Thanks Pontiac. One of *those* topics.
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Posted on 05/03/2015 3:35:59 PM PDT by 2ndDivisionVet
Sometime after 1200 BCE, civilization collapsed, and a dark age prevailed.
The Late Bronze Age collapse of societies throughout the Levant, the Near East and the Mediterranean some 3,200 years ago has been a mystery. Powerful, advanced civilizations disappeared, seemingly overnight. Now an archaeologist believes he has figured out what lay behind the cataclysm.
The trigger seems to have been the invasion of ancient Egypt in 1177 BCE by marauding peoples known simply as the “Sea Peoples,” as recorded in the Medinet Habu wall relief at Ramses III' tomb. The relief depicts a sea battle (and also carts full of supplies, women and children, something that always puzzled researchers. Why would the women and children have been at a sea battle, and why were there chariots? Did they bring them on ships as well?) The foreigners were depicted wearing distinct head gear....
(Excerpt) Read more at haaretz.com ...
Ironically they’re still using Christ’s birth as the turning point in history; they’re still counting by the number of years before, or after Christ’s birth. but they’re trying to deny this by changing the reference term, from BC to BCE. Typical political correctness - a denial of reality.
It stands for “Before the Common Era”. And what’s the “Common Era”?
Don’t ask ...
It’s a dishonest attempt to write Christ out of history - while still using the dating method that numbers everything from Christ’s birth. It’s the ultimate in denying “the elephant in the room.”
It used to be Before Christ. BC.
ML/NJ
Absolutely. Leftists act like petulant toddlers having a temper tantrum.
I did a little research, and it turns out you, elcid1970, and I are at least partially all correct.
Here’s a high-school level lesson on the subject:
http://study.com/academy/lesson/iron-vs-bronze-history-of-metallurgy.html
It turns out that tin was relatively rare. When a lot of trade routes were eliminated (for whatever reasons), tin couldn’t be obtained easily, so metalworkers looked around for substitutes. The Iron Age was born from their efforts.
Iron ore was plentiful, but hard to smelt and process. Nevertheless, human ingenuity prevailed and steel weapons (along with other handy implements) were invented and turned out to be even stronger and better than their bronze counterparts.
Theses for the Reconstruction of Ancient History256. The overthrow of Egypt, which Ramses III referred to as having occurred a number of generations before his own days, is the conquest of Egypt by Cambyses in the year of Amasis' death.
258. Ramses III is identical with Nectanebo I of the Greek authors. He lived not in the twelfth but in the fourth century.
259. In Herodotus there can be no reference to Ramses III, because the historian lived before the pharaoh. The history of Egypt by Herodotus, though defective in details, is more nearly accurate than that of the later and modern historians, because he placed the history of the Eighteenth, the Ethiopian, and the Nineteenth Dynasties in fairly accurate order.
260. "Invasion of Egypt by the archaic Greeks" in the twelfth century is a fallacy. The Greeks who participated in the wars of Ramses III and who are shown as changing sides, were at first soldiers of Chabrias, assisting Egypt, and then troops of Iphicrates, opposing Ramses III.
261. Agesilaus, the King of Sparta, had already arrived in Egypt in the days of Nectanebo I (Ramses III), [Tachos (Ramses IV)] and Ramses III, who referred to his arrival, mentioned also his notably small stature.
262. The Pereset, with whom Ramses III was at war, were the Persians of Artaxerxes II under the satrap Pharnambazus, and not the Philistines.
263. The war described by Ramses III, and by Diodorus and other classical authors (the war of Nectanebo 1), is one and the same war of 374 BCE
264. A camp was set up by Pharnambazus in Acco in preparation for an attack against the Egypt of Ramses III.
265. A naval invasion against Egypt was undertaken by forcing the Mendesian mouth of the Nile, fortified by Ramses III.
266. Flame throwers were used on the Persian ships forty years before their use by the Tyrians at the siege of Tyre by Alexander.
267. The Egyptian bas-reliefs of the temple at Medinet Habu show Sidonian ships and Persian carriages comparable to the pictures of ships and carriages on the Sidonian coins minted during the years of the invasion.
268. The bas-reliefs of Medinet Habu show the reform of Iphicrates in lengthening the swords and spears and reducing the armor intended for defense.
269. The Jewish military colony at Elephantine still existed in 374 BCE and participated in the defense of the eastern border of Egypt. These professional soldiers were called Marienu by Ramses III, which is the Aramaic Marenu.
