No, The Primary System Is Not Rigged

American Thinker ^ | 04/26/2016 | George W. Ford

[SeekAndFind]

For the past month, a media narrative has taken hold that something must be done to reform, simplify, streamline, and democratize the delegate selection system of the Republican presidential nomination process.

Is our GOP presidential primary system rigged, meaning it is corrupt because it favors the establishment? Is it convoluted, arbitrary, arcane...and too often "voteless"? Is it wrong to allow "Trojan horse" delegates to change their vote on the second ballot of the national convention? Why do we have a separate election for delegates after we vote for candidates?

The system is not rigged, convoluted, arbitrary, arcane, or voteless. It is a system that encourages the grassroots to participate in party platform issues, the selection of candidates, the choosing of a candidate winner, and the allocation of party resources. The system is designed to keep the party alive and well by allowing current ideas and candidates to be tested and new ideas and candidates to be heard.

Here is what I mean. If you think the primary system we have now is no good, try imagining this: each state and territory holds an open election, the delegates are assigned proportionally to reflect the vote, and those delegates are committed to hold to that candidate for, say, the first 10 ballots. That way you have a pure vote, a fairly precise correlation between how the people vote and how the delegates vote, and no double-crossing on the subsequent ballots. Simple, clean, and easily explained to the voters by the news media.

Under this imagined Pure-Vote system, you would have chaos. In this 2016 cycle, Trump would have 20% fewer delegates as of today, with little chance of getting a majority, ever – unless he were to negotiate for Kasich's and Rubio's delegates before the convention.

[heights]

Yeah, winning in a State by 20 Points and the Party Hacks assigning the Delegates to vote for your opponent on the second ballot isn’t lowlife stealing tactics are all.

[SeekAndFind]

Daren Jonescu of the American Thinker, writes on the day of the New York primary:

Here's how I performed the calculations, so you may double-check my math for yourself. Following the primary map at Politico, I converted the exact percentage of each state's popular vote for Donald Trump and Ted Cruz into the precise number of that state's total delegates that each man would receive on a strictly proportional system, rounding upward for any decimal at or above .5, and downward for any decimal below .5.

Here is what I found.

After thirty-four primaries, counting all the state votes completed as of April 16, including D.C. but excluding Colorado and the territories, we reach the following delegate totals: Trump 554, Cruz 490.

Apparently the system is rigged after all! I could have sworn Trump was miles ahead, the race all but over, and the disenfranchised masses lighting their torches for the march on Cleveland, where Trump's rightful nomination was about to be stolen. As it turns out, on the "transparent and simple" proportional model suggested by one of American Thinker's most thoughtful Trump advocates, Trump would be less than halfway to the delegate majority, with Cruz right on his heels. The race, had this model actually been used, would have a completely different dynamic at this point. It would be a neck and neck contest between two men neither of whom had any realistic path to a first ballot majority.

Far from looking like a nominee about to have his prize stolen from him, Trump would look even more like what he already seems to be: a novelty candidate whose early plurality is fading as a huge field has pared itself down to three; whose lack of knowledge, coherence, consistency, and campaign management are becoming increasingly glaring liabilities; and whose survival in this race depends entirely on the continued presence of an already-eliminated establishment candidate (Kasich) who evidently remains in the running for no other reason than to divide the anti-Trump majority.

[SeekAndFind]

RE: Yeah, winning in a State by 20 Points and the Party Hacks assigning the Delegates to vote for your opponent on the second ballot isn’t lowlife stealing tactics are all.

What about winning less than 45% of the votes in a state and winning ALL of the delegates ( See Florida )?

[Donglalinger]

What's wrong with just following the rules as they are written?

[taxcontrol]

For those of you that were demanding that Colorado throw away it caucus system, understand what you are supporting. The democrats in the state legislature are now offering a bill to change the party controlled caucus system to a state controlled primary system.

Understand that the legislature will FORCE the GOP party to OPEN the vote for the nominee to ANYONE who wishes to “temporarily” change their registrations. The independents will now get to decide who the party nominee is going to be from Colorado.

This is what we had before and what we voted OUT.

[SeekAndFind]

OK, how do you propose we re-write the rules of the primaries?

[ClearCase_guy]

Some states (ex. Colorado) didn’t allow voters to vote. The state just assigned delegates. Other states (ex. PA) let voters vote then essentially throw the votes away and assign delegates.

Is the word “rigged” not quite accurate? Maybe. But clearly the voters are not being allowed to participate in some areas.

