Free Republic

To paraphrase, the fight goes to the most aggessive.

The aggression I see in the USA on the news media and in discussions with individuals, is aimed at one man, our President.

They are assuming he has dictatorial powers over most of the economy of the USA.

The center of the world economy has shifted to the Pacific region. The center of the Strategic Security of the World has shifted into Asia and embraces the hegemon of Iran.

Our Domestic Center is in Washington, but is Managed by a consortioum of influences from outside Washington.

The Democrats Understand full well that Europe is already being dissolved into Islam. How unusual that Europe would side with Iran et al against Israel.

My perception is probably skewed in a direction opposed by many others. But here it is.

As a Nation we are divided.

Half of us can't see what they are looking at.

The other half won't act in our defense for an extended period of time.

Therefore,I perceive we will become a Peaceful Nation as Europe is becoming. When islam takes over there is Peace, according to them.

The one-half of our nation that can't see will become victims again with no one or no place to run to.

I am not crying, I am clear eyed.

I see no grat desire to struggle against those that are working to destroy us. We just wonder why do they hate us.

Examine the instructions of Islam.
Read the speeches of the Imams.
Read the speeches of Arafat.
Listen to the President of Iran.
Listen to the leadership of Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Syria.

Listen to our Congressmen and women.

The other side speaks to us preparing to destroy us.
Our "Leaders" say we need to "approach these nations in a more consiliatory fashion".

Now as an arm chair general, even I can see that the tactics used, guerilla, will obviously be successful against a Technological society with fragile infrastructure and will. We like to just go to work and then the soccer game or watch TV and not worry about the rest of the World.

They are waving their right hand in front of us and are reaching for our neck with their left.

We are easily Distracted.

I was born into a different USA. We don't have the same citizenry as used to live here.

In the 50's we wanted to produce products that would give us more leisure.

Then in the 70's and 80's we had the Leisure Class.

Now, we have a Leisure Nation, napping on the Titanic.

To paraphrase, the fight goes to the most aggessive.

The aggression I see in the USA on the news media and in discussions with individuals, is aimed at one man, our President.

They are assuming he has dictatorial powers over most of the economy of the USA.

The center of the world economy has shifted to the Pacific region. The center of the Strategic Security of the World has shifted into Asia and embraces the hegemon of Iran.

Our Domestic Center is in Washington, but is Managed by a consortioum of influences from outside Washington.

The Democrats Understand full well that Europe is already being dissolved into Islam. How unusual that Europe would side with Iran et al against Israel.

My perception is probably skewed in a direction opposed by many others. But here it is.

As a Nation we are divided.

Half of us can't see what they are looking at.

The other half won't act in our defense for an extended period of time.

Therefore,I perceive we will become a Peaceful Nation as Europe is becoming. When islam takes over there is Peace, according to them.

The one-half of our nation that can't see will become victims again with no one or no place to run to.

I am not crying, I am clear eyed.

I see no grat desire to struggle against those that are working to destroy us. We just wonder why do they hate us.

Examine the instructions of Islam.
Read the speeches of the Imams.
Read the speeches of Arafat.
Listen to the President of Iran.
Listen to the leadership of Saudi Arabia, Egypt and Syria.

Listen to our Congressmen and women.

The other side speaks to us preparing to destroy us.
Our "Leaders" say we need to "approach these nations in a more consiliatory fashion".

Now as an arm chair general, even I can see that the tactics used, guerilla, will obviously be successful against a Technological society with fragile infrastructure and will. We like to just go to work and then the soccer game or watch TV and not worry about the rest of the World.

They are waving their right hand in front of us and are reaching for our neck with their left.

We are easily Distracted.

I was born into a different USA. We don't have the same citizenry as used to live here.

In the 50's we wanted to produce products that would give us more leisure.

Then in the 70's and 80's we had the Leisure Class.

Now, we have a Leisure Nation, napping on the Titanic.