270. Semitic languages and the Palestinian cult of Baal made headway in Egypt at the time of Ramses III.
271. The Greek letters of classical form incised on the tiles of Ramses III during the process of manufacture (found at Tell-el-Yahudieh in the Delta) present no problem. They are Greek letters of the fourth century.
272. The inlay work and glazing of the tiles of Ramses III are innovations introduced from Persia.
273. The hunting motifs in the art of Ramses III were inspired by Assyrian and Persian bas-reliefs; some motifs of the Greek art also made their influence felt in the murals of Ramses III.
274. Other kings known by the name of Ramses, from Ramses IV to Ramses XII, are identical with the kings of the Twenty-ninth and Thirtieth Dynasties and their order of succession is confused.
275. The papyrus of Wenamon describes the conditions in Syria during the late Persian or early Greek times. In the days when the Testament of Naphtali was composed, the Barakel Shipowners Company mentioned in this papyrus was still in existence and owned by a son of Barakel.
Thanks Pontiac. One of *those* topics.
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Thanks Pontiac.
Google “volcano 1177 bce”
E. R. Langenbach, letter to the New York Times Book Review, May 2, 1977Thomsen accuses Dr. Velikovsky of cabalistic reasoning, of "relying on correspondences of sound, such as Pereset and Persian." This statement is a pure fabrication -- some of that "downright imagination" of which Thomsen disapproves. Dr. Velikovsky points out (p. 35) that "in the hieroglyphic texts of the Persian era... Persia is always called P-r-s" and that in the Canopus Decree, cut in stone, in 238 B.C., the Persians are referred to as P-r-s-tt. (There were no vowels in the alphabet.) The Canopus Decree is written both in Egyptian and in Greek. In Egyptian it describes the carrying off of the sacred images of Egypt by the Pereset and in Greek it tells of them being carried off by the Persians. But Dr. Velikovsky did not limit his identification of the Pereset as Persians to this evidence, although it would have been enough for a less careful and exacting scholar. In addition, he compares the clothing, armaments and appearances of the Persian soldiers and officers, as they are depicted in the bas reliefs in Persepolis and Nakhsh-i-Rustam, with those of the Pereset as depicted in the murals of the temple at Habinet Habu. The striking similarities are unmistakable. Finally, Dr. Velikovsky compares, step by step, the events described in annals left by Ramses III of his war with the Pereset and the Peoples of the Sea, with the descriptions by Diodorus of Sicily of the details of the war of Nectanebo I against the Persians and the Greek mercenaries. This comparison is made in such meticulous detail that the only logical conclusions are that both were describing the same war; that the Pereset and the Persians were the same people and that Ramses III was the Pharaoh whom the Greeks called "Nectanebo I." Incidentally, Dr. Velikovsky, quoting E. Wallis Budge, The Book of Kings (London 1908) Vol. II p. I, points out that one of the "Horus names" of Ramses III was Nectanebo (Nekht-a-neb).
So much for Tomsen's accusations of cabbalistic reasoning and making "archeology out of anomalies."
Theories about the collapse of Bronze Age civilizations have been around for a long time, and the Egyptian inscriptions about "Peoples of the Sea" have been known for a long time as well. Some of the destructions (such as of the Hittite capital) are probably earlier than 1177 and had to blame on sea raiders. Pylos' destruction is usually put about 1200. The fall of Troy is probably well before that.
The “Peleset” among the Sea Peoples are usually equated with the Philistines. The Persians weren’t anywhere in the area c. 1200 B.C.
“Had to blame” should have read “hard to blame”
I assure you that I am the most ardent of conservatives, and your link is bunk. BCE and CE are accurate terms. BC and AD are not, since the person to whom they refer was not born at year zero.
So tell me, what exactly happened at 1 AD that makes Anno Domini?
If you were truly interesting in honoring Jesus, you would not use a term that is has no bearing to Jesus’ birth. Regardless, since when would “Before Christ” be honoring? Nothing was before Him.
So are you saying that Ramses the Great was not the Pharaoh of the Exodus?
Do you know who was?
Actually I heard of early steel in the 1954 epic “Sinuhe the Egyptian” where as Pharaoh’s physician he journeys to Asia Minor to cure a Hittite general, who gives him a steel sword in payment.
The captains of Egypt are appalled at how the Hittite sword “slices our Egyptian copper like a knife through cheese”.
Still a great movie, IMO.
It was not the Marines! Once again it was those little gray bastards at it again. That’s all they have better to do is fly all over the universe and blow stuff up and build big stone things. Sometimes its write crazy letters on rocks and things. Then they sit out in space and laugh about stupid people telling each others the meanings of it all. I hate grays!
That was explained above — these events did not take place in 1200 BC.
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