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Mary's Relationship with the Trinity
EWTN ^ | January 1996 | Pope John Paul II

Posted on 06/16/2003 8:41:08 PM PDT by Salvation

MARY’S RELATIONSHIP WITH THE TRINITY
Pope John Paul II

Our Lady, who was granted the dignity of being the Mother of God, is also the favoured daughter of the Father and the temple of the Holy Spirit

Mary "is endowed with the high office and dignity of the Mother of the Son of God, and therefore she is also the beloved daughter of the Father and the temple of the Holy Spirit" (Lumen gentium, n. 53). With this quote from the Second Vatican Council, the Holy Father expressed in concise form the Trinitarian dimension of Marian doctrine, which was the subject of his catechesis at the General Audience of Wednesday, 10 January. Here is a translation of his address, which was the 11th in the series on the Blessed Virgin and was given in Italian.

1. The eighth chapter of the Constitution Lumen gentium shows in the mystery of Christ the absolutely necessary reference to Marian doctrine. In this regard, the first words of the Introduction are significant: "Wishing in his supreme goodness and wisdom to effect the redemption of the world, 'when the fullness of time came, God sent his Son, born of a woman ... that we might receive the adoption of sons' (Gal 4:4-5)" (Lumen gentium, n. 52). This son is the Messiah awaited by the people of the Old Covenant, sent by the Father at a decisive moment of history, the "fullness of time" (Gal 4:4), which coincides with his birth in our world from a woman. She who brought the eternal Son of God to humanity can never be separated from him who is found at the centre of the divine plan carried out in history.

The primacy of Christ is shown forth in the Church, his Mystical Body: in her "the faithful are joined to Christ the Head and are in communion with all his saints" (cf. Lumen gentium, n. 52). It is Christ who draws all men to himself. Since in her maternal role she is closely united with her Son, Mary helps direct the gaze and heart of believers towards him.

She is the way that leads to Christ: indeed, she who "at the message of the angel received the Word of God in her heart and in her body" (Lumen gentium, n. 53) shows us how to receive into our lives the Son come down from heaven, teaching us to make Jesus the centre and the supreme "law" of our existence.

A unique bond between Mary and the Holy Spirit

2. Mary also helps us discover, at the origin of the whole work of salvation, the sovereign action of the Father who calls men to become sons in the one Son. Recalling the very beautiful expressions of the Letter to the Ephesians: "God, who is rich in mercy, out of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ" (Eph 2:4), the Council gives God the title "most merciful": the Son "born of a woman" is thus seen as the fruit of the Father's mercy and enables us to understand better how this Woman is the "mother of mercy".

In the same context, the Council also calls God "most wise", suggesting a particular attention to the close link between Mary and the divine wisdom, which in its mysterious plan willed the Virgin's motherhood.

3. The Council's text also reminds us of the unique bond uniting Mary with the Holy Spirit, using the words of the Nicene-Constantinopolitan Creed which we recite in the Eucharistic liturgy: "For us men and for our salvation he came down from heaven: by the power of the Holy Spirit he was born of the Virgin Mary, and became man".

In expressing the unchanging faith of the Church, the Council reminds us that the marvellous incarnation of the Son took place in the Virgin Mary's womb without man's co-operation, by the power of the Holy Spirit.

The Introduction to the eighth chapter of Lumen gentium thus shows in a Trinitarian perspective an essential dimension of Marian doctrine. Everything in fact comes from the will of the Father, who has sent his Son into the world, revealing him to men and establishing him as the Head of the Church and the centre of history. This is a plan that was fulfilled by the Incarnation, the work of the Holy Spirit, but with the essential co-operation of a woman, the Virgin Mary, who thus became an integral part in the economy of communicating the Trinity to mankind.

4. Mary's threefold relationship with the divine Persons is confirmed in precise words and with a description of the characteristic relationship which links the Mother of the Lord to the Church: "She is endowed with the high office and dignity of the Mother of the Son of God, and therefore she is also the beloved daughter of the Father and the temple of the Holy Spirit" (Lumen gentium, n. 53).

Mary's fundamental dignity is that of being "Mother of the Son", which is expressed in Christian doctrine and devotion with the title "Mother of God".

This is a surprising term, which shows the humility of God's only-begotten Son in his Incarnation and, in connection with it, the most high privilege granted a creature who was called to give him birth in the flesh.

Mother of the Son, Mary is the "beloved daughter of the Father" in a unique way. She has been granted an utterly special likeness between her motherhood and the divine fatherhood.