What an outstanding statement. Well thought out using the principle of fairness and yet clarity was evident.

To follow this thought one must agree that there are conspiracies. Many People have been influenced and are carrying out the desires of Gramsci and Hegel and Marx and Engels, even at this moment.

The problem is we have not applied the only other method to equality between classes-- LOVE your neighbor as yourself.

Your statements
Your reasoning
Your concepts
Even the ordering of your sentences
Are positioned with care.
Such is to be found also in a flower arrangement done in the old Japanese tradition.
Balanced.

The use of Science and its repeatable experiments, without the Unrepeatable events in life, produces an understanding that is Unbalanced.

Mathematics of a high order, using Microbiology as a map; has lead some superior scientifically inspired business men to make surprisingly good assumptions until one lone unrepeatable event upset the entire apple cart. LTCM is one such example.

Science is not able to "contain the whole".

Very Good. Well Done.

Have a good day.

Don't worry about The Last Days.

Your days are numbered.

"Live like you were dying."

"Many claim that Islam is just a violent religion that advances the idea of holy war and violence throughout the world and has done so since its inception.

They are right, except for the last part. Only in the last 125 years or so has Islam been a religion prone to violence and extremism.

Since its inception in 610 up to the 1880’s, Islam was a tolerant and peaceful religion. Under the Islamic empires of that time, only a small head tax was placed on non-Muslims living there by its religious rulers. Otherwise, Jews, Christians and any others were free to worship as they pleased."


Just where did you obtain these historic facts?

"Only in the last 125 years or so has Islam been a religion prone to violence and extremism."

Surely you only read the last chapter of one book.

You know, the Koran gives a much different story of history than you do.

Unless, this was written by an unscrupulous Christian like me. Then It all comes clear.

Let us look at a molecule of water H2O.

A free photon is surfing through some water. It just so happens that the photon has a frequency that is a harmonic of the frequency of the electron holding the Hydrogen to the Oxygen.

The Photon will collide with the electron, energizing the electron and giving the electron All its energy.

The electron normally looks like a fuzzy ball. Once the photon stricks it and gives its energy to the electron the electron takes the shape of an hour glass, thus releasing its bond to the Hydrogen and the Oxygen. The electron is now energized and free. The Oxygen and Hydrogen are no longer attached.

The energized electron will not give off its photon and heat until it has been de-energized.

Now the Photon was "absorbed" by the electron. How is it not part of the electron?

As I read what you are stating I perceive that you are saying somethings that are similar to what I am saying except you are telling me to go read elementary Chemistry, when I was the one that said this to you to start with.

What is this need or desire to characterize a person in conversation with you?

Allow me to present a conundrum to you.
I am sure you will have a characterized hand grenade ready and waiting for me.

There is some speculation that a particle of light, a photon, does not have a frequency.

It has what looks like a frequency to us,but in "reality" it is moving in and out of a dimension we can not perceive.

You see, I have been around long enough to observe all sorts of Theories be discharded or revised. Then I wonder why such dogmatic statements of elementary stuff that may not be considered elementary 6 months from now.

It seems this point may have been uppermost in the mind of Socrates as he was developing his concepts concerning asking questions to determine the truth of a matter.

Some History Books in the Libraries of Schools still speak of the Socratic Method. I believe those books are now passe aren't they. Socrates said he knew nothing. Today we seem to be very knowledgable of all things great and small.

There is no awe. There is certainty.

Have a good and restful night and bright tomorrow.

I tried to reply and had a message come up that said I needed to correct a statement. I don't know how to correct it.

Here I go stepping off into the deep end.

Seems to me that a Closed System is one where the Law of Conservation of Mass and Energy is in effect.

Therefore, an Open system would not require the Conservation of Mass and Energy.

An Open system would allow for one to gain more energy from a system than was put into the system.

OK, I'll step back out of the line of fire to see who shots that down.

