Posted on 10/13/2009 8:10:10 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
O’Reilly told Dawkins”
you insist you can’t even mention it, that is fascism, sir.
Was he right? Is it constitutional/scientific to insist that only materialistic evolution can be taught?
See: O’Reilly vs. Atheist Author Richard Dawkins...
(Excerpt) Read more at uncommondescent.com ...
And your universe where the Earth is NOT in orbit around the Sun? That does fit the physical evidence?
There you go again with yet another strawan! Creationists (myself included) don’t believe in a God of the gaps. We believe God’s Word when He says that he created the ENTIRE UNIVERSE and EVERYTHING IN IT, and that HE IS CURRENTLY UPHOLDING EVERY ASPECT OF IT BY THE WORD OF HIS POWER. That does not leave any room for your puny “god of the gaps”, dreamer.
You mean you’re still here harassing conservatives?
You seriously don’t understand people are onto you?
Liberals have no shame!
==Since your universe does not fit either the physical evidence, nor God’s description of it, we cannot allow you to call your games “science.”
Yes, quite. Indeed, that is why I refer to dreamer’s anti-science coreligionists as the Temple of Darwin.
Cdesign proponentists do believe in a “designer” of the gaps, and thus a “god of the gaps”.
Do you think that magical mystical powers must uphold every aspect of reality, or can you accept that the power of God may be manifest by the natural laws that God put in place?
Right now a star is forming off in the universe by the power of gravity and nuclear fusion. Is God any less the creator of THAT star than HE is our own?
Care to answer the question this time?
Dmz,
Do you cut and paste NEA talking points without seeing how they relate to the post to which you are responding? ( Just wondering.)
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Wintertime - do you simply cut and paste your talking points from your previous posts? (just wondering)
You have been posting this for years now. And I’ve been responding to them from time to time with the same boilerplate that you use to create the posts.
I mentioned 3 other avenues, legal avenues, of educating one’s children that have nothing to do with government run, public schools. Do you deny the accuracy of those statements?
Your response seems to be to change the subject from the religiously non-neutral schools to the fact that it makes you angry that you have to pay taxes that go to the maintenance of these schools. Death and taxes. The only 2 certainties in this life.
And since when does the NEA support the notion of homeschooling? (referencing your comment about my use of NEA talking points).
One of my parents’ friends was jailed in the early ‘70s for his tax protesting (he didn’t pay them - unconstitutional income taxes was his thing), so I’ve heard these arguments for close to 40 years. Nothing new in your views.
Listen up, dreamer. What you refer to as “natural” laws is nothing more than a description of the regular, predictable, logical way that God upholds the universe by the power of His Word. Why you, who claims to be a Christian, would want to give the credit to anybody or anything else besides God is beyond me.
Well, being in the companion of 6/6,000 believers and flat earth proponents definitely hurts the credibility of educated conservatists, and makes disputing the mentioned global warming scare much harder.
LOL!!!! “Conservatists” ???? It’s “conservatives”. LOL! Not that anyone wasn’t already onto you! LOL!
And you no doubt have a source for this contention too?
I know liberals like to throw around things like “cretards are stoopid and don’t understand science” and things...
but when the average normal person looks into such charges, they find a very VERY different truth...
as people have pointed out, this just isn’t true and an outright lie and these students out-perform their peers when it comes to science.
You already have one strike with your nutty liberal website.
Here’s what a conservatIVE link looks like btw:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/2347175/posts?q=1&;page=301#323
And here are some more links:
http://www.evolutionnews.org/2006/03/americans_overwhelmingly_suppo.html
Headline: “Americans Overwhelmingly Support Teaching Scientific Challenges to Darwinian Evolution, Zogby Poll Shows” From March 2006.
http://www.discovery.org/scripts/viewDB/filesDB-download.php?command=download&id=719
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Free Republic Poll on Evolution
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-backroom/1706571/posts?page=63#63
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Creationism makes a comeback in US
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1856224/posts
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Teaching creation and evolution in schools
Solid research reveals American beliefs
http://www.answersingenesis.org/tj/v13/i2/teaching.asp
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Survey Finds Support Is Strong For Teaching 2 Origin Theories
http://query.nytimes.com/gst/fullpage.html?res=9B07E4D9143BF932A25750C0A9669C8B63
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Public Divided on Origins of Life
http://people-press.org/report/254/religion-a-strength-and-weakness-for-both-parties
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Americans Believe in Jesus, Poll Says (creation poll results included)
http://derekgulbranson.com/2005/01/17/americans-believe-in-jesus/
Unlike you I think those laws are sufficient to upholding the universe, I don't think that there IS a gap.
