Posted on 02/05/2017 3:05:14 PM PST by metmom
“The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all” (2 Corinthians 13:14).
Though there is only one God, He exists in three Persons: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit.
God is one, but He exists in three distinct Persons. We call this the Trinity, a contraction of “tri-unity,” meaning “three in one.” The word Trinity doesn’t appear in the Bible, but God’s existence as three Persons in one God is clear from Scripture.
Old Testament evidence of God’s plurality can be found in the very first verse: “In the beginning God . . .” (Gen. 1:1). The Hebrew word used for God is Elohim, which is a plural noun. Isaiah 42:1 speaks of the Messiah: “Behold, My Servant, whom I uphold; My chosen one in whom My soul delights. I have put My Spirit upon Him; He will bring forth justice to the nations.” The Messiah says in Isaiah 48:16, “The Lord God has sent Me, and His Spirit.”
The New Testament is more explicit about God’s triune nature. After Jesus’ baptism, the Spirit of God descended upon Him as a dove, and the Father said, “This is My beloved Son, in whom I am well-pleased” (Matt. 3:17). The Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are together in the same scene.
Jesus says, “And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; that is the Spirit of truth” (John 14:16-17). Paul closes 2 Corinthians by saying, “The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit, be with you all” (13:14). Peter declares that believers are chosen “according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, by the sanctifying work of the Spirit, that you may obey Jesus Christ” (1 Peter 1:2).
So God is one, but God is three. This is a profound mystery that no human illustration can adequately describe and no scientific explanation can prove. The Trinity is something we have to take on faith, because God has taught it in Scripture.
Suggestions for Prayer
Praise God that He is so far above our finite understanding, yet has chosen to reveal Himself to us.
For Further Study
Read John 14—16.
What does Jesus teach about His relationship with the Father and the Spirit? What do you learn here about the different functions or ministries of each member of the Trinity?
sorry MHGinTN, that should read Leviticus 23:36- not 23:6.
We know that as days ‘15th-21st’ in the Feast of Tabernacles..
See you in the clouds bro.
A solitary man has 3 attributes...One is physical and visible...The other 2 are not...
Gen_1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
God says let's make man in OUR image...Interesting since God doesn't have an image...Yet God speaks of himself being in the plural...And since a man is a trinity, and we are made in God's plural image, there must be 3 attributes there as well...
Since we are made in the image of God and we have 1 physical and visible attribute with 2 others we can not see, God must have the same make-up...And of course we read about that make-up all thru the scriptures...
Heb_1:3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
Jesus is the physical image of the person of God...Just as our body is the image of the triune person that we are...When we will see (the resurrected) Jesus, we will be looking at God and and the Holy Spirit as well...
Seems simple enough to me...
Oh, you poor dear having someone challenge you to answer simple questions when YOU came onto a thread about the Trinity challenging them! You sure do like to write about stuff, don’t you? If left to just guess, I’d say you don’t believe Jesus is God in the flesh/incarnate but something else - distant relative of King David, a good guy, a cool dude, just a carpenter’s kid. If I’m wrong about that, now’s your chance to set the record straight. You DID call the doctrine a “hot mess”, remember? And you have been the one to presume everyone’s ignorant of what you know.
It’s not lost that you continue to ignore the many Scripture passages provided that show Jesus DID teach he was God and the Apostles and others the Holy Spirit inspired to write the New Testament also reinforce and expound upon that very basic truth. NO ONE claims to understand how it works - we have finite minds incapable of grasping the infinite - but we DO receive it by faith because it pleases God.
No offense, Mr.M.J.B., but you don't know what you're talking about. The earliest Christians were the Apostles and disciples of Jesus Christ and THEY taught the truth of the Trinity! The passages of Scripture where they did so are given throughout this thread.
As for your other assertions, I think you are the one who is incorrect. Christians are Monotheistic. This has also been repeatedly explained on this thread.
>>> Nope, MAN-made doctrine, very late in the game, and very radical.
Church history reveals that it was not until three hundred years after the birth of Christianity that the doctrine of the Bianity (325 C.E.) and Trinity (381 C.E.) received formal approval in the Christian community. These well documented events occurred under circumstances rife with contention, political agitation, and radical dissension in the early Church.
Christians are Monotheistic.
>>> Clearly not true on its face. You can't have Unity AND Three. There can't be an explanation - which is why it will always be a 'mystery.'
MONOtheistic faiths (Judaism, Islam) have ONE indivisible, non-partitioned God.
