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Pregnant woman shot over cigarette (The Hate has GOT to STOP)
The Times-Picayune ^ | 5 October 2002 | Michael Perlstein

Posted on 10/06/2002 7:48:41 AM PDT by SheLion

Edited on 07/14/2004 12:59:06 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]

Most people cringe at the sight of a pregnant woman smoking. Some people feel strongly enough to say something in protest. But one local man took matters into his own hands early Friday when, according to police, he shot an expectant mother who refused to put out her cigarette.


(Excerpt) Read more at nola.com ...


TOPICS: Activism/Chapters; Culture/Society; Government; US: Louisiana
KEYWORDS: antismokers; butts; cigarettes; individualliberty; michaeldobbs; niconazis; prohibitionists; pufflist; smokingbans; taxes; tobacco
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To: metesky
You keep refering to dowery, which is the bride price. I think you are talking about a womens estate rights which would be Dower and Curtsey, the right of the spouse to a share of the estate whether willed or not. I remember it from real estate sales courses a millenium (sp?) ago.

Thank you. Dower rights are still in force in this millenium in my state.

321 posted on 10/07/2002 6:18:36 PM PDT by waterstraat
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To: Great Dane
The question was why, not whether it was legal. In addition to side busting the conversation you answerd the wrong question.

If your response is something nonsensical again, don't bother. If you want to tell me what a great person this is who risked her baby's health in such a cavalier fashion as to almost brag about it, then put up your best.

Strange she didn't respond. Are you the organ grinder or the monkey?

322 posted on 10/07/2002 6:33:17 PM PDT by breakem
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To: Just another Joe
The CDC says 1995-1999, smoking caused approximately 440,000 premature deaths in the United States annually and approximately $157 billion in annual health-related economic losses. What are your numbers and your sources?

I don't have any numbers

Enough said.....

As for smokers not being able to physically keep up with non-smokers - I know smokers that run half, and full, marathons. Not all, probably not many. It's just like anything else, some are couch potatos and some are not.

Ill take your challenge, any male, my age or older, who smokes a pack a day, and I challenge any woman, any age, who smokes a pack a day to a race for even moneyHow about bringing lots of money, all your money, to the Pikes Peak race held every August? If you dont make the cutoff, you forfeit your bet. Put your money where your mouth is.

323 posted on 10/07/2002 6:39:16 PM PDT by waterstraat
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To: Gabz
Well apparently the term is not being used in the State of Delaware - I would have heard of it - not that I am planning divorce - but the phrase is not utilized at all in our deed, mortgage or contract with our realtor for sale of our property.

Delaware: Delaware law presumes that real estate conveyed or deeded to a husband or wife during their marriage is a joint tenancy in common unless a joint tenancy is specifically created. During a marriage, a husband and wife may separately sell or mortgage real estate without their spouse signing onto it. The spouse may have an inheritance right, sometimes referred to as a dower, courtesy, or statutory share, in the real estate and usually the spouse joins in signing a contract, deed or mortgage. Delaware law requires that in the case of sale or mortgage both spouses sign the contract, deed or mortgage. Delaware Code §25-102 through 124; 25-311, 701.

324 posted on 10/07/2002 6:56:28 PM PDT by waterstraat
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To: Gabz
BTW how much of the Code (state law) of your state have you helped to enact? How much of it have you helped write? How much have you actually written????

My efforts have been mostly on repealing laws, and not in making more new laws. I think we have too many laws now. I dont want any more new laws. I have been successful in helping to repeal several laws, and I was also very active in ending the draft.

The only laws I ever helped to get passed was: reductions and limitations in property taxes, shall issue ccws, etc.

325 posted on 10/07/2002 7:06:59 PM PDT by waterstraat
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To: waterstraat
The CDC says 1995-1999, smoking caused approximately 440,000 premature deaths in the United States annually and approximately $157 billion in annual health-related economic losses. What are your numbers and your sources?

OK, you want facts and figures? You got 'em.
More than 17,000 of those "premature deaths" occur in people over 85 years of age; nearly 200,000 deaths assigned as "smoking related" occur from ages 75-85; more than 115,000 are in the 65-75 age range.
And since there are NO death certificates that list the cause of death as "smoking", where do they get their figures? (hint) THEY MAKE THEM UP!

As for the 157 billion - if you're going to do a cost/ benefit analysis you need to look at the costs AND the benefits not just the costs.
On the other hand, the nonpartisan Congressional Research Service report "Cigarette Taxes to Fund Health Care Reform and Economic Analysis." (CRS, Library of Congress, #94214 E ) DID take all those things into account, and found that smokers, even as far back as 1994, paid into the system far more than they ever take out.
Or, you could take a look here, The "Social Costs" of Smoking.
OR, maybe it's the difference between warm and cold economics.
"Cold" economists say that a person who dies upon retirement[the Rooseveltian ideal] saves the Federal purse and private pension plans the costs of Social Security benefits and retirement annuities. Warm economists say that this is not the kind of calculation that a civilized society engages in. (From: HOUSE TESTIMONY )

I don't remember making a challenge. Could you point me to the post where I made a physical challenge to anyone.
I didn't say that I ran half, or full, marathons. I said that I know smokers that do. If YOU would care to challenge them I'll contact them and tell them to FReepmail you.
I keep myself in decent physical shape but nowhere near competition shape.
I work out with weights about 4 hours a week and run about a mile twice a week.
That's to keep my weight down not to make up for my smoking.

