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United States v Roy Moore: The Most Important States' Rights Case in Decades
PatriotPetitions.US/Federalist.com ^ | 8-15-03

Posted on 08/15/2003 4:06:45 PM PDT by cpforlife.org

An Open Letter in Support of Alabama Chief Justice Roy Moore's Defense of the Most Important Religious Liberty and States' Rights Test Case in Decades

(Please forward this important message to friends, family members, and fellow American Patriots)

A monument of the Ten Commandments placed in the rotunda of Alabama's Supreme Court building by Chief Justice Roy Moore, is the front line of the war over the First, Ninth and Tenth Amendment restrictions on the central government by our Constitution's Bill of Rights. Ordered by a federal court to remove the monument by August 20, Justice Moore has been warned by U.S. District and Appellate Courts that his states' rights argument will not be tolerated.

Judge Moore, of course, is rightly defending the original intent of the Founders, who drafted and approved the Bill of Rights, against erroneous interpretation by an activist Leftjudiciary, even as he prepares his appeal to the U.S. Supreme Court. This case is a major test case for states' rights and the so-called church-state "separation clause," and ultimately will determine the fundamental nature of government and the Constitution. To assess the importance of this case, consider this evaluation from 11th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals Judge Ed Carnes, who ruled against Chief Justice Moore: "If Alabama Chief Justice Roy Moore's Ten Commandments monument were allowed to stand, it would mean a massive revision of how the courts have interpreted the First Amendment for years." Indeed, it would.

Join fellow Patriots signing this Open Letter in support of Justice Moore, First Amendment rights, limited government and the sovereignty of the several states as guaranteed by our Constitution.

Link to -- http://patriotpetitions.us/openletter

If you don't have Web access, please send a blank e-mail to: Each e-mail sent to this address will be counted as one signature for the petition.

(Circulation of this petition is being sponsored by The Federalist, the most widely read conservative e-journal on the Internet. If you have not already joined the ranks of Patriots receiving The Federalist, we encourage you to do so. This highly acclaimed conservative digest of news, policy and opinion will be delivered FREE by e-mail to your inbox each week. Simply link to --http://www.federalist.com/subscribe/patriots.asp If you don't have Web access, send a blank e-mail to and you will be subscribed automatically.)

Founder's Quote:

"The States supposed that by their tenth amendment, they had secured themselves against constructive powers." --Thomas Jefferson


TOPICS: Announcements; Business/Economy; Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: conservatism; constitution; roymoore; statesrights; tencommandments
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To: bereanway
That's true, but this Republic is only a couple hundred years old. I'm a lot more comfortable with a rule that keeps all religion out of the courtroom than one which allows the current favorite in.
81 posted on 08/15/2003 7:29:39 PM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: cake_crumb
Regardless of how we conjecture WHY someone - particularly a dead someone who cannot correct us if our conjecture is wrong - made a statement which was recorded, they still said it. On the record. For prosperity.

Copying and pasting quotes is as great a thing as the Internet. After we look up the relavant recorded quotes, we copy and paste them so as not to get the quote wrong.

Sure, they said it. But at this point we're often times left with a lot of Monday-morning quarterbacking about what the person may have really meant. In relation to even the last 100 years, we unfortunately have precious little info about most of the Founding Fathers & what they really thought.

Cutting & pasting quotes left & right does little to educate and often times mis-educates because they are often taken so badly out of context & it paints a woefully inadequate picture.

It also doesn't allow for evidence that a person may have later changed their mind or evidence that politicians then -- just like now -- say one thing & do another.

I mean, if recordkeeping, etc in 2003 was the same as it was 200+ years ago, people in the year 2203 might be left with the impression that Arnold Schwarzenegger was a conservative

82 posted on 08/15/2003 7:30:53 PM PDT by gdani
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To: bereanway
"The Quran doesn't have a lot to do with western thought in general and American history in particular. "

That's all well and good, but consider what the consequences are if the supreme court sides with Moore. Do you honestly believe that the judgement by the current court will limit future "expressions of judges" to "icons of western thought and american history?"

Of course not.