That's as basic as it gets.
No one disputes Judaism and Islam are monotheistic.
Christians are the only ones who claim Christianity is monotheistic.
The Messiah son of David is a beautiful man, full of love and grace. Just the type of character that is all too rare in this world. He truly IS the son of David, being the embodiment of David's character - unassuming, merciful, and righteous.
Joseph Jesus' father was also a righteous man, not wanting to embarrass Mary for what he surely thought was impropriety. After all, who would normally think that his bride - who become an expectant mother - could be innocent of wrongdoing, when Joseph knew he hadn't been with her. So he needed a dream to inform him that all was well. The Holy Spirit caused it. That doesn't mean that God was his DNA father, but that the Holy Spirit caused the conception. He's still the son of Joseph son of David.
These things really do resolve simply, and naturally. There are plenty of Christians who are loving and kind and merciful and truly reflect the character of the Messiah, traditions and doctrines notwithstanding. Character is king. But then there are those who insist upon jamming doctrines down people's throats, or else. They believe that they are doing God a great service, saving the heathen or whatever. Meanwhile, those with the hearts to the Lord are busy doing the Lord's work.. loving, healing, and uplifting their fellow man. It's just not a regimented as people think.
There is a paradigm shift afoot, that will set everything back to its proper focus and order: love.
To know David is to know the Messiah. All those Psalms of praise, and love... David pouring his heart out to the Lord.. we can know sooo much about David. Like father, like son. The Messiah is no "distant" relative at all. People look to the Psalms to see what was written about the Messiah, focusing on prophetic verses, when the mass quantity of info is in the heart and character of David himself, that pour forth from his Psalms.
The Messiah is the son of David, to the core of his being. David, perfected. So beautiful...
It's a real shame that this gets lost in the supposed salvation message. God "in the flesh" is the one doing the works of the Father so naturally and intuitively, that it's the core of his being. He's going to show everyone the way to do that, because what humans have done with the instruction manual is... something else entirely.
Because Christianity IS monotheistic! I don’t expect an unbeliever to understand the concept of the ONE, TRUE God consisting of three persons - the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. It is true whether you believe it or not.
I hope you can understand this simple fact...just because a doctrine doesn’t get “formally” defined until later, doesn’t mean it wasn’t something that had already been believed universally by Christians. I ask you once again to read back over this thread and see the many, many verses of Scripture that point to the divinity of Jesus Christ AS taught by Jesus as well as the earliest Christians and which were the foundation for the definition of the Trinity. I wouldn’t think of trying to force anyone to believe something - nor could I do so. All I know is that the Holy Spirit is who opens eyes and hearts to receive the truth...you just have to be willing to seek it with all your heart.
just because a doctrine doesn’t get “formally” defined until later, doesn’t mean it wasn’t something that had already been believed universally by Christians.
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Clearly it wasn’t “already universally believed” by Christians - it was a radical departure: “rife with contention, political agitation, and radical dissension in the early Church.” This begs the question: What did Christians believe BEFORE the bianity 300 years later and the trinity 400 years later?
Not only is there nothing in Tanach supporting Three, everything there supports One and warns of the consequences of deviating from One.
HaShem didn’t make mistakes in the “Old Testament.” There is no need for a “new testament” and in fact we’re explicitly warned about that. The same applies to the Quran, the “final testament.”
One can believe whatever they want and ‘have faith’ in whatever they want but the Tanach is crystal clear on the indivisible, non-partitioned, Unity of HaShem.
The bible overwhelmingly affirms the Godhead as two...father and son. The concept of “three” did not become codified until at least 300 years after the death of Christ.
How could it be a “radical departure” if the New Testament writings repeatedly affirm it?
As a Christian, I assert that I am a monotheist - that I believe in ONE God. Believing that Jesus the Messiah is the incarnate God and the Holy Spirit is the third person of the Trinity doesn’t mean Christians worship three gods. Jews and Muslims can’t seem to understand that because they refuse to and, because of that, God has allowed a veil of confusion over their eyes. One day, that veil will be removed and the truth will be known by all and at the name of Jesus, every knee shall bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father.
John 14:16-17-”And I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; [that is] the Spirit of the truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not behold Him or know Him, [but] you know Him because He abides with you, and will be in you.”
John 14:26-”But the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all that I said to you.”
John 15:26-”When the Helper comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, [that is] the Spirit of truth, who proceeds from the Father, He will bear witness of Me.”
