Posted on 05/02/2005 7:25:14 AM PDT by worldclass
Noting that in his Good Friday homily soon-to-be pope Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger condemned the "filth there is in the church," Wheeler believes the pontiff "will not tolerate [homosexuality's] presence in his church."
(Excerpt) Read more at worldnetdaily.com ...
"No one in the Catholic church ever put the welcome matt for homosexual predators to join the priesthood."
Check out this book review. It may change your opinion.
"This bombshell book reveals a seminary underworld in which homosexual promiscuity and sexual harassment is rampant, in which straight men are marginalized and demoralized, and seminarians who support the Church's teaching on sexuality and the priesthood are persecuted, even to the point of being sent off, Soviet-style for psychological evaluations. Many of these guys are rejected from entering the seminaries, expelled, or driven by depression to leave. "
http://www.nationalreview.com/dreher/dreher031302.shtml
So, then, the Church should actually abandon Latin for Aramaic and/or Hebrew?? Sorry, but THAT just won't wash. At SOME point, the dogma HAS to be translated accurately into the local vernacular in order to explain the faith to potential converts.
Otherwise, the FIRST thing the RC church would have to do would be to teach Latin classes.
That's NO joke. He never agreed with the 'Liturgists' who dumped the Latin Mass totally, in favor of the Mass done in the vernacular. He thinks Latin Mass should be available to those who wish to attend it, and it not be such a hardship to do so.
An astute observation; it's narcissism, pure and simple.
“Of course "evidence" can be found”
Yes, but your original post said this was not in the Bible.
“Who is the RCC to invent a Christian "Priesthood" ”
The Roman Catholic Church is the Church Christ established on earth 2,000 years ago:
“Jesus replied, "Blessed are you, Simon son of Jonah, for this was not revealed to you by man, but by my Father in heaven. And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it. I will give you the keys of the kingdom of heaven; whatever you bind on earth will be bound in heaven, and whatever you loose on earth will be loosed in heaven." (Matt. 16:17-19)” Here Christ promised that Peter’s decisions as leader of the Church would be binding in heaven. From John 21:21-24 “Again Jesus said, “Peace be with you! As the Father has sent me, I am sending you. And with that he breathed on them and said, “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive anyone his sins, they are forgiven; if you do not forgive them, they are not forgiven.” There was one other time in the Bible that God breathed on man - when God breathed life into Adam. This was something very special. Christ was creating his priesthood, and clearly giving this priesthood special gifts. These gifts could not have been intended to die with the Apostles, unless Christ was planning a very quick return.
“There are entire paragraphs of "biblical evidence" that the standard minister role, the elder, must be married”
The point of Paul's teaching is not that a man must be married in order to be a bishop, but that a bishop may not be married more than once. If this passage meant that a bishop had to be married, Paul would have been in violation of his own rule (1 Cor. 7:7-8, 9:5). A rule forbidding a man to have more than one wife does not order him to have at least one. A man who never marries does not violate the rule. Also, Paul, being a bishop who ordained other men to be bishops (1 Tim.1:6), would have been a hypocrite if he enjoined such a rule ("to be a bishop you must be married") and then, by his own admission (1 Cor. 7:8-9) ignored his own rule.
I don't think seminaries in general have that kind of problem. There is no doubt that some areas seemed to draw these homosexual pedophiles like flies to you know what.
I also think this problem is huge in all faiths around the world.
America became the focus of this stuff because we have a very open society.
I believe many cultural changes have been made to avoid this in the future throughout society.
Notice there is a policy to leave doors open between priests and people, educators with students, employers with employees and so on.
There has been great progress in this country to avoid the problems to a greater extent IMO.
Yes it is his point otherwise there wouldn't have been the mention of kids. It doesn's say "no more than one". It says one.
The RCC priesthood could start offering sheep and cite that "there is evidence in the bible of priests offering sheep" as proof that they should. And that too would be the same kind of misuse of the bible. This was my point and I think it was pretty clear.
Do you believe that the pope has the power to grant or deny salvation to a man?
"Latin didn't exactly set the African Church on fire 40 years ago, did it?"
Actually, the ICKSP is spreading the Latin Mass all throughout Africa. Michael Davies, RIP, wrote some great articles on their fluency in Latin and their wonderful singing.
But don't let the facts get in the way.
Just compare the 2 confiteors. That's the tip of the iceberg. One relegates the saints to a second thought...
If Peter really was "all that" why did Paul never once mention it. He also never once mentioned any of the things DeMontfort says about Mary. How could it be that the person who wrote most of the NT via the Holy Spirit failed to mention this? Never is Pope or the human vicar of Christ or his infalibility or his word being equal to scripture every once mentioned in the bible. So how could those verses possibly mean what you suggest they mean?
"The RCC priesthood could start offering sheep ..."
You should know better. Christ instructed the Church to preach everything he taught (Matt. 28:19–20) and promised the protection of the Holy Spirit to "guide you into all the truth" (John 16:13). That mandate and that promise guarantee the Church will never fall away from his teachings (Matt. 16:18, 1 Tim. 3:15)
Are you seriously saying that Latin Masses predominate in Africa?
Surely you're not. You know better than that.
He never said that anything calling itself a church was infallible. He, all scripture is His word, warns again and again of false teachers and false doctrines and Judisers(sp), those trying to reinvent and apply Jewish laws and traditions. He never warns about the scriptures though, thought He does warn that some twist the scriptures to fool you.
"Sorry, but THAT just won't wash. At SOME point, the dogma HAS to be translated accurately into the local vernacular in order to explain the faith to potential converts."
"Otherwise, the FIRST thing the RC church would have to do would be to teach Latin classes."
Really? Prior to Vatican II, in the U.S., there were 150,000 conversions per year. Now, there are 60,000. Doesn't look like removing Latin from the liturgy has really helped that one. Read "Index of Leading Catholic Indicators."
The Mass embodies the truths of the Faith. Every Latin Mass had Latin/English missals with ACCURATE translations. The people knew their parts of the Mass "in Latin." It is a principle called "repetitio est mater studiorum," and I am certain you can understand what that means, even if you don't understand Latin.
Your argument, especially in an issue that does not concern your Church, about Hebrew and Aramaic is silly. Neither of those languages were ever adapted as the official language of the Church. Latin was. Latin is. Latin will be forever.
Una Voce. You don't want to consider a real answer. You just want to argue. Have your opinions all you want, but since you are not Catholic, I wander why you really even care.
"Are you seriously saying that Latin Masses predominate in Africa?"
I don't know, Sinky. Read what I wrote. Did I write that? Did I insinuate that?
Twisting and turning and shucking and jiving. You take words, turn them around, manipulate them, then spew out your "heresy of heresies" around every rock and corner. It gets old.
Modernists do not reproduce intellectually. Modernists do not reproduce spiritually. Modernists do not reproduce physically.
The war is over. You have lost. You many have won 40 years of battles, but the war is over.
Christus Vincit! Christus Regnat! Christus Imperat!
"What about Sts. Cyril and Methodius? Pope John VIII certainly thought that the Slavonic liturgy would help spread the Gospel."
I went to a Slavonic Mass in St. Petersburg last year. All old folks. One family with children. I was the only non Slav there. Attendance about 45 or 50.
Most Catholics have never even heard of this. I am sure it spread the Faith to the Slavonic people, but it did not spread the Faith universally as the Latin rite did throughout the world.
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