Posted on 03/30/2015 8:34:08 AM PDT by Laissez-faire capitalist
Here is the summation for the previous threads and the last of this for some time:
Jesus Christ alone possessed the intrinsic quality of infallibility, was unlike any man that has ever lived, and was in a class all by Himself.
There were some (like the Ebionites) who believed that Jesus was the messiah but also believed that he lacked divinity. Some, like those who ascribed to Arianism or semi-Arianism, who were somewhere in between the Ebionites and those who believed/believe that Jesus was fully God and Fully Man.
Each of these nonetheless believed that Jesus was unlike any man before Him or after Him.
There are those who would say that the Ebionites and those who ascribed to Arian belief did not place Jesus high enough, but it can be easily retorted that some place certain churches and men on too high a pedestal and ascribe to man and a church that which can only be possessed by Jesus Christ.
The tendency to try and claim infallibility (or something close to it) has been attempted more than once throughout history. The Pharisees declared to the man who was born blind, whom Jesus healed (John chapter 9:1-34 (verses 28-29): "You are this fellow's disciple! We are disciples of Moses! We know that God spoke to Moses, but as for this fellow we don't even know where he comes from." The man gave his retort to them in verses 30-33 to which they replied in verse 34: "You were steeped in sin at birth, how dare you lecture us! And they threw him out."
After this, there was a convergence of Big Government (Rome) and Big Council (Matthew 26:59: "Now the chief priest, and elders, and all the council, sought false witness against Jesus, to put him to death.").
After them, Big Council again tried to stifle the Apostles, as related in the Book of Acts.
Then there was a convergence of Big Gov't (Constantine) and Big Council. And after them another convergence of Big Gov't (Theodosius), yet another Big Council (Council of Constantinople) and Big Code (the Theodosian Code).
After them, Big Bishop (Bishop Athanasius), tried to suppress and dictate to others what others should read (what was being read during his time included both non-Gnostic, Heterodox texts like the Gospel of Peter, semi-Gnostic and Gnostic texts).
After him, there was a attempt by Big Church to suppress the translation of the scriptures by Wyclffe and others even though they were completely non-Gnostic scriptures.
Then, as well as now, one can claim to possess infallibility and point to certain scriptures in an attempt to bolster one's claim, but citing certain scriptures leads one to ask "How do you know your church possesses infallibility or inerrancy? Certain scriptures tell you that? How do you know that you are infallibility interpreting those scriptures or interpreting them without error? Because you possess infallibility or inerrancy?
If so, then welcome to the land of circular reasoning?
Only Jesus was infallible. Period.
Jesus alone.
Everything else we see darkly, because of our sin.
I finally reached the summation for the previous threads and what I was leading up to all along. Now I can move back to politics. I will still be a part of a hopefully lively discussion and hope further that we can all agree to disagree agreeably.
In the end, Constantine and Theodosius wanted to run a state and dissension stood in the way of that.
the fallable are incapable of proving infallabilty but some of us wont allow that to interrupt our attempts to wrest sovereignty....power..and glory from the one to whom all sovereignty....power..and glory belongs!!
Amen.
Jesus. His Word; however, is infallible. If, guided by the Holy Spirit, someone quotes His Word, they would be speaking God’s infallible Word. Miss-quoting would mean the speaker was not in the Spirit and be obvious to a hearer who is in the Spirit.
Is any book infallible?
Matthew 28:18 (NIV) Then Jesus came to them and said, “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me.
Sure...
Christ said He’d send the Holy Spirit to guide individuals in a thousand different directions, because truth is relative and individually revealed.....
Yes under the guidance of the Holy Spirit.
Jesus.
Excellent that would include translations.
Then that would explain why a supposedly infallible church had the Heterodox scripture “The Gospel of Peter” being read in a plethora of mid second century churches all over the Roman Empire and had the Revelation of Peter as part of the approved scripture in both Rome (as shown by the Muratorian Fragment, which reflected what was being read in the church in Rome c. 180 A.D.) and in Alexandria (as shown by the Clermont List which reflected what was being read in Alexandria in c. 300 A.D.
And we shouldn’t stop there, as the earlu church was rampant with so mant texts being read
And through the Holy Spirit that authority was given to Peter.
People must remember that Peter (or any human) is not impeccable. But when the decree speaks to faith and morals it is infallible.
I'm not seeing the part where they claimed infallibility.
The text indicates that (1) they were wrong (2) they didn't like being lectured and therefore (3) they wanted to throw the man out for lecturing them.
But many people have repeated these steps without claiming "infallibility or something close to it."
For example, Luther had pretty much the same attitude toward the Jews of his time that the Phrisees had toward the Jew whom Jesus cured. From Luther:
(1) "If I were to avenge myself on the devil himself I should be unable to wish him such evil and misfortune as God's wrath inflicts on the Jews, compelling them to lie and to blaspheme so monstrously, in violation of their own conscience."
That's obviously wrong.
(2) "I advise that their rabbis be forbidden to teach henceforth on pain of loss of life and limb."
He didn't like their lectures.
(3)"If this does not help we must drive them out like mad dogs, so that we do not become partakers of their abominable blasphemy and all their other vices and thus merit God's wrath and be damned with them."
He wanted them driven out.
So Luther delivered untrue statements with certainty and authority. Does that mean he claimed "infallibility or something close to it" too?
A number of Religions claim to be the TRUTH, Islam, Mormons, Catholic, Christian domination's, all believing their version are the best from Jehovah Witnesses, Catholic, Church of Christ, and many others. Israel and the Jews may have the truest faith. We simply know mankind has been involved and even with the best intentions do add and subtract form the HOLY SCRIPTURES.. God forgive us we know not what we do, in Jesus name amen.
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