Posted on 01/16/2015 8:03:35 AM PST by Salvation
It was not NELSON111 that read your mind. Look back at his post. It is all in quotations. Here is the passage he is quoting:
Matthew 15:7-9 (NKJV)
7 “Hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy about you, saying:
8 These people draw near to Me with their mouth,
And honor Me with their lips,
But their heart is far from Me.
9 And in vain they worship Me,
Teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.
The person speaking here is Christ. He is replying to the scribes and Pharisees who came from Jerusalem to confront Him over what they saw as not following their leadership.
Christ quoted from Isaiah, which is why there are double quotes. Christ pointed out how the religious leaders commanded things contrary to the scriptures and did not follow the scriptures themselves. The similarity between the error of the religious leaders of Christ’s day (earthly ministry) and the error of the Catholic assertion of being the authority over Biblical things has been pointed out for centuries.
That you were offended that this was directed at you and Catholics is telling. You need to rethink your feelings of being offended, because you should not be offended at the One Who spoke these words.
Are you not therefore mistaken, because you do not know the Scriptures nor the power of God?” (Mark 12:24)
Do you know what “sola scriptura “means?
I was raised as a Catholic; both in school and at home, I was taught in a similar way. I was taught respect, not just for other nationalities, but for others' religion, as we referred to it back then. We had kids in our class who weren't Catholic; they were never forced to attend Mass, nor sit during our religion class- they got to go to the library and spend that time. The rest of the time, we all played and learned together.
When I was growing up, a word you heard on TV and a lot in school was, "brotherhood"-anybody remember that? And insulting somebody because of their religion was like insulting their mother: maybe that's why I didn't get my feathers ruffled over what Pope Francis said, I understood. If a kid on the street really wanted to provoke you, the first thing they'd do was insult your mother. You knew they had crossed the line and meant business, and that they were hitting below the belt.
I, too, thought all who believed in Jesus were Christian. And, I was taught to respect the fact that others believed, at least somewhat differently, than we did. Back then, we had Catholics, Protestants, and Jews. We were taught that the Jews were God's chosen people- He set them aside- my mother read to me out of the Bible at night. The people we knew were Italian, Irish, Polish, Spanish (from Spain), Lebanese, Armenian, and African-American (although the accepted words back then were "Colored", or "Negro"- saying the "N-word" in my house was the equivalent of saying the "F-word"- it just was NOT DONE!).
In short, respect for people's similarities. tolerance wasn't some kind of chore. You got along and you were respectful of one another's differences. When racial violence broke out in the 60's I was sat down by my parents and reminded that there were good and bad in all groups of people, and that it was wrong to judge all based on a few. Liberal-Progressive? NO! CHRISTIAN! Every nationality knew what it was like to be discriminated against, in the old country as well as in this one. Eventually, those ironed themselves out and people got along and respected one another. That is how I was raised.
Your post was well-said, and the quote is worth repeating:
I believe that we, as followers of Jesus, should seek what unites us in our believe and gift of salvation and NOT the differences we have.
AMEN! God bless you!
There are real problems when a verse is taken out of its context, Al
We need always to consider to whom it was written and the circumstances it was addressing
The book of James was written to a converted church , not heathens seeking salvation . It tells them how their conversion is seen by the unsaved world . It is not about becoming saved or being saved. It is about the fruit of your salvation.
It is not saying we need works to be saved..but that our works ARE EVIDENCE of our salvation . If you have no works flowing from your salvation.. then you have a dead (false salvation)
Jam 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.
Jam 2:18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.
This is an amplification of the teaching of Jesus that we know a tree by the fruit it bears. It is how we know the saved from the unsaved. It does not declare that the man has faith ...but that he SAYS he has faith.
This addresses a hollow profession of faith , not a saving one .Can a hollow profession save him? NO, any more than works can save.This scripture says to the church that this faith is non existent , it is dead.
The bible is clear that it is God that gives the faith and it is God that ordains the works of the saved
Eph 2:10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.
Hbr 13:21 Make you perfect in every good work to do his will, working in you that which is wellpleasing in his sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom [be] glory for ever and ever. Amen.
Phl 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of [his] good pleasure.
Augustine: "Now, having duly considered and weighed all these circumstances and testimonies, we conclude that a man is not justified by the precepts of a holy life, but by faith in Jesus Christ,--in a word, not by the law of works, but by the law of faith; not by the letter, but by the spirit; not by the merits of deeds, but by free grace."
Matthew 22
37 - Jesus said to him: Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with thy whole heart, and with thy whole soul, and with thy whole mind.
38 - This is the greatest and the first commandment.
39 - And the second is like to this: Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself.
40 - On these two commandments dependeth the whole law and the prophets.