" I'm just not sure either one of us was relating to what the other was saying despite the similarities of our points. So, maybe I am the one who owes the apology."

There have some months since I was posted here. I have not been following all that has been stated and therefore have not been aware of intellectual territory staked out and settled.

There could be no arguement without me doing my part.

It is my pleasure to meet a scholar and a gentleman.

it is also my distinct honor and a priviledge to read from and speak to betty boop and Alamo-Girl.

May the Life in me live In you all also.

I really don't have a great deal of time for this. I do however like Discourse.

When we have made our comments back and forth, I have probably taken my side a little more seriously than I ought.

The day your Doctor asks you, "Are you afraid to die?" may cause you to be a little bit more serious about showing you recognize, on Earth, the One you will meet in a shorter time span than you thought.

Since I know this to be true in my life, it may hold true in the life of others. In that case, start dealing with Him in the way the song goes.

"Live like you were Dieing."

I am not being maudlin. These are just the facts, ma'am.

Have a good day. Gold is at 639/oz.

That probably means some people are looking at a war around Iran and Israel.

I don't like war, but I hope our country is on God's side.
Be Prepared, to answer the question.

I am glad you freepers are awake!!

"The smallest particle of light that is known so far is called a photon. Photons are part of an electron.

grey_whiskers comment: !!

Sorry, you asked for it:"

I really don't know what you mean by "Grey whiskers comment".

My supposition is the the comment Sounds as if it is true but in no way is it true.

If my supposition is true then allow me to explain.

When the electrons in a molecule are energized they don't give off or release Photons.

When the electrons in a molecule are de-energized they give off light(photons) and heat.

Therefore, one of the particles contained in electrons are photons.

Check it out. If I am wrong I will de-energize some electrons by building a fire.

I am truly sorry and appologize for causing such anguish in you or others.

I meant only to make comments coming from me that are related to comments coming from you.

My purpose ti to give good honest reason why it is to my benefit and your benefit as human beings to be acquainted with the Creator in such a way as to leave Him out of nothing that occurs.

It is also my considered opinion that it is of the Highest Disrespect to speak of and analyze a painting and make no attempt to indicate that we could even recognize the Painter.

This is probably not dealing with the Subject.

I am probably out of my depth in subjects. I will 'trip' on down the yellow brick road to speak to another Wizard.

I perceive you are using the scientific method to move towards the truth of a matter.

Without sending offense, I will endeavor to answer well posited questions and also redesign the questions if needed.

"Theists determine to prove that there is a creator through creation. Yet, when science says, "we cannot prove the existance of a creator" the theists will demand that they are being atheists and humanists. So the scientists say, "Okay, I will set out to prove the existance of a deity through sound scientific study to quantify faith."

By definition a Theist believes there is a God. He or she needs no Proof. The scriptures do not endeavor to Prove there is a God, they give voice to the movement of the hand of God in the affairs of men.

As for me, I start with the Belief not only that there is a God, I believe he is concerned about everything in the Universe and beyond, no matter how small or large. And that includes me.

How would we go about Proving the existence of anyone. We would seek to show their effect on the environment around them.

Example: At the age of seven I had my right hand almost completely severed by the glass from a broken jar. A country doctor told me to sit on his desk. He deadened the wound and then sewed my hand back to my arm while I watched him. He used a part of a cigar box to give support to my hand and wrapped it with gause and tape. The doctor told my Grandfather I would never be able to use my hand because he could not sew the nerves back together. He just connected two bones and sewed up the flesh. He told me to not try to move my fingers at all.

I followed his instructions. Two months pasted and I and my Grandfather were sitting in the living room waiting for dinner to be served. My Grandfather was reading the newspaper. I was sitting on the couch.

My right hand with the cast on it was in front of my eyes. I began to try to move my fingers. They moved. My Grandfather had been watching me and he sat up and said do that again. I did. He sat back and put the newspaper back up to his face and said the doctor said you would never use you hand. That was all he said.

