Another example:
When George HW Bush made noises about going along with a Democrat tax increase, again I started screaming at my radio. I said "You stupid fool! They don't give a crap about taxes, they just want to make you break that promise so as to undermine you politically, and perhaps wreck your reelection effort. "
Again, history unfolded exactly as I predicted. As a matter of fact, it happens so often that I generally don't even pay much attention to it anymore.
Want another example? See what I wrote about Mitch McConnell and Thad Cochran during the few months prior to November of last year. It's posted right here on Free Republic, and you can go read it without having to take my word for it.
Both of them have done exactly what I predicted they would do.
Continued on next message...
I know. You've been beating on that theory since the beginning of our exchange. You seem to have a bit of an obsession with it. What makes me unhappy is that most other people can't see what I see, nor can they follow my explanations much of the time, not enough to sway us from our folly. I feel like Cassandra much of the time, and yes, that is indeed frustrating.
I suspect that you feel it is safer to blame these problems on some person (Lincoln) or event (civil war) so remote that no one can expect you to take steps to correct the problems.
Well, except that Roe v. Wade is directly traceable to the 14th amendment. "Anchor Babies", a topic I am discussing on another thread, is also traceable directly to the 14th amendment. All "Discrimination" cases, including "Gay Marriage" are directly traceable to the 14th amendment, and the elimination of prayer and religion from government sponsored events is likewise a consequence of the 14th amendment.
Once again I will tell you that I grew up conservative, and opposed these things before I even knew how they came to be. When I started learning how things got the way they were, all roads eventually led back to the 14th amendment.
Did we not have the 14th amendment, we would not have abortion. We would not have a ban on prayer in public schools. We would not have "gay Marriage". We would not have "anchor babies", and we very likely wouldn't have a half Kenyan President Obama.
And how did we get the 14th amendment? Well that question leads right back to "THE CIVIL WAR."
You are a victim trapped in a world designed by Abraham Lincoln.
We are all currently victims trapped in a world not designed, but created inadvertently as a consequence of what Lincoln did. In human social interaction, we are in a war of competing principles. When you elevate one group of principles over another, it sometimes produces unpredictable consequences, usually bad.
Currently the liberals are pushing "Change" and "Equality" over "social norms" and "Freedom", and I for one do not see these "equalities" or these "changes" as good for society, for myself or for my family.
I think that you should face squarely the reality that neither Abraham Lincoln nor the civil war has any significant influence on your life or your happiness. I'm not sure that you can do that, though.
Yes Dr. Spock, you just keep barking up that tree. I'm sure there's a Raccoon up there somewhere.
No. The fact is that you cannot even make a good case that Lincoln was responsible for the Fourteenth Amendment, much less the way in which Americans subsequently interpreted it.
Some people see deeper than others.
Some people are delusional. Whether Lincoln is significantly influencing your life is not even a serious question. The man has been dead for over 150 years. Our world is the way it is today because of the decisions that we make today.
I am prepared to take responsibility for the decisions that I make and for my own circumstances. You will never be happy until you do.
I am telling you the truth. You are not unhappy because of Abraham Lincoln, the civil war or the behavior of anybody else living then or now. You are unhappy because of what you do and don't do. You will not be happy until you accept responsibility for you own life. You need to understand that you have the power to improve your own circumstances and that Abraham Lincoln does not. Your sense of powerlessness is just a crutch that isn't working.
Lincoln doesn't care what you think. You should care what you think.
Once again, I will point out to you that the 14th amendment was an inadvertent consequence of Lincoln, not something designed by him. He simply set up the conditions that made bad law likely. Just as Carter set up the conditions from which came the Iran/Iraq war, so too did Lincoln set up the conditions from which came such legal consequences as the 14th amendment.
Some people are delusional. Whether Lincoln is significantly influencing your life is not even a serious question. The man has been dead for over 150 years.
Some people are repetitious. Yes, we know he's been dead for over 150 years, but if the length of time a man has been dead alters the consequences of his being alive, then George Washington's legacy must be all evaporated by now. He's been dead for 215 years.
Something tells me he was still responsible for the creation of this country back when he was alive, and our lives today are one positive result of his contribution.
Our world is the way it is today because of the decisions that we make today.
It is also the way it is because of the decisions made by leaders of yesteryear. Had LBJ never been president, we wouldn't have spent 21 trillion dollars on the "War on Poverty." We wouldn't have a massive criminal class created by the absence of fathers and funded by government money.
Thank you Dr. Freud. The only thing you've convinced me of is your inability to grasp the point I keep attempting to put in front of you.
That one thing follows from another, and before you can solve a problem, you must learn what caused the problem in the first place.
Our history is a sequence of events, and these events contribute to the zeitgeist of current society, and a true understanding of current society cannot be had without comprehending the underpinnings of it.
I keep mentioning prayer in schools, which you generally ignore, but what do you suppose would be the consequence of it were it still allowed?
What has been the consequence of government funding of Welfare and other "great society" programs?
It is my opinion that Western civilization is built on Judeo-Christian doctrines and principles, and that if we lose those, we will have, in fact, lost civilization.
I’m late to this topic. Has this been posted? I miss this man.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q9J8P6WfS7w
No, that is not my message to you.
My message to you is that you and Mr. Lincoln have no control over one another. There is nothing you can do to change what he did and there is nothing that he did that limits you in any way. If you can't own slaves today, it is not because of Lincoln; it is because we are making it illegal today. So, forget about Lincoln.
My message to you is that if you want to improve your circumstances, you should concentrate on making changes that you can make. Those things will be close to you and they will all be in the future. That may seem hard. Start with little changes. Nobody is going to divide up this country just because you are unhappy. Dividing up the country is not going to help you or anyone.
Don't you feel you have any responsibility for your own circumstances and your own happiness? What are your obligations in all this?
“Lincoln’s Fault - for those times when simply blaming Bush just won’t do”
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