Posted on 04/27/2009 9:00:48 AM PDT by Colofornian
Early suckerology: 'The Science of Anti-Mormon Suckerology: Parley P. Pratt and Early Mormon Apologetics' Isn't that the coolest title ever? Parley P. Pratt wrote this rhetorical article in 1845 and defined various Mormon terms. I tried to find out what "suckerology" meant. Nothing. But nonetheless it's a fascinating post that gives a window at early Mormon apologetics and, as Christopher explains, "Perhaps more significantly for interested researchers, it speaks to early Mormon understandings of their place in America as true patriots and sincere religionists. It also probably deserves a closer reading through the lens of gender, race, and ethnicity." Wow!
(Excerpt) Read more at mormontimes.com ...
And now we have another mainstreamer implying insanity because a person is of a different religion.
Wow. Shouldn’t you go on back to the democrat underground?
Cop out.
Sending someone out on a wild goose chase to look up information that you think exists does nothing to back up your assertion.
You make a statement, it’s your responsibility to back it up or we can rightly discount it as the fluff that it is.
Didn't the supposed (I'd say fictional) characters within the Book of Mormon eventually wipe each other all out with millions dying because of these kind of family & tribal battles? And so what led to the eventual demise of them all is what you're advocating?
If you think *they* are after you, there’s help for that.
If you think that it’s because of your religion, that also qualifies. You’re the one bringing religion into it. I never mentioned it.
So, Mormonism does advocate violence.
Thanks for that little tidbit.
Why? That is not the way the lamestreamers do it. They keep making the same old claims that have been debunked here time after time.
In other words, same story, different chapter.
Your posts appear to be more of the same old garbage.
Obviously, you have intentionally misread the scripture I posted.
Misreading clearly written scriptures is an indication of a closed mind or an unintelligent one.
It really isn't surprising at all though. I have long noticed that those who complain about being surrounded by irritable people are the ones who are the most irritating.
Go figure, those who wander around in life with a chip on their shoulder and daring everyone to knock it off, get just what they ask for.
Leave the thread.
LOL. I love it when you cite liberals who dislike the LDS church, it just makes us look better.
BTW, perhaps you shold read what he writes about how the Christian right is akin to Muslim terrorists before you post his crap here on FR again.
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Under the Banner of Heaven. This book occassionaly rears its head here on FR as some sort of authority on Mormonism.
In her book “Godless: The Church of Liberalism” Pages 16-17 Ann Coulter writes “In the book Under the Banner of Heaven: A Story of Violent Faith, Jon Krakauer wrotes of the Bush administration, “This, after all, is a country led by a born-again Christian.... who characterizes international relations as a biblical clash between forces of good and evil. The highest officer in the land, Attorney General John Ashcroft, is a dyed-in-the-wool follower of a fundamentalist Christian sect- The Pentecostal Assemblies of God of America... and subscribes to a vividly apocalyptic worldview that has much in common with key millenarian beliefs held by the Lafferty brothers and the residents of Colorado City”.
Here are more of Krakauer the agnostics own words bashing religion.
“I don’t know what God is, or what God had in mind when the universe was set in motion. In fact I don’t know if God even exists, although I confess that I sometimes find myself praying in times of great fear, or despair, or astonishment at a display of unexpected beauty.”
“Faith is the very antithesis of reason...,”
“There is a dark side to religious devotion that is too often ignored or denied,” he posits in the prologue. “As a means of motivating people to be cruel and inhumane—as a means of motivating people to be evil, to borrow the vocabulary of the devout—there may in fact be nothing more effective than religion.” Referring to the “Islamic fundamentalism” that resulted in the killings of 11 September 2001, he goes on to say that “men have been committing heinous acts in the name of God ever since mankind began believing in deities, and extremists exist within all religions.” He finds that “history has not lacked” for Muslims, “Christians, Jews, Sikhs, and even Buddhists who have been motivated by scripture to butcher innocents. Faith-based violence was present long before Osama bin Laden, and it will be with us long after his demise”
Soon after 9/11 liberals started blaming fundamentalist religion (except the Muslim variety) and then bit by bit mainstream Christians for 9/11 type terrorism. The message the MSM promoted was a hit on Christians. This book fits into that larger political context of what is going on post 9/11. it ries to take the actions of two murderers and paint an entire faith with terrorism. Here is the official response from the LDS Church to the book. Church Response to Jon Krakauer's Under the Banner of Heaven
“There is a dark side to religious devotion that is too often ignored or denied,” he posits in the prologue. “As a means of motivating people to be cruel and inhumane—as a means of motivating people to be evil, to borrow the vocabulary of the devout—there may in fact be nothing more effective than religion.” Referring to the “Islamic fundamentalism” that resulted in the killings of 11 September 2001, he goes on to say that “men have been committing heinous acts in the name of God ever since mankind began believing in deities, and extremists exist within all religions.” He finds that “history has not lacked” for Muslims, “Christians, Jews, Sikhs, and even Buddhists who have been motivated by scripture to butcher innocents. Faith-based violence was present long before Osama bin Laden, and it will be with us long after his demise”
We both know that Islam, Hinduism, Tibetan Buddhism, & even forms of Christianity has been misused or used to formulate violence. Even Jim Jones used a false presentation of Christianity to lead to mass self-violence in Jonestown. Same with Koresh in Waco.