And again: every Christian is a "temple of the Holy Spirit", according to the Apostle Paul's expression (1 Cor 6:19). But this assertion takes on an extraordinary meaning in Mary: in her the relationship with the Holy Spirit is enriched with a spousal dimension. I recalled this in the Encyclical Redemptoris Mater: "The Holy Spirit had already come down upon her, and she became his faithful spouse at the Annunciation, welcoming the Word of the true God..." (n. 26).

Mary's dignity surpasses that of every creature

5. Mary's privileged relationship with the Trinity therefore confers on her a dignity which far surpasses that of every other creature. The Council recalls this explicitly: because of this "gift of sublime grace" Mary "far surpasses all creatures" (Lumen gentium, n. 53). However, this most high dignity does not hinder Mary's solidarity with each of us. The Constitution Lumen gentium goes on to say: "But, being of the race of Adam, she is at the same time also united to all those who are to be saved" and she has been "redeemed, in a more exalted fashion, by reason of the merits of her Son" (ibid.).

Here we see the authentic meaning of Mary's privileges and of her extraordinary relationship with the Trinity: their purpose is to enable her to co-operate in the salvation of the human race. The immeasurable greatness of the Lord's Mother therefore remains a gift of God's love for all men. By proclaiming her "blessed" (Lk 1:48), generations praise the "great things" (Lk 1:49) the Almighty has done in her for humanity, "in remembrance of his mercy" (Lk 1:54). 


Taken from:
L'Osservatore Romano
Weekly Edition in English
17 January 1996, page 11

L'Osservatore Romano is the newspaper of the Holy See.
The Weekly Edition in English is published for the US by:

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KEYWORDS: father; holyspirit; mary; relationship; son; trinity
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To: SMEDLEYBUTLER
*** If you've done such a thorough job of searching Scripture why are you not obedient? ***

I do call Mary blessed. Have done so in sermons and many FR posts.

***Quite arrogant and hypocritical of you. ***

Quite presumptuous of you to conclude that I haven't.

***You're already your own pope.***

Actually, I follow Pope Jesus.

***Thankfully, you'll never be our Pope.***

You are probably right on this one. A dispensational, 4 point calvinist, memorialist credo-baptist Pope is a major jolt. But, maybe a jolt is needed...

81 posted on 06/17/2003 3:02:59 PM PDT by drstevej
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To: drstevej
and many FR posts.

Then you'll have no problem pointing them out or directing me to the threads on which that occurred.

82 posted on 06/17/2003 3:11:15 PM PDT by SMEDLEYBUTLER
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To: SMEDLEYBUTLER
You're welcome to search for yourself. I frankly don't care whether you believe me or not.
83 posted on 06/17/2003 3:20:05 PM PDT by drstevej
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To: Hermann the Cherusker
Everyone in heaven is able to see and answer prayers from people all over the world. "So I say to you, there shall be joy before the angels of God upon one sinner doing penance." (Luke 15.10).

This is ridiculous. Mary can't goof up because when we pray to her, we are asking her to pray to God for us. If you see no value in intercessory prayer asked of those in heaven, who are always with God and see His face, then why do you ask prayers of sinners here below whenever trouble strikes?

Does this still work if Mary and the saints are in pergutory?
84 posted on 06/17/2003 3:36:25 PM PDT by Blessed
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To: SMEDLEYBUTLER
Can you name another mortal who has as intimate a relationship with the Trinity as the Blessed Virgin Mary does?

How about Moses? He actually saw God's backside and had to live seperately from his people for 30 days because God's Glory was all over him.The Bible says he heard the audible voice of God.Mary heard from Gabriel.

The point is they were both sinners saved by Grace.Jesus never claimed they weren't.
85 posted on 06/17/2003 3:44:15 PM PDT by Blessed
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To: Blessed
The point is they were both sinners saved by Grace.Jesus never claimed they weren't.

According to Catholic teaching, Mary is without sin.

86 posted on 06/17/2003 4:40:27 PM PDT by Pyro7480 (+ Vive Jesus! (Live Jesus!) +)
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To: RnMomof7; drstevej; Hermann the Cherusker
many believe that the worship of the Madonna in Catholicism had its roots in the veneration of the Goddess Diana

Please support your statement that catholics worship the Madonna. Show me ONE catholic document that corroborates your statement.

87 posted on 06/17/2003 4:51:26 PM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum)
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To: drstevej
I am awaiting you or NYer to show how the verses cites clearly teach the RC dogmatic positions.