326 posted on 10/07/2002 7:57:00 PM PDT by Just another Joe
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To: waterstraat
My efforts have been mostly on repealing laws, and not in making more new laws.

Where did I say anything about making new laws? Exactly no where.

My goal in life is to reduce government, which means gettig rid of excessive laws. At least we agree on one thing. It's something I've been doing for the past 15 years.

How do laws restricting the rights of private business owners to cater to their customers help reduce government?

327 posted on 10/07/2002 8:06:49 PM PDT by Gabz
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To: waterstraat
How about bringing lots of money, all your money, to the Pikes Peak race held every August?

What is it? I've never heard of it.

But if you want this female smoker to mess with you running - you will be the one coming to the east coast. NO ONE - and I mean NO ONE - ever tells me where I go or what I do.

BTW - I run every day - and smoke at least a pack a day.

328 posted on 10/07/2002 8:16:50 PM PDT by Gabz
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To: waterstraat
What the code says and what I said are two different things.
329 posted on 10/07/2002 8:23:57 PM PDT by Gabz
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To: Tired of Taxes
Not a conventional way to handle a problem, but it worked. ;-)

I will keep in mind your mother's handling of the situation if my daughter ever decides to try the habit. Thanks

330 posted on 10/07/2002 8:35:49 PM PDT by Gabz
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To: Tired of Taxes
I believe his birthweight was lower because I didn't eat enough. Therefore, it's not a stretch

Bwahahaha!

Did you do that on purpose? Not a stretch! Bwahaha!

331 posted on 10/08/2002 2:08:47 AM PDT by metesky
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To: Just another Joe
OK, you want facts and figures? You got 'em. More than 17,000 of those "premature deaths" occur in people over 85 years of age; nearly 200,000 deaths assigned as "smoking related" occur from ages 75-85; more than 115,000 are in the 65-75 age range. And since there are NO death certificates that list the cause of death as "smoking", where do they get their figures? (hint) THEY MAKE THEM UP!

Wow! That is interesting, I will check it out.

332 posted on 10/08/2002 2:43:19 AM PDT by waterstraat
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To: waterstraat
The CDC says 1995-1999, smoking caused approximately 440,000 premature deaths in the United States annually and approximately $157 billion in annual health-related economic losses. What are your numbers and your sources?

Using the CDC's own numbers, what percentage of those "premature" deaths occurred after age 85? Do you know? How about the "premature" deaths that occurred after age 75? Hint: More than 70,000 after 85, nearly 200,000 after 75--hardly what most people would consider "premature." Do you have any idea how the CDC came up with that figure or do you just "assume" since they say it, it's carved in stone?

As for smokers as athletes, you may not remember, but before the current hype and hysteria, a much larger percentage of the population smoked, and many of those smokers were athletes. Some of them set records that have only recently been broken. I can't speak for marathons--never appealed to me to run for the sake of running--but I know many tennis players and other athletes who smoke and do quite well. You have swallowed the anti rhetoric hook, line and sinker, but if it makes you happy to be ignorant of the facts, knock yourself out.

333 posted on 10/08/2002 11:09:13 AM PDT by Max McGarrity
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To: Gabz
Die-hard antis also claim it causes ADD, ADHD, and learning diabilities.

Gabz, earlier this week I noticed handmade signs taped to the wall with arrows pointing down the hall: "Forensics Shop--Get fingerprints FREE!" 7-year-old grandson had created a working forensics lab, using graphite and tape. Nope, will never believe the "learning disabilities" crap.

334 posted on 10/08/2002 11:16:29 AM PDT by Max McGarrity
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To: Just another Joe
Ahem. Sorry, Joe, I've just gotta learn to read ALL the posts before jumping in with my 2 cents.
335 posted on 10/08/2002 11:19:29 AM PDT by Max McGarrity
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To: SheLion
I smoked before, during and AFTER my pregnancy!

You must be so proud! Did you drink hard and huff paint thinner, too?

336 posted on 10/08/2002 11:24:37 AM PDT by Sloth
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To: Sloth
A little late to the pile on party, aren't you?
Read the whole thread and then post an idea that hasn't already been used, if you can possibly think of anything that HASN'T already been used.
337 posted on 10/08/2002 11:41:24 AM PDT by Just another Joe
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To: Just another Joe
I didn't realize FR guidelines now mandate originality.... I'll be sure to follow you around on other threads and rebuke you for posting ideas that have already been stated somewhere.
338 posted on 10/08/2002 11:46:27 AM PDT by Sloth
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To: Sloth
I didn't realize FR guidelines now mandate originality

They don't, just a FRiendly suggestion.
If the thought has already been discussed ad infinitum wouldn't you want to see what defenses have been used?

339 posted on 10/08/2002 11:50:21 AM PDT by Just another Joe
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To: Just another Joe
OK, I just skimmed through the rest of the thread... I see no "defenses", just emotional reactions, variation on two general themes -- 'mind your own business, fascist' and 'my momma did heroin and I turned out fine'. Neither one addresses the cost-benefit ratio that LionelHutz tried to examine.
340 posted on 10/08/2002 12:41:35 PM PDT by Sloth
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