: )
thank you. It sounds like we bother grew up in the late 50s & early 60s.
Please give me the definition that you use for it.
When I was taught my Catechism back in the day, it began with "Who is God" and then, "Why did God create us?" The latter question is answered, "God created us to know, love, and serve Him in this world, so we may be happy with Him in the next." To a Catholic, we come to know Him by Scripture, prayer, Mass, the Sacraments, and learning the Sacred tradition according to the Magisterium, the teaching authority of the Church. We love Him naturally, (my soul is thirsting for the Living God) and this relationship grows as we learn how to love others and follow God's Commandments. As we mature, this love, the desire to serve God translates into a deeper prayer, self-sacrifice offered for Him directly, or by helping others and living out our state in life. This love of God and neighbor is the beginning of service.
I agree that, as you said, "the two are linked." I don't understand how the two can be separated.
Salvation: No, it was his statement You hypocrites.
That was not the posters statement, it was a statement made by Jesus. You will have to debate with Him about that.
Here's the scripture again, a quote from the Bible:
"You hypocrites! Well did Isaiah prophesy of you, when he said: "'This people honors me with their lips, but their heart is far from me; in vain do they worship me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.'" Matthew 15:7-9Salvation: How can he judge? How can he mind read?
It's good to keep in mind that when someone posts a thread (such as you did in this instance), even though in the "to" field it will say "Salvation" (that's you in this case) but usually it is in reaction to and addressed to the article, not the poster of the article.
Bear in mind also that many Christians see quite a few similarities between Catholicism and the religious actions of the Pharisees. Such as "teaching as doctrines the commandments of men." Falsely teaching the sinlessness of Mary, praying to Mary (making her the mediator between man and God which is a role only Jesus fills,) the statement that everyone needs to be subject to the pope, and many other examples are out there, including a lot of things that the Catholic pope says and does (such as worshipping the same "God" that Islam worships)
Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for you are like unto whitewashed sepulchers, which indeed appear beautiful outwardly but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.---Matthew 23:27So I will ask you the question you asked:
How can you judge? How can you mindread?
Its the mistaken truncation of the Gospel.
IOW, its “Another Gospel.”
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Believing itself is obedience, but which God enables and motivates to His glory, and which God sees and grants cleansing and regeneration, as evidenced by the regeneration of the Gentiles by faith, before baptism in Acts10. But confession in various forms and holiness before others (and in principal if alone) are works which justify one as being a believer.
To get around this and require magical RC baptism, in which the act itself instrumentally effects regeneration, a RC may argue that receiving the Holy Spirit is not the same as being cleansed from sin, for which baptism is necessary.
Yet the Holy Spirit is never received prior to cleansing and Peter distinctly told Cornelius and co. that whosoever believes on the Lord Jesus shall receive remission of sins, (Acts 10:43) and states that the Gentiles were to believe the gospel and that God purified their hearts by faith. (Acts 11:7-9) Which was not an inert faith one which was confessed in baptism. Of course, i have seen other RC private interpretation that contended Cornelius and co. were not born again until being baptized!
A rather comprehensive examination of this issue of Paul vs, James is seen here by R. Bruce Compton in the Detroit Baptist Seminary Journal.
Sola scriptura means the primary and absolute source for all doctrine and practice (faith and morals).. Sola Scriptura does not negate past church councils or traditions,commentaries and the teachings of others ..but the final arbitrager of all moral or faith issues are decided by the scriptures..
My goodness!
Is your knowledge of Jesus own words that lacking?
The phrase “You hypocrites!” is part of the passage quoted!
Overly sensitive much?
But it does contain everything needed for us to come to Christ and grow in His kingdom. Everything necessary to the Christian walk can be found in Scripture.
Salvation comes at the beginning with the acceptance of Christ. Works flow from the Spirit working within the saved Christian. On our own we can do nothing.
No.
Nobody has been saved yet.
There is one and only one time of salvation: The Last Trump.
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>>We need always to consider to whom it was written and the circumstances it was addressing<<
Indeed. If one wants to view an epistle of a church where there was confusion on the Gospel message then look to the “foolish Galatians.”
I was going crazy trying to find the specific terms: my memory for words and numbers is not what it used to be. This is my best, and since you've been so kind and polite, I don't mind telling you! : )
At Baptism we receive Sanctifying Grace which removes the original sin from our souls. The Sacraments help maintain and/or restore Actual Grace which helps us in our daily lives, moment by moment, according to our state in life.
At Confession, not only are the sins forgiven, but with the help of God's grace, we get strengthened in our resolve to conquer or faults and failings.
Attending Mass and the unimaginable grace in the Sacrament of Holy Communion gives us graces we cannot conceive of in this life...
To be continued... Thank you again, and God bless you!
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