Are you referring to Genesis 3:15 and Luke 1:28?

88 posted on 06/17/2003 5:26:24 PM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum)
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To: NYer
Yes, those and any others in the Bible.
89 posted on 06/17/2003 6:29:33 PM PDT by drstevej
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To: drstevej; Salvation; Hermann the Cherusker
Yes, those and any others in the Bible.

Do you believe that the bible is inspired? If so, what is the basis for your belief in its inspiration? What is the interpreting authority for its inspiration?

90 posted on 06/17/2003 6:53:26 PM PDT by NYer (Laudate Dominum)
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To: NYer
***Do you believe that the bible is inspired? If so, what is the basis for your belief in its inspiration?***

Havben't got time for a long discussion on this. Suffice it to say I believe the Bible is inspired as it claims.

Here is a lecture outline I prepared that responds to the issue of the Bible's reliability, trustworthiness and claims.

++++++++

The Uniqueness and Reliability of the Bible


bible00.gif

Introduction: What They Have Said about the Bible

          U.S. Presidents:

 

"It is impossible to rightly govern the world without God and the Bible." – George Washington, 1st U.S. President

 

"That Book, sir, is the rock on which our republic rests." – Andrew Jackson, 7th U.S. President

 

"I believe the Bible is the best gift God has ever given to men. All the good from the Savior of the world is communicated to us through this Book." – Abraham Lincoln, 16th U.S. President

 

"There are a good many problems before the American people today, and before me as President, but I expect to find the solution of those problems just in the proportion that I am faithful in the study of the Word of God." – Woodrow Wilson, 28th U.S. President

 

"The Bible is endorsed by the ages. Our civilization is built upon its words. In no other book is there such a collection of inspired wisdom, reality, and hope." – Dwight D. Eisenhower, 34th President

 

"Within the covers of the Bible are all the answers for all the problems men face. The Bible can touch hearts, order minds, and refresh souls." – Ronald Reagan, 40th U.S. President

          Others:

 

"I have known ninety-five of the world's great men in my time, and of these eighty-seven were followers of the Bible." – W.E. Gladstone

 

"The Bible has been the Magna Charta of the poor and the oppressed. The human race is not in a position to dispense with it." – Thomas Huxley

 

"The Bible contains a complete series of acts and of historical men to explain time and eternity, such as no other religion has to offer. If it is not the true religion, one is very excusable in being deceived; for everything in it is grand and worthy of God. The more I consider the Gospel, the more I am assured that there is nothing there which is not beyond the march of events and above the human mind. Even the impious themselves have never dared to deny the sublimity of the Gospel, which inspires them with a sort of compulsory veneration. What happiness that Book procures for those who believe it!" – Napoleon Bonaparte

 

"The New Testament is the very best Book that ever was or ever will be known in the world." – Charles Dickens

 

“"The Bible is worth all other books which have ever been printed." – Patrick Henry

 

"The existence of the Bible, as a book for the people, is the greatest benefit which the human race has ever experienced: Every attempt to belittle it is a crime against society." – Immanuel Kant

 

"It is impossible to enslave mentally or socially a Bible-reading people. The principles of the Bible are the ground-work of human freedom." – Horace Greeley

 

“What the brush is to the artist in painting a picture, what the hammer is to the carpenter in driving a nail, what water is to the laundress in washing clothes, so the Bible is to God in saving souls.” – Donald Grey Barnhouse

          The Uniqueness of the Bible

I.       Uniqueness Seen in It’s Continuity:

 

            A.        HERE IS A BOOK THAT WAS WRITTEN...

                        1.         Over a long period of time

                                           a.           About 1600 years

                                           b.           A span of 40 generations

                        2.         By approximately 40 authors from every walk of life

                                           a.           Moses, political leader trained in the universities of Egypt

                                           b.           Peter, fisherman

                                           c.           Amos, herdsman

                                           d.           Joshua, military general

                                           e.           Nehemiah, cup bearer to the king of Persia

                                           f.            Daniel, prime minister in the courts of Babylon

                                           g.           Luke, physician

                                           h.           Solomon, philosopher king

                                           i.            Matthew, tax collector

                                           j.            Paul, rabbi and tentmaker

 