83 posted on 08/15/2003 7:31:49 PM PDT by Lurkd Long Enough (Proudly lurking since 1999)
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To: gdani
(shrug)

If people in CA want to dope themselves silly, I sure won't stand in their way. No better way to thin the herd of the stupid than to let them do it themselves. Put a cap on what kind of medical care they can receive if pot or other drugs are in their system, so we clean ones don't get saddled with their medical bills. Treat the substances as alcohol when dealing with liability. Get in an accident and you're on dope? It's *your fault*, regardless of the circumstances.

I think they should nix seatbelt and motorcycle helmet laws too, for the same reason (if people want to cull themselves from the herd, let them). Legislate mandatory limited tort for injury cases where seatbelts or helmets weren't in use and cap medical care if necessary, but by God, people should be made to be responsible for *their own* actions.

What sickens me is if someone's kid wants to say The Lord's Prayer in school, well, then, it's off to war the Libs go. I call that H-Y-P-O-C-R-I-S-Y.
84 posted on 08/15/2003 7:32:58 PM PDT by Windcatcher
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To: gdani
"Sure, they said it. But at this point we're often times left with a lot of Monday-morning quarterbacking about what the person may have really meant. "

Agreed...but Monday morning quarterbacking does not change the wording of the quote. If taken literally, as worded, and not subject to interpretation, the wording of the quote must stand, as is, on it's own.

Mondy morning quarterbacking of the Constitution has given us people who BELIEVE that the Constitution is an evolving document.

No one's going to believe Arnie's a conservative as long as that quote about being ashamed of being Republican during the impeachment trial goes down in history.

85 posted on 08/15/2003 7:36:51 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions = Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: Dog Gone
Believe me, if the Islamicists get to the point where they're erecting Quran memorials in federal and state facilities neither you nor I will be very comfortable at all (nor will we be having this discussion).
86 posted on 08/15/2003 7:38:05 PM PDT by bereanway
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To: Windcatcher
If people in CA want to dope themselves silly, I sure won't stand in their way....

Well, that answers the question about drugs. How about gay marriage (if/when a state law gets passed) and assisted suicide? Again, those are both states' rights issues.

Maybe you are completely consistent across the board on states' rights. (I'll admit that I'm not & I think it makes me the same as about 99% of other people, whether they know it or not).

87 posted on 08/15/2003 7:38:46 PM PDT by gdani
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To: Nate9k9; cpforlife.org
The issue is about constitutional rights and states rights. Does the federal government, in this case federal courts, have the authority to over ride the constitution of a state.

The USSC's ~job~ is to decide on [interpret] the constitutionality of laws, whichever level [fed/state/local] of government makes them.

Judge Moore says no. I say no. It will be a very sad thing if the Supreme Court again disregards their mandate, the interp of the constitution, and rules on how they think things should be.

You agree that the supreme court can intrepret our U.S. Constitution law, but cannot judge upon those of the states?
Not so. States are bound to our supreme 'Law of the Land'. [see Art. VI.]

It will be time to look for a different place to live.

If states are allowed to violate our constitution, there would soon be no good place to go.

88 posted on 08/15/2003 7:42:14 PM PDT by tpaine ( I'm trying to be Mr Nice Guy, but politics keep getting in me way. ArnieRino for Governator!)
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To: bereanway
It doesn't even have to be Islamicists. There is plenty of room in this country for the free expression of whatever religion anyone espouses. I just think that the government should shy away from it.

In fact, I think the Constitution demands that.

89 posted on 08/15/2003 7:43:30 PM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: Lurkd Long Enough
What IS Moores's defense, if not on historical grounds? I've only read SOME of these cases. (obviously not the findings on this one) The successful ones were won on historical grounds.

All these suits are hard to keep up with.

90 posted on 08/15/2003 7:48:45 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions = Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: Dog Gone
"It doesn't even have to be Islamicists. There is plenty of room in this country for the free expression of whatever religion anyone espouses. I just think that the government should shy away from it"

Yeah...there's one in Ohio where some teenager and the ACLU are suing for the right to put up a giant statue of a penis because the kid says he's started his own penis worshipping religion. Even though he's the only member of it, he says it's his right to erect his statue alongside the Ten Commandments.