Today it would have cost at lease a million dollars to have the micro surgery and there would be no guarantee that it would work.

Later I found that people from three churches, my Father and Mother, My Grandparents and many relatives and friends PRAYED for my hand to be healed.

The nerves had to grow back on their own. They were not attached. How could that happen. I have complete use of my right hand.

How could you perform an experiment to duplicate that experience? You can't.

The individual relationship of the individual to God can not be duplicated by man. It must be duplicated by God.

It is not the capricousness of God. It is the lack of forming a relationship with God the way He wants it done.

We must obey Him. But in Romans 3 he says we cannot obey Him if we do not Trust him. Once we Trust and Obey Him then we can ask anything and It shall be done.

That requires Faith.

Faith, Trust, Obedience are all individual matters with God. We have no way to duplicate that because God is the only one that really sees our Heart (our attitude to God).

Therefore, having "Scientific studies to quantify Faith" will never prove the existance of a deity. He only proves Himself to each one of us if we seek Him. I cannot duplicate that for anyone other than myself.

I believe that us "Theists" do not desire to prove there is a God using the scientific method. We desire to examine the handiwork of God using the scientific method.

You see to examine His handiwork is not to just say, God did it" and that all that needs to be said.

Examine His handiwork to see what He has done and how He has interconnected everything in such a way that all of what we see is NEEDED. To be Needed is to be Loved.

Science can not quantify God.
Science can quantify the design made by God.

Speaking of Evolution, Charles Darwin uses the word Accident at least three times on the first page of Origin of the Species. And his work is called "scientific"?

It appears to me that all other scientific endeavors would never allow the use of the word 'accident' except where there is the need to acknowledge the handiwork of God.

You see I hope that it is coming through that what I seek is that the ability, actions and presence of God be dealt with as we deal with other basic elements we investigate while seeking to understand How all this works.

Have a good day.

"a "Given" is an observed governing factor in a real situation, or a stipulated one in an hypothetical."

I do agree with that statement. "He is an 'observed goverrning factor in a real situation'".

Take this proposition just a moment.

If you were to realize that God REALLY does exist and that he CREATED the world and all that is in it, then it would be preposterous and the heigth of arrogance to say "I will examine this world and endeavor to understand it without even considering the Presence of God while I conduct my research."

And then a corrilary would state that scientifically, God does not exist.

This is like studying a great painting. Examining each and every brush stroke and the formulas of each color used and the derivation of the elements that go into that painting and never acknowledging the existance of the Painter.

I used to endeavor to do that myself. It has come to me the error of my ways. I use the scientific method daily. The method does not leave out God. I must chose to leave Him out.

Go back thirty years and listen to the pronouncements of Great Scientist and some of their profound thoughts will be considered archaic now. Yet you wanted an answer that would be the same today and always. There is no permanence with the thoughts of man, only God.

The least I can do as a human is to just acknowledge Him in all that I do.

This is not a religious statement. It is a well reasoned argument that leads towards the Truth and not away from the Truth.

Have a good day.

"Once I recognize He is The Truth, then I must consider Him in any question, or any scientific endeavor I am involved in.
that's called "examining from a conclusion"

That is the same as using a GIVEN in any equation.

"when you begin from the belief that every phenomenon, even diametrical opposites - health and illness, beauty and ugliness, efficiency and inefficiency, organization and entropy, diversity and specialization, excellent design and shoddy design - all point, equally and in themselves, to the self-same Creator, there is simply no way to communicate with you on the matter: When you look at things through a lens which assumes that all discrepancies can be waved off by citing a mysterious deity, you set up a shield against rational discourse which is, bluntly, more effective and impermeable than that offered by the angriest scorned teen on PMS."