                        3.         In different places

                                           a.           Moses in the wilderness

                                           b.           Jeremiah in a dungeon

                                           c.           Daniel on a hillside, and in a palace

                                           d.           Paul inside prison walls

                                           e.           Luke while traveling

                                           f.            John in exile on the isle of Patmos

                                           g.           Others in the rigors of a military campaign

                        4.         At different times

                                           a.           David in times of war

                                           b.           Solomon in times of peace

                        5.         During different moods

                                           a.           Some writing from the heights of joy

                                           b.           Others from the depths of sorrow and despair

                        6.         On three continents: Asia, Africa, Europe

                        7.         In three languages: Hebrew, Aramaic, Greek

                        8.         With subject matter involving hundreds of controversial topics, such as:

                                           a.           The origin of man and the universe

                                           b.           The nature of God

                                           c.           The nature of man, sin, and man's redemption

 

 

            B.        YET THERE IS HARMONY AND CONTINUITY...

 

                        1.         For example:

                                    a.         "The Paradise Lost of the book of Genesis becomes the Paradise Regained of Revelation."

                                    b.         "Whereas the gate to the Tree of Life is closed in Genesis, it is opened forevermore in Revelation." (Geisler and Nix)

 

 

                        2.         Compare the continuity of the Bible with any other writings of men

                                    a.         Imagine what you would have it you took just ten authors...

                                                1)        From one walk of life, one generation, one place, one time, one mood, one continent, one language

                                                 2)        Speaking on just one controversial subject b. You would have a conglomeration of conflicting ideas, not harmony!

II.     Uniqueness Seen in It’s Circulation:

 

            A.        THE TRANSLATION OF THE BIBLE...

 

                        1.         One of the first major books translated

                                           a.           E.g., the Septuagint version of the OT

                                           b.           Translated into Greek in 250 B.C.

 

uniqueandreliablefinal.gif

                        2.         By 1800 there were 66 languages with some portion of Scripture, 40 with the whole Bible.

                                    Since 1800....



 

            B.        THE CIRCULATION OF THE BIBLE...

 

                        1.         As of 1804 - 409 million copies

 

                        2.         As of 1932 - one and a third billion copies --

 

"The world's best-selling and most widely distributed book is the Bible, with an estimated 2.5 billion copies sold, 1815- 1975." - Guinness Book of World Records

 

"No other book has known the anything approaching this constant circulation" – The Cambridge History of the Bible

 

 

III.    Uniqueness Seen in It’s Survival:

 

            A.        ITS SURVIVAL THROUGH TIME...

                        1.         Though written on material that perishes...

                                           a.           ...having to be copied and recopied for hundreds of years by hand

                                           b.           ...its style, correctness, or existence did not diminish

 

                        2.         Compared with other ancient writings, the manuscript evidence of the Bible:

                                           a.           Is greater than any 10 pieces of classical literature combined!

                                           b.           Is sufficient to ensure that we are reading the words of the original

 

 

            B.        ITS SURVIVAL THROUGH PERSECUTION...

 

                        1.         Many have tried to burn it, ban it, and otherwise outlaw it

                                           a.           From the days of Roman emperors

                                           b.           To the present Communist-dominated countries

 

                        2.         Two illustrations of its survival through persecution:

                                           a.           In 303 A.D., the Roman emperor Diocletian issued an edict to stop Christians from worshiping, and to destroy their scriptures. Only 25 years later the Roman emperor Constantine called for 50 copies of the Bible to be prepared at the expense of the government!

                                           b.           Voltaire, French atheist who died in 1778, predicted that Christianity would be swept from existence and pass into history within 100 years of his time. 50 years after his death, the Geneva Bible Society used his printing press and house to produce stacks of Bibles!

 

"All flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of the grass. The grass withers, and its flower falls away, but the word of the LORD endures forever."

 

 

IV.    Uniqueness Seen in It’s Claims:

 

2 Timothy 3:16-17

16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work

 

2 Peter 1:20-21

20 Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet’s own interpretation. 21 For prophecy never had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.

 

Matthew 5:18

18 I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.


The Reliability of the Bible

 

I.      The New Testament

 

            •          Manuscripts: There are more than 24,000 partial and complete manuscript copies of the New Testament and they are available for inspection now.

 

            •          Variants: In the many thousands of manuscript copies we possess of the New Testament, scholars have discovered that there are some 150,000 "variants."Many of these variants simply involve a missing letter in a word; some involve reversing the order of two words (such as "Christ Jesus" instead of "Jesus Christ"); some may involve the absence of one or more insignificant words. Really, when all the facts are put on the table, only about 50 of the variants have any real significance - and even then, no doctrine of the Christian faith or any moral commandment is effected by them.