Religion in general is NOT sacro-sanct to God. Jesus said the "religion" of Pharisaicalism was used to traverse land & sea to make proselytized converts "twice the son of hell." [That doesn't sound like Jesus sanctioned all religions under the sun -- even offshoots of His people].
...I confess that I sometimes find myself praying in times of great fear, or despair, or astonishment at a display of unexpected beauty.”
You know, over the years, LDS FREEPERS have cited probably hundreds of journalists -- journalists who no doubt do a lot less praying that what Krakauer professes above...Yet I don't think we've seen you come forth to lecture them, have you?
So a journalist -- unless he's a religious journalist -- can never be accurate about any story he/she writes?
Krakauer quote: “Faith is the very antithesis of reason...,”
Of course you & I would disagree this statement. While faith doesn't militate against reason, even the Bible outlines distinctions between faith and reason: Heb. 11:1: Now faith is being sure of what we hope for and certain of what we do not see. Or, My message and my preaching were not with wise and persuasive words, but with a demonstration of the Spirit's power, so that your faith might not rest on men's wisdom, but on God's power. (1 Cor. 2:4-5)
BTTT
Mormon understandings of their place in America as true patriots and sincere religionists.
Who cares about the *sincere religionists* label?
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Yeppers
those guys who flew the planes into the Twin Towers were *sincere religionists*
True patriots? Depends on who you ask.
Let’s ask someone who went through the temple in SLC for his “endowments” for the “Melchisedec priesthood” in 1854..
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“Man and woman, we were ranged around the place; Kimball in the same, and Brigham in the next room looking on; Parley Pratt officiating, and the fourth oath was administered. The allegory presumed that man, now in a fair and certain way to salvation, had a great temporal duty to perform, not an “abstract theory” of obedience, nor obedience in “abstract things”, but a great positive, present, immediate duty.
We were, therefore, SWORN TO CHERISH CONSTANT ENMITY AGAINST THE UNITED STATES GOVERNMENT for not avenging the death of Smith, or righting the persecutions of the Saints; TO DO ALL WE COULD TOWARD DESTROYING, TEARING DOWN, OR OVERTURNING THAT GOVERNMENT; to endeavor to baffle its designs and frustrate its intentions; to renounce all allegiance and refuse all submission.
If unable to do any thing ourselves toward the accomplishment of these objects, to teach it to our children from the nursery; impress it upon them from the death-bed; entail it upon them as a legacy. To make it the one leading idea and sacred duty of their lives; so that “the kingdom of God and his Christ” (the Mormon Church and its priesthood) “might subdue all other kingdoms and fill the whole earth.”
Curses the most frightful, penalties the most barbarous, were threatened and combined in the obligation either on failing to abide or in daring to reveal these covenants. A new sign, a new key-word, a new grip, and the second degree of Melchisedec priesthood was administered.”
(John Hyde, Mormonism: its leaders and designs 1857 P 97-98)
I call 'em deceived and misled by either two demons or a GREAT storyteller.
Sigh...
Once again:
You KNOW that we do NOT need these things to 'backup' our assertions!
OUR religion is FOUNDED on such things and - by GOD - we ain't gonna change NOW!!
--MormonDupe(BOY! you ANTI's get my DANDER up!)
Oh?
The only 'claim' that is NOT backed up is Joseph Smith's claim of having LEARNED that PRESBYTERIANism was UNTRUE in his time.
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