The "diametrical opposites" you list are conditions and states of Man. They are not from the Creation of God. We make a problem for ourselves when we apply our situations and opposites to God. I think that most of the problems on Earth come from the decisions of Men and Women, not God. He is constantly trying to get us through a problem not make the problem. We don't Trust Him we trust ourselves. "We have met the enemy and He is Us."

I do not start with the proposition to figure How God did anything. I start with the point of view "Look, what God did."

I am in agreement that we should examine and do research to understand How things work together. You see, Everything I know points me to what God Said, "I am in everything and everything is in me."

It is stated in IJohn that God is Light.

Well now isn't that interesting. We really don't know what light is. We know some things about Light. And there are somethings about Light we don't know.
What if that part Could be God.

The smallest particle of light that is known so far is called a photon. Photons are part of an electron. That means God is in Everything, Plus He has created the Universe. Everything is in Him.

What else is He doing?

You see nothing I have said disagrees with the scientific Method. It may disagree with some scientist.

Now for icing on the cake.
"EMPIRICISM CAN NOT ASSESS A DIVINE ENTITY WHO SUPPOSEDLY CAN DO ANY THING HE SHE OR IT WANTS WITHOUT LEAVING A TRACE; TRYING TO DO SO WOULD BE FUTILE, SO IT DOES NOT BOTHER TRYING."

I am not seeking to asses a Divine Entity. I am seeking to assess what has been created by that entity. You don't start with electricity and have to define it. You just know How to use it. I would expect the same tratment for God.

I call into question that The actions of God leave no trace.

I have never known a true scientist that considers things futile and does not bother to assess something because he can not define it.

I am in touch with several scientists who invent things of great magnitude. Everything they are doing calls in to question many of the "Laws of Nature" used by scientists.

I have used instruments in the military that were said to be impossible in universities in this country. I am now working with a scientist that can take salt water and produce clean water and Hydrogen and Oxygen. He is useing a small amount of electricity to do this and yet he produces 10 MWh of electricity, 1,000,000 gallons of water. No Pressure or heat.
Now most engineers will tell you that is impossible because he is not putting in enough Energy to produce 10 MWh of Energy.

What he does is Energize Photons. They do the work. To energize Photons means to increase acceleration or frequency. E=MC2 A small amout of increase in frequency is squared and produces much more energy than you put in.

I am saying through all of this that what is called scientific is very often hard headed ness. When real scientists use the scientific method and put all vectors into the formula, then we have greater discoveries.

Discoveries= finding out about something that already existed or using an existing concept in a different way.

Have a good day.

For the life of me I don't understand where this comment is aimed.

"For cryin'-out-loud, even the dead are ceded a place to stand."

Let me examine the part I can deal with.

"If I'm asking some interesting questions, that's because I have precious little in the way of answers that are satisfying to me."

You know, I have perceived a spot of disgust in your replies. Have you ever noticed "The question determines the answer?"

Enough talk about you, back to the eternal Truths. <;)

I was trying to get down to basics when I asked if you could define Energy. You have made it clear that God can not be defined. I wanted to make it clear that no one has DEFINED Energy, or Light, which is "pure energy".

Yet we know how to use energy and light. Why don't we do the same with God?

Since I am on God's side and you are on man's side allow me to try to define the words you have placed on the table.

"But, I should like some definitions. For instance; what is 'randomness'? Unpredictability? Chance? Or, what? Whatever it is, I should like it to be the same tomorrow as it is today."

God said "I am the same yesterday, today and tomorrow."
Therefore, using Non-Accidental Scientific thought, from God's Point of View, There is no such thing as randomness, Unpredictability or Chance.

From Man's Point of View, there is randomness, unpredictability and Chance, because our vast knowledge is limited.

It seems to me the Chaos theory indicates there is no such thing as randomness, or chaos. It seems to indicate there is a design even when something "Looks" Chaotic.

I could be wrong. Check me out.

You have stated:
"There can be no separation between God and the truth He created."