            •          Time Gap: The average secular work from antiquity survives on only a handful of manuscripts; the New Testament boasts thousands. The average gap between the original composition and the earliest copy is over 1,000 years for other books. The New Testament, however, has a fragment within one generation from its original composition, whole books within about 100 years from the time of the autograph [original manuscript], most of the New Testament in less than 200 years, and the entire New Testament within 250 years from the date of its completion.

            •          Early Citations: There are over 86,000 quotations of the New Testament in the early church fathers. There are also New Testament quotations in thousands of early church Lectionaries (worship books). There are enough quotations from the early church fathers that even if we did not have a single copy of the Bible, scholars could still reconstruct all but 11 verses of the entire New Testament from material written within 150 to 200 years from the time of Christ.

 

 

"If we compare the present state of the text of the New Testament with that of no matter what other ancient work, we must...declare it marvelously exact."

– B.B. Warfield

 

“The evidence for the New Testament writing is ever so much greater than for many writing of classical authors, the authenticity of which no one dreams of questioning... And if the New Testament were a collection of secular writings, their authenticity would be regarded as beyond all doubt.”

– F.F. Bruce

 

I.      The Old Testament

 

            •          The Scribe - The scribe was considered a professional person in antiquity. No printing presses existed, so people were trained to copy documents. The task was usually undertaken by a devout Jew. The Scribes believed they were dealing with the very Word of God and were therefore extremely careful in copying. They did not just hastily write things down. Samuel Davidson describes some of the disciplines of the Talmudists (scribes) in regard to the Scriptures.

“A synagogue roll must be written on the skins of clean animals, prepared for the particular use of the synagogue by a Jew. These must be fastened together with strings taken from clean animals. Every skin must contain a certain number of columns, equal throughout the entire codex. The length of each column must not extend over less than 48 or more than 60 lines; and the breadth must consist of thirty letters. The whole copy must be first-lined; and if three words be written without a line, it is worthless. The ink should be black, neither red, green, nor any other color, and be prepared according to a definite recipe. An authentic copy must be the examplar, from which the transcriber ought not in the least deviate. No word or letter, not even a yod, must be written from memory, the scribe not having looked at the codex before him …… Between every consonant the space of a hair or thread must intervene; between every new parashah, or section, the breadth of nine consonants; between every book, three lines. The fifth book of Moses must terminate exactly with a line; but the rest need not do so. Besides this, the copyist must sit in full Jewish dress, wash his whole body, not begin to write the name of God with a pen newly dipped in ink, and should a king address him while writing that name he must take no notice of him."

 

Davidson adds that "The rolls in which these regulations are not observed are condemned to be buried in the ground or burned; or they are banished to the schools, to be used as reading books."

 

            •          The Massoretic Text - During the early part of the tenth century (916 A.D.), there was a group of Jews scribes called the Massoretes who were also meticulous in their copying. The texts they had were all in capital letters, and there was no punctuation or paragraphs. The Massoretes would copy Isaiah, for example, and when they were through, they would total up the number of letters. Then they would find the middle letter of the book. If it was not the same, they made a new copy. All of the present copies of the Hebrew text which come from this period are in remarkable agreement.

 

            •          The Dead Sea Scrolls & Isaiah Scroll - In 1947, a young Bedouin goat herdsman found some strange clay jars in caves near the valley of the Dead Sea. Inside the jars were some leather scrolls. The scrolls have revealed that a commune of monastic farmers flourished in the valley from 150 B.C. to 70 A.D. It is believed that when they saw the Romans invade the land they put their cherished leather scrolls in the jars and hid them in the caves on the cliffs northwest of the Dead Sea.

The Dead Sea Scrolls include a complete copy of the Book of Isaiah, a fragmented copy of Isaiah, containing much of Isaiah 38-6, and fragments of almost every book in the Old Testament. These materials are dated around 100 B.C. Interest in it was especially keen since it antedates by more than a thousand years the oldest Hebrew texts preserved in the Massoretic tradition.”

 

A comparison of the Qumran manuscript of Isaiah with the Massoretic text revealed them to be extremely close in accuracy to each other: A comparison of Isaiah 53 shows that only 17 letters differ from the Massoretic text. Ten of these are mere differences in spelling (like our "honor" and the English "honour") and produce no change in the meaning at all. Four more are very minor differences, such as the presence of a conjunction (and) which are stylistic rather than substantive. The other three letters are the Hebrew word for "light." This word was added to the text by someone after "they shall see" in verse 11. Out of 166 words in this chapter, only this one word is really in question, and it does not at all change the meaning of the passage. We are told by biblical scholars that this is typical of the whole manuscript of Isaiah."