John 16:7-8-”But I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper shall not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you. And He, when He comes, will convict the world...”
John 16:13-15-”But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come. He shall glorify Me; for He shall take of Mine, and shall disclose [it] to you. All things that the Father has are Mine; therefore I said, that He takes of Mine, and will disclose [it] to you.”
Evidence is overwhelming:
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2 He was in the beginning with God.
Joh 1:3 All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
No holy spirit in the Godhead.
Dan_7:13 "I was watching in the night visions, And behold, One like the Son of Man, Coming with the clouds of heaven! He came to the Ancient of Days, And they brought Him near before Him.
No holy spirit in the Godhead.
Rev 7:10 and crying out with a loud voice, saying, "Salvation belongs to our God who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb!"
Rev 7:11 All the angels stood around the throne and the elders and the four living creatures, and fell on their faces before the throne and worshiped God,
Who is God? Father and son, but no holy spirit.
What God does Paul send greetings from in EVERY letter? the God that is composed of the father and son:
1Co 1:3 Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.
Never a greeting from the holy spirit. Blasphemous of Paul if it were understood that way. But Paul didn't understand the Godhead that way. Nobody in biblical times did.
The historical evidence of how the trinity came about is crystal clear. It grew and developed and didn't become full fledged until centuries after the death of Christ. It's not biblical.
McArthur makes a mistake here to justify the trinity. Paul didn't believe in the trinity. There was no such thing. What he was talking about with the fellowship of the holy spirit is that Christians have something in common, they have a portion of God's holy spirit. It is that shared spirit, the fellowship, that's being referred to here.
The Holy Spirit Is a Person
The Holy Spirit is included in the Trinity, which is made up of 3 distinct persons: The Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. The following verses give us a beautiful picture of the Trinity in the Bible:
Matthew 3:16-17
As soon as Jesus (the Son) was baptized, he went up out of the water. At that moment heaven was opened, and he saw the Spirit of God (the Holy Spirit) descending like a dove and lighting on him. And a voice from heaven (the Father) said, "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased." (NIV)
Matthew 28:19
Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, (NIV)
John 14:16-17
And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever-- the Spirit of truth. The world cannot accept him, because it neither sees him nor knows him. But you know him, for he lives with you and will be in you. (NIV)
2 Corinthians 13:14
May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all. (NIV)
Acts 2:32-33
God has raised this Jesus to life, and we are all witnesses of the fact. Exalted to the right hand of God, he has received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit and has poured out what you now see and hear. (NIV)
The Holy Spirit has the Characteristics of Personality; The Holy Spirit has a Mind:
The Holy Spirit has a Will:
The Holy Spirit has Emotions, he grieves:
The Holy Spirit gives joy:
He Teaches:
He Testifies of Christ:
John 15:26
When the Counselor comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, the Spirit of truth who goes out from the Father, he will testify about me. (NIV)
He Convicts:
He Leads:
He Reveals Truth:
He Strengthens and Encourages:
Acts 9:31
Then the church throughout Judea, Galilee and Samaria enjoyed a time of peace. It was strengthened; and encouraged by the Holy Spirit, it grew in numbers, living in the fear of the Lord. (NIV)
He Comforts:
He Helps Us in our Weakness:
He Intercedes:
He Searches the Deep Things of God:
He Sanctifies:
He Bears Witness or Testifies:
He Forbids:
He Can be Lied to:
He Can be Resisted:
Acts 7:51
"You stiff-necked people, with uncircumcised hearts and ears! You are just like your fathers: You always resist the Holy Spirit!" (NIV)
He Can be Blasphemed:
He Can be Quenched:
http://christianity.about.com/od/topicalbiblestudies/a/whoisholyspirit.htm
How could it be a “radical departure”
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>>> The progression to bianity 300 years later and then trinity 400 years later are RADICAL changes. Read that history.
Jews and Muslims can’t seem to understand that [trinity] because they refuse to...
>>> Observant Jews and Muslims LIVE monotheistic lives. They pray directly, no middleman involved, not in some other man’s name, not through some other man, etc. DIRECT.
No need to create a man/god, virgin birth, alive/dead/personal relationship with the dead/coming back anytime now “Jewish” character to make the myth work.
Just ONE, non-incarnate, indivisible, non-partitionable God.
HaShem made Man in his image. Christians made their Lord in man’s image.
There's not even debate about this point. History is clear that the trinity doctrine did NOT become part of Christianity until over 3 centuries after Christ died. That means that no biblical figures believed it or taught it.
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