The Incompetent Design philosophy thinks that the physical phenomena of evolution and common descent cannot be explained by physical laws, and that there must be a “gap” that is filled by the power of “the designer”.
Thus the Cdesign Proponentists worship a “god of the gaps”, rather than the God of an ordered and understandable universe.
You claim to believe in God, but only really believe in a god. But what you truly worship is yourself, and your delusion that YOU have the correct interpretation of the Bible, and thus you stick to it despite mountains of contradictory evidence in the natural world.
Have a Yabba Dabba Doo day!
Do you think that magical mystical powers must uphold every aspect of reality, or can you accept that the power of God may be manifest by the natural laws that God put in place?
Right now a star is forming off in the universe by the power of gravity and nuclear fusion. Is God any less the creator of THAT star than HE is our own?
Care to answer the question THIS time?
You just totally nuked your credibility with that link to that website.
It’s clearly written by someone whose agenda is to discredit any thing the Bible has to say about anything.
That’s as bad as the theocracy links that coyoteman used to post.
The whole business of literal interpretation of the Bible has been explained to you before and you still refuse to get it.
You’re clearly going to believe what you want to believe about creationists and Bible interpretation and obviously nothing anyone can say is going to change your mind.
Since all those options are available and acceptable to offer to Christian parents why not consider this?
Since this nation is founded on Judeo-Christian principles and for centuries before the ACLU kicked into action, every school day opened with Bible reading and prayer in schools across the nation, and since most people in this country claim some sort of religious affiliation with some sort of religion that recognizes the Bible as part of their sacred writings, we put Bible reading and prayer BACK into the schools as it once was in the days when schools actually amounted to something.
Then, since private schools and homeschools are legal, those who don’t wish to have that kind of influence in their children’s education, can opt out of the public education system and start their own religion free and God free atheistic private schools, on their own dime.
Just like the option that is thrown as a scrap to all the Christians who object to the atheistic, secular education that has been forced on this country as a result of lawsuits instigated by the ACLU.
After all, what’s good for the goose is good for the gander. If that option is adequate for those in the majority who don’t like what the minority have inflicted on them, it should be good enough for the minority instead of forcing the majority to live by their standards.
Sure, there is no doubt about the agenda. Nevertheless, the Biblical references are genuine - when I used them for the first time, I checked them with the KJV Bible. So, the agenda is irrelevant to the conclusion: if you want to defend the literal interpretation of Genesis, you should not shy away from the flat Earth belief either. Conversely, if you defend these flat, unmovable Earth-related passages with arguments of “allegorical/poetic meaning” or “simplicity”, then the same possibility should be allowed in the case of Genesis.
If the argument is framed properly, our police enforced, religiously NON-NEUTRAL, government indoctrination camps can ( in fact **will**) lose their legitimacy. Overnight they can and will collapse. Why? Answer: Read my tagline.
The NEA can promote hundreds of talking points and nothing will stop the unraveling once it starts.
For every parent or taxpayer that has been frustrated by their crushing burden that government indoctrination camps (oops! “schools”) on their wallets and their lives and the lives of their children, they must remember the following **fundamental** principles that underlie all government indoctrination camps.
Fundamentally,....It is impossible for government schools to be religiously neutral. ALL government schools establish the NON-NEUTRAL religious worldview of the government. ( At the moment atheistic.)
ALL of our religiously NON-NEUTRAL government schools have armed police standing ready to force the citizen to fund this government religious indoctrination and to force students into these “schools”.
ALL of our religiously NON-NEUTRAL government schools price-fixed their fee and in doing so make private schools scarce. The forced funding in the form of funding compel many families to have both parents working. The combination of these two business practices force parents to send their children into the religiously NON-NEUTRAL government schools. And..Police stand ready to force attendance.
So...Please let's drop the NEA canard that all parents have the “choice” to use private schools or homeschools. The business practices of our religiously NON-NEUTRAL government indoctrination camps have distorted that market.
No citizen has the right to refuse to support the religious NON-NEUTRAL religious establishment of a ( at the moment) atheism in our government indoctrination camps.
The NEA would like to portray our oppressive government indoctrination camps as being somehow warm and fuzzy....but...Remember, behind every government indoctrination camp stands an armed policeman. ( Real bullets in those guns on the hip!)
I’ve seen the FRevos and almost to a man they stand behind the ACLU and federal government control of education.
Almost without exception, they support mandatory vaccines on the threads that deal with them.