 

 

Conclusion: The “Diary of a Bible”

             Jan. 15 --          Been resting for a week. A few nights after the first of the year my owner opened me, but no more. Another New Year's resolution gone wrong.

             Feb. 3 --           Owner picked me up and rushed off to Sunday school.

             Feb. 23 --          Cleaning day, dusted and put back in my place.

             April 2 --           Busy day. Owner had to present the lesson at a church society meeting. Quickly looked up a lot of references.

             May 5 --           In Grandma's lap again, a comfortable place.

             May 9 --           She let a tear fall on John 14:1-3.

             May 10 --          Grandma's gone. Back in my old place.

             May 20 --          Baby born. They wrote his name on one of my pages.

             July 1 --            Packed in a suitcase -- off for a vacation.

             July 20 --          Still in the suitcase. Almost everything else taken out.

             July 25 --          Home again. Quite a journey, though I don't see why I went.

             Aug. 16 --         Cleaned again and put in a prominent place; the minister is to be here for dinner.

             Aug. 20 --         Owner wrote Grandma's death in my family record. He left his extra pair of glasses between my pages.

             Dec. 31 --          Owner just found his glasses. Wonder if he will make any resolutions about me for the new year.

 

“Sin will keep you from this Book - or - this Book will keep you from sin” – D.L. Moody

91 posted on 06/17/2003 7:09:47 PM PDT by drstevej
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To: NYer
Sorry the HTML didn't handle the formatting well at all. I could email you a pdf if interested. I prepared this for our International Sunday School class.
92 posted on 06/17/2003 7:11:24 PM PDT by drstevej
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To: Blessed
Does this still work if Mary and the saints are in pergutory?

The Holy Souls in Purgatory can also pray for you, as we can pray for them, as they are also members of the Mystical Body of Christ.

However, Blessed Mary and the company of Saints and Martyrs are in heaven. This is certain because it is the very meaning of the term, saint.

93 posted on 06/17/2003 7:11:25 PM PDT by Hermann the Cherusker
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To: Hermann the Cherusker
***This is certain because it is the very meaning of the term, saint.***

Adopt the biblical definition of "saint" and you eliminate purgatory.
94 posted on 06/17/2003 7:13:13 PM PDT by drstevej
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To: DManA
You don't talk badly about your mother, do you?

So why would you want to talk badly about the Mother of Jesus, Second Person of the most holy Trinity?
95 posted on 06/17/2003 7:23:36 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: drstevej
Adopt the biblical definition of "saint" and you eliminate purgatory.

Careful there, Steve. If we start adopting Biblical definitions, we may have to eliminate some entire denominations!

96 posted on 06/17/2003 7:26:11 PM PDT by wai-ming
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To: wai-ming
Oh so true.
97 posted on 06/17/2003 7:27:54 PM PDT by drstevej
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To: wai-ming
Oh so true.
98 posted on 06/17/2003 7:28:00 PM PDT by drstevej
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To: NYer
**Now if I catch you making this mistake again, you will be asked to write that sentence on the blackboard, 100 times.**

LOL!
99 posted on 06/17/2003 7:28:03 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: DIGSongs
Perhaps you should consider Jesus' response in Luke 11:27-28 to the woman from the crowd who said: "Blessed is the mother who gave you birth and nursed you." He replied, "On the contrary, blessed are those who hear the Word of God and obey it."

Seems to me that Jesus had the perfect opportunity here to confirm the subsequent Catholic myth of the "blessedness" of Mary. Instead, He directly contradicts that view.

Please!

"Blessed is she who has believed, because the things promised her by the Lord shall be accomplished." (Luke 1.45)

As St. Elizabeth said there, Mary is Most Blessed because she perfectly conformed her life to the Will of God for her and never sinned. That is the import of Luke 11.27-28 too. Jesus explicitly says Mary is blessed not for giving birth to Christ, as exalted a task as that was, but because she heard the Word of God and obeyed it.

As an aside, in the Tridentine Missal, Catholics use Luke 11.27-28 as the Gospel at the Mass "Salve Sancta Parens", the first Common Mass of the Blessed Virgin Mary on Satuday. It is also the end of the Gospel for the Third Sunday in Lent. You seem to think we would not be familiar with it though? Perhaps you don't understand that we have a lot more reading of the Bible at our Masses than you do at your prayer services.

100 posted on 06/17/2003 7:28:44 PM PDT by Hermann the Cherusker
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