If I am not mistaken, God did not CREATE Truth. He IS Truth.

"There can, however, be a considerable separation between truth and our feeble understanding (believer and unbeliever alike) of what it is:"

Once I recognize He is The Truth, then I must consider Him in any question, or any scientific endeavor I am involved in.

We can quote from many great and distinguished people of Faith and those without Faith. If we are speaking of God I would prefer to stick with Quotes from Him.

We are discussing Him and Nature. Be careful who speaks for Nature. Some of them think the Earth is alive and Trees should be hugged. This is no joke. Excuse me the people are not joking. Their Theory requires more than a leap of faith.

Faith= "The evidence of things Hoped for."

My definition of 'more than a leap of faith' is "things hoped for", without evidence.

May you faithfully seek good evidence.

Have a good day.

"1. a Creator of the sort described in the various religious traditions humans have espoused cannot be described, defined, or subjected to testing on an empirical basis"

I like science. I am very interested in the scientific method, as long as it seeks The Truth of any matter.

When a particular element is left out of any research, then the conclusion Can Be called into question.

Scientifically there is inductive and deductive reasoning. We do not need to PROVE there is a God by testing or endeavoring to define Him.

As rational human beings we can perceive when an object has been well designed. Sometimes we are even able to distinguish the particular designer by looking at the form of the design.

The more I learn of humans, trees, grass, stars, the planets and what is on some of the planets, I perceive a very detail oriented design from one who thinks at such depth it is beyond our comprehension. The convoluted interconnectedness of all of this speaks so loudly of A Designer.

I wonder why we could not have scientific discussions that just take God as a GIVEN? We have all sorts of GIVENS that are much less pervasive and profound.

We don't even define particular GIVENs. They are just ACCEPTED.

We have Euclidian Geomety and Non-Euclidian Geometry.

Let us have Scientific Enquiry that Includes a possible vector from a Designer. To be tolerant let us name this the Non- Accident Scientific Method.

Don't you get tired of all these Scientific Pronouncements claiming something happened because of an accident. Isn't that a cop out.

Have a good day.

YHAOS, You are asking some interesting questions. That does not mean there is always an answer for those questions.

When I state ""What if there is, in reality, one more thing?", I am referring to the Conservation OF Mass and Energy. That Law states there is only mass and Energy in the Universe.

Do you agree with that? Do you have any indication there is at least one more thing besides Mass or Energy?

Mass and Energy exist in Space/Time.

Without Time there is no movement.
With movement there must be Space to move in.

Mass is solid Energy.
Are you able to define Energy without a comparision, or without stating what it does. Just saying what it is.

In my humble opinion, using comparisons, with my small amount of insight into Energy I am aware there is something there we don't know how to measure, or test.

There is no need to go into all that here, but when one just deals with examining simple questions about life on this planet and in this Universe we immediately observe the untold beauty and complexity upon complexity in the smallest particle of anything. Our DNA is just made of Mass and Energy??? Then how is it that such a massive amount of Information is contained in those spirals.

I hope I am making myself clear.

I am not running from any questions. I am amazed how we can so easily leave out one major cause and then make Laws and Theories as if we know what we are talking about. Then within five years we can say , Wait a minute . We need to redesign our Theories and one of our Laws.

Here is what I do believe.

With God all things are possible.
With out God No thing.

It appears to me that what we call Science is very often an effort to explain "reality" with no mention of a Creator.

Just look at the inner ear of a child. That was no accident.

You see I have been using Mechanical objects for years. It is obvious to me that the inventors of many things have used the actions and abilities of the Human body to design there mechanical instruments.

Who designed the human body??? An Accident of mutation????
Really???

Such a gracious response to my coarse rantings. I see your "middle" name is Christian. Mine too.

Without Him I am unable to see, hear, or breath. My heart beats because of Him.

In that great gettin' up morning we will know Him as He really IS.

I will see you there Alamo Girl.