This stuff is why I opt for the historical/cultural argument whenever possible.

91 posted on 08/15/2003 7:55:38 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions = Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: cake_crumb
Yeah...there's one in Ohio where some teenager and the ACLU are suing for the right to put up a giant statue of a penis because the kid says he's started his own penis worshipping religion. Even though he's the only member of it, he says it's his right to erect his statue alongside the Ten Commandments.

Actually, the suit in Ohio involves one guy in his 60s or 70s & the suit is to remove the Ten Commandments monuments totally, not to display his on the same grounds. A suit he filed after the school rejected his penis monument. (I have a feeling it was more to make a point instead of him being an actual....uh....penis-worshipper).

92 posted on 08/15/2003 7:59:43 PM PDT by gdani
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To: gdani
I have no doubt that certain states would make gay marriage and assisted suicide legal. As long as I'm free to pick up and move, I don't have a problem with it. I know it sounds trite; it's indeed hard to pick up, change jobs, sell the house, etc., but if it's really important to you (or me) to bring kids up in a moral environment then I guess we have to act on our moral standards.

If I had kids and PA legalized gay marriage, I'd immediately start looking at jobs in NC, SC, AL, MS, etc. Personally I'm favoring SC. By the same token, however, I think states should be completely free to do whatever they wish vis-a-vis abortion. I have no doubt states like NJ would allow it, just as I have no doubt states like SC would like to outlaw it. I think the end situation would be that we conservatives would congregate in the South, and we'd prosper, too (being of stronger moral fiber and more productive).
93 posted on 08/15/2003 8:00:00 PM PDT by Windcatcher
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To: cpforlife.org
Signed.
94 posted on 08/15/2003 8:01:49 PM PDT by Victoria Delsoul (It's a campaign about 'change'…the most plausible mass-appeal 'change' candidate: Arnold *Mark Steyn)
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To: gdani
"(I have a feeling it was more to make a point instead of him being an actual....uh....penis-worshipper)."

LOL...I sort of got that impression too, but you never know about people. The point of demanding he be allowed to erect his statue beside it was to have the Ten Commandments taken down. He found them offensive and didn't care what others thought. He therefore found an effective counter offense. (no puns intended)

Devious. Effective. Almost brilliant in a sophmoric way. That must be why I keep thinking it was a teenager.

95 posted on 08/15/2003 8:06:01 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions = Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: Windcatcher
I have no doubt that certain states would make gay marriage and assisted suicide legal. As long as I'm free to pick up and move, I don't have a problem with it.

Your views re: states' rights are the rare exception among many, including Freepers. (I don't mean that in a bad way, just an observation).

Which is why I tend to bring up the medicinal marijuana, etc examples whenever some people start talking about states' rights. Jim Crow laws are also a good example of throwing a firecracker into a discussion about states' rights.

96 posted on 08/15/2003 8:08:41 PM PDT by gdani
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To: cake_crumb
Devious. Effective. Almost brilliant in a sophmoric way. That must be why I keep thinking it was a teenager.

Teenagers are a pain-in-the-ass but in a much different way. Their methods of being a pain-in-the-ass tend to not be so well thought out.

97 posted on 08/15/2003 8:10:26 PM PDT by gdani
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To: gdani
Ah, but the firecrackers are what makes things interesting.
98 posted on 08/15/2003 8:10:42 PM PDT by Lurkd Long Enough (Proudly lurking since 1999)
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To: gdani
"Teenagers are a pain-in-the-ass but in a much different way. Their methods of being a pain-in-the-ass tend to not be so well thought out"

You'd be surprised at how devious and well thought out the plans of teenagers can be. Sometimes, their plans are even successful.

99 posted on 08/15/2003 8:16:03 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions = Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: gdani
I thought Vermont already passed a law recognizing same sex civil unsions. Not legal marriage, per se, but civil unions giving almost the same benefits as marriage.

Which made me wonder why you kept asking that same question.
100 posted on 08/15/2003 8:22:46 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions = Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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