Posted on 01/06/2003 6:58:16 AM PST by SheLion
It's been in place for five years now, but many Yuba-Sutter bar owners and patrons said they have yet to become accustomed to California's ban on smoking in bars.
At establishments such as Stassi's Fourth Ward Tavern in Marysville this weekend, business owners were still fuming over the ban, which took effect in January 1998.
The ban - a first for the nation - was intended to protect bartenders from health risks posed by second-hand smoke.
Yet Roy Newlove, the owner of Stassi's for roughly 10 years, said it does nothing more than slow business and cause headaches for his employees. Like many, Newlove called the ban a misguided attempt to protect public health.
"I think if the government helps me one more time I'll be out of business," Newlove said as most of his customers nodded in agreement.
Many bar owners throughout the area agreed the ban is a nuisance that has diminished the charm of going out for a drink.
Debbie and Doug Erhardt, the owners of Field and Stream Tavern in Marysville, said business has fallen off by as much as $2,000 on weekends since the ban took effect.
Fewer people want to go to Field and Stream now because the smoking ban forces them to go outside whenever they want to have a cigarette, Debbie Erhardt said.
"Nobody wants to go outside in 100 degree weather or in the cold," Erhardt said.
Ernie Leach, owner of the Corner Bar in Yuba City, said the ban has not been a major obstacle to building a clientele. Since he opened the bar a year ago, Leach said he never had to face the difficulty of telling loyal customers to put out their cigarettes.
However, the ban often causes him to force customers outside when they want to light up, Leach said.
"I have people complain about it all the time, but they just have to go outside," Leach said. "I think a person ought to have a choice and especially at a place called a bar."
The ban also has caused frustration among bartenders, who say it has added stress to their jobs.
Nancy Simpson, 40, a bartender at Jack's Tavern in Marysville, said the ban hurts bartenders who smoke by forcing them to leave their customers behind whenever they want to light up.
The ban also encourages smokers to sneak drinks outside the bars so they can drink while smoking, she said.
"They walk out with their drinks and then I have to ask them to leave," Simpson said.
Newlove said the ban also adds noise to streets and creates unsightly - and sometimes unruly - crowds outside bars.
"As soon as you've got everybody outside you lose control," Newlove said.
Some bar owners have managed to circumvent the ban by taking advantage of areas not covered in its language. Since the ban is intended to protect bar employees - and not bar owners - some entrepreneurs have exempted themselves from the ban by making all of their employees part owners.
Since they technically have no employees, owner-operated establishments can apply for exemptions through county agencies.
In Sutter County, there are at least three bars which have obtained such exemptions. They include Yuba City bars such as the Spur, Dowers Tavern and the 21 Club.
No information was available Saturday on whether there were any owner-operated bars in Yuba County.
Mary Benedict, a part owner of the Spur, criticized the ban and said the exemption has helped her clientele stay steady.
"You're supposed to be able to smoke and drink in a bar," Benedict said. "Governments hurt small businesses too much anyway."
Some bar owners in Marysville said exemptions in Yuba City bars have affected their businesses.
George Matsuda, the owner of Daikoku restaurant in Marysville, said fewer customers want to come to the bar in his business.
"The people that like to smoke, they've got to leave and go to a place where they can smoke," Matsuda said.
Bar patrons also criticized the ban. Some called it an infringement on their civil liberties.
Smoking outside Stassi's Fourth Ward on Saturday, Strawberry Valley resident Dennis Travis, 61, said the ban sometimes makes him think of moving to a state where smoking bans aren't in effect.
Travis said public officials are going too far in their attempts to eliminate health risks.
"We're trying too hard to protect people," Travis said.
Marysville resident Carl Supler, 59, said the ban is an affront to veterans who fought in foreign wars in an effort to preserve civil liberties.
"It's just one more of our freedoms taken away," Supler said. "We fought for this country and most of us didn't come back. Now we've got these bleeding hearts telling us what we can and can't do."
You are correct.
But, IMO, it should take a state constiutional amendment just like Florida did to ban it.
Anything else is unacceptable to me.
Even if I disagree with the amendment, if the state passes an amendment to the state constitution banning smoking in private establishments, it tells me that I don't want to live in that state.