On the rare foray over to DC, I’ve seen one brag about how they were able to support gay marriage for years on FR by taking the position that the government shouldn’t be involved in defining marriage.
Most of them refuse to take a conservative position on abortion, instead waffling on when life begins and if it begins at conception, then proposing the absurdity that every woman who has a miscarriage should be investigated for manslaughter.
On almost every thread that deals with morals, one can just about count on the liberal posts having a FRevo screenname attached to it.
I know what conservative positions are and it’s NOT advocating for federal government control of ANYTHING.
And...It is with such ideas that large seemingly impenetrable institutions can lose their legitimacy overnight.
Just ask Martin Luther, Louis IVX, George III, etc.
Ideas are the **most** powerful thing in the world. That we even exist began with an idea in the mind of God.
Government schools are illegitimate. Government schools **are** fundamentally and First Amendment and freedom of conscience abomination!
The legitimate solution of course is to begin the process of privatizing all K-12 education.
Tag line: Good ideas win! Why? Because people are not stupid!
Grammar plays a role in interpretation.
Not all the verses that were posted in that link were from Genesis.
It is more than a stretch to claim that those verses, even interpreted literally, mean a geocentric and flat earth.
And, since you admit that the guy has an agenda, then the whole post at that link should be tossed in the shredder.
When anyone who makes no claim to religious beliefs demands that his interpretation of Scripture be taken seriously, or tells others how they are to interpret Scripture, that person loses all credibility.
Creationists are regularly taken to task for not understanding science and trying to have input on how it’s done or interpreted and yet evos have no problem turning around and telling others how they are to interpret material outside the evos area of expertise.
Sorry. It doesn’t work. Not buying it.
You have not redeemed your credibility with that excuse.
Not grammar so much. Rather literary devices.
About what? The geocentric theory and flat earth? Sure:
http://hypertextbook.com/eworld/geocentric.shtml
Uhhhh....no...your smears about educated conservatives.
From the website:
A translation of this article into Hebrew (without the New Testament references) is also available through Hofesh — an organization that combats Orthodox Jewish religious coercion in Israel.
Wow.
And more:
You’d think Ralph Reed and Jerry Falwell would be up in arms over these facts. Massive government bureaucracies send spacecraft to distant planets. The liberal media are awash in images of a spherical earth. (The Universal Studios logo is a globe!) Children in public schools are taught from Kindergarten that the earth revolves around the sun. With the exceptions of the persistent use of the terms “sunrise” and “sunset,” our modern world is flooded with images of heretical cosmologies that remove the earth from its God-given place at the center of all things. Only an atheist would buy the notion that we live on a tiny rock, circling an insignificant star in a galaxy of billions of stars in a universe of billions of galaxies. Why would God place his most holy of all creations in such location? Surely, no true believer in the Scriptures — the divine and unerring word of God — would accept the scientific notion that we live in place that is not special in the eyes of our Creator. I find it quite reasonable to insist on a Constitutional amendment requiring all Supreme Court justices to swear their allegiance to geocentrism and flat-earthism. Our souls and the souls of our children lie in their hands.
Introduction
O.K. You can stop hyperventilating now. The previous paragraphs are an example of a rhetorical device known as hyperbole. A hyperbole is an exaggerated statement that is not meant to be taken literally, but is used to emphasize a point. The purpose of this essay is to demolish the notion that the Bible has any scientific relevance whatsoever. In particular, I aim to show that the same thinking that leads devout fundamentalists to deny evolution as atheism must also lead them to embrace geocentrism and flat-earthism as God-given truths.
So why would I do this? What got me started on the road to endless arguments? I work as a teacher in the New York City public school system. From time to time, I’m asked quite poignant and perceptive questions.
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Ahhhhh....a secular humanist liberal NYC liberal public school teacher!
Well, we can certainly see where the liberals get their talking points anyway!
Here’s a clue...when you link obvious moonbat links like this...you kinda stick out like a sore thumb!
Are you one of those liberal professor types?
“It is not a strawman that many have correctly pointed out that it is the view of God as the creator of an ordered universe that obeys the laws that HE set down that has made Jewish and Christian individuals and cultures such fertile ground for scientific progress”
Of course it’s a strawman, because no one has argued that somehow God or anyone that believes in God is anti-science as evos contend or that the Judeo-Christian cultures have somehow been UN-scientific just because they understand scripture, or rightly recognize design.
Just like it’s not anti-scientific to understand God is greater than science.
When you contort yourself into such pretzels...
well, as was pointed out dreamer, your point is actually received crystal clear and is exactly what’s bringing you down!
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