[TheRobb7]

Hope you’ve got your flame suit ready.

[Donglalinger]

“OK, how do you propose we re-write the rules of the primaries?”
Every state is winner take all, just like general election, The person with the most delegates wins nomination.

[Mechanicos]

Did Trump work with the State Party and national committee to set up Florida? thats what happened with #NeverTrump. Only reason he did so well in Florida was because it was rigged for the GOPe guy who was supposed to win. Cruz has benefited from the rigging of the #neverTrump GOPe machine already existing in states where people were allowed to vote.

No comparison and your talking point is BS. Trump is doing so well despite the rigging, just like hes doing so well despite the 55K negative ads and hundreds of millions spent against him. Its a positive he could turn the rigged primary against him to him where people were allowed to vote.

[SeekAndFind]

RE: Every state is winner take all, just like general election, The person with the most delegates wins nomination.

You realize this disenfranchises the majority of state voters.

If there are 10 candidates and the winner takes less than 30% of the votes with the rest proportioned among the other 9, the 70% who did not vote for him have their will ignored.

Why not a proportional system? You win 29%, you get 29% of the delegates, etc.

[DoughtyOne]

I never thought I would see the day when going to the ballot box and expressing our will on issues would be trashed by someone seeking my support.

None the less, here we are. Delegates are the pure. Voters are the unpure.

Let’s refresh our memory a bit here.

For literally most of my 65 years, I have been told that voting was my sacred right. I must participate in the system. In general elections I had to take part, “...because this was the most important election in my lifetime. ‘Our candidate’ for the Oval Office, had to win!”

Now, I’m told that selecting a nominee in my local state is corrupted by my vote. Delegates are the rage. This is a Republic don’t you know...

“After all, we have an electoral college, you idiot!”

Folks, selecting a nominee in one state, is not at all like selecting a president in fifty different states of varying sizes. The electoral college was instituted to help smaller states feel like they had a voice. That concern is not present in states.

We the public demand to have a say in the process. We do, because after decades, we have a majority in the Senate and the House, and those people have let Obama have every single thing he wanted. EVERYTHING!

After watching these idiots for the last eight years, particularly after we took over, it’s clear a traitor can serve in the oval office and bring Muslim Brotherhood terrorists into that building to advise him.

Our checks and balances system is DOA. It barely had a pulse when Bush left, and now it’s been flatlining for eight years.

Don’t come to me with your horse ‘stuff’ about Republics vs Democracies. I’m not falling for it. I want a say in what is taking place, and our nation on the f——— rocks is the reason why.

If you can’t grasp this, you certainly don’t belong here.

[Political Junkie Too]

how do you propose we re-write the rules of the primaries?

What's wrong with just letting the candidates choose their own delegates after a primary determines the allocation? Why add extra layers of party involvement? Just let the parties manage member applications to be a delegate, and then pass along a vetted roster to each candidate who earned delegates.

-PJ

[deport]

This is what we had before and what we voted OUT.

*************

Some like it hot and some like it cold. What you just explained is basically how Texas
conducts their primaries. Each new 2 year election cycle you get a new voter registration
card verifying your registration. On primary day you go to your polling location and you
select which party’s primary you want to participate in. They stamp you regrisatation card
for that party and you are bound to that party for any runoffs. At the end of the two year
cycle you are issued a new voter registration card and the process starts all over again.
Works fine for them but it may not work for others.

[SeekAndFind]

RE: Did Trump work with the State Party and national committee to set up Florida? thats what happened with #NeverTrump. Only reason he did so well in Florida was because it was rigged for the GOPe guy who was supposed to win

Well, you just made my point — the system is not rigged. It benefited Trump tremendously when the same system was applied to his campaign.

[JoSixChip]

This is what we had before and what we voted OUT.

Who is we kemosabe? If you don't like the open primary, then work for a closed one. But remember, in colorado all you have to do is show-up at at a polling place on the day of the election and say you intend to move to that precinct in the near future to register and vote same day. So closed, open makes no difference. The existing system where the gopE hacks pick the delegates is BS and needs to be gone.

[Boogieman]

The fact is that the state parties get to decide how they will determine their delegate distributions. If they want to draw names from a hat, that’s their prerogative.

If the party members in the state don’t like the choice, it is up to them to take action in their state party and change it, BEFORE the next election.

[SeekAndFind]

RE: Hope you’ve got your flame suit ready.

If I were worried about that, I would not be posting this thread.

[jjotto]

It’s one of the last vestiges of state independence and sovereignty, and it’s not liberals who want to take it down.