Well, obviously you haven't accepted it or you wouldn't still be arguing the point. What it comes down to is that smokers and their families and friends go out for the same reason you do, to relax and get a change of pace and be catered to for a change. Many times exhorbitant prices are paid for the privilege of having someone else do the cooking and serving. For smokers, following a course, or at least a meal with a cigarette is part of the complete experience. It is what THEY enjoy. They PAY for the privilege same as you. And again I emphasize that great lengths have been gone to by eating establishments overall to manage the smoke from smoking areas. In many cases the smoking areas are completely separate rooms. So given all that, you are still suggesting that you have more right to enjoy your dining out experience than another who enjoys having a cigarette with his after dinner chat. That is just selfish in the extreme.
You mean they had a violent mixture of bikers, dancing girls and alcohol? I'm shocked, I tell you, shocked!
Consider this: if it were a strictly local issue, then smokers/clean-air-demanding folks could potentially live in adjoining municipalities with the advantage of easy travel to establishments of their choice.
Firearms. CCW. A bigger house. Fewer people. Lower cost of living. Lower income tax. Lower sales tax. Less traffic (a 7.5 mile commute to work should not take 40 to 70 minutes). A 10 minute drive to hunting areas for deer, elk, moose. Four seasons with low humidity in the summer. Fewer socialists in the legislature.
My Spanish is terrible too. Half the convenience store window ads at my local Circle-K store were in Spanish. The graffitti was half Spanish with the balance in a variety of asian languages. My evening walks were making the gang bangers nervous.
The blight of high energy costs and taxes was manifested by closing of one small business after the next...one mile from my home. These were businesses that opened AFTER I purchased my home. I figured it was time to ditch my real estate before the blighted businesses, gangs and other negative elements took a serious bite out of my equity.
Yes, Californians are getting "younger," because older, more affluent people are moving out to states with less restrictive, less "democratic," less politically correct, less liberal governing bodies. The population has grown 22% over the past four years or so, and a large percentage of those new Californians are immigrants from other countries, many of them illegal, and many who cost more than they contribute. The state's revenues increased $25 billion during the same time, but we're in the hole $35 billion.
You seem to think that having "entry level" citizens is a good thing; many of us disagree when our taxes are raised to pay for the excess services those younger people need.
You're right about one thing, though. The change in the face of California has less to do with smoking than it does with a general abrogation of rights. When people look to Big Government, whether state or federal, to take care of them they give up their autonomy. I lived in Rancho Mirage, speaking of "old money" vs "new money" around the Palm Springs area, and my business was located in Palm Desert at the beginning of the boom. Faster, bigger, more quickly obsolete, younger, easily bored, etc., are not signs of the betterment of an area or of a people.
I'd like a caveat on that, Joe. The antis and health fascists should not be permitted to use taxpayer funds to lobby for such an amendment, and NO ONE should be permitted to lie about it. Make the playing field "level" as they all claim they want, and I'd agree as well.
JD
I lived in Palm Desert for five years, 'till 1992. Glad to meet you. I had some problems with the schools there regarding my daughter, who was in Kindergarten at the time; they decided to do weird things with the kids. I joined a grass roots group out there and made some changes: required informing parents of programs and receiving written parental consent regarding their weird programs. It took months of fighting, but the Hatch Amendment made the Desert Sands School District afraid and it was the only reason why they listened to us.
I didn't think so.
You say that like those are bad things? See, when you hand over your freedom to daddy government, they don't just stop at cigarettes. Gov't has an insatiable appetite. It's also health care, and since they pay for that, they ban cigarettes, 'cause it makes the health care costs go up. Then they tell you what you can eat, you know heart disease and all, and so on, and so on.
One day, they ban something you LIKE, and you just can't believe how that happened. The funny thing is, you supported it all along. All the while, they take 60-70% of your earnings to pay for it. SUCKER!
And I used to go with my grandma when she went to play bingo and it was the same way. Nearly everybody smoked. My grandma didn't and she would occasionally make a passing remark about it. I didn't care for it either but if it bothered me I went and played in the hallway. Didn't hurt me any. The point is that a lot of changes have been made and things are a lot different now than they were 30-40 years ago and few places are THAT bad. Many concessions have been made to accommodate nonsmokers, but it just isn't enough to satisfy some people.
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