Posted on 02/19/2007 1:14:04 AM PST by Jim Robinson
Edited on 02/19/2007 2:20:11 AM PST by Jim Robinson. [history]
I was told earlier this evening that it's impossible for a conservative to win the general election against Hillary Clinton. That the socially liberal Rudy Giuliani is the ONLY Republican who can (a) beat Hillary and (b) win the war.
How many FReepers actually believe this hogwash? If we have no faith in our own conservative principles and values why do we call ourselves conservatives? How can we possibly hope to advance our conservative causes if we tuck tail and run when we should be fighting as if our very survival as a free people depends upon it. Because it does.
We cannot advance conservatism by running a social liberal for the office of chief executive. If you want proof, ask Arnie, the socially liberal Republican governor of California. No thanks. You can have him and the socialist horse he rode in on.
We cannot defend life, liberty or nation (see below discussion on securing borders) with a social liberal at the helm.
I'd like to build a winning conservative platform with a dozen or so hard hitting no nonsense points that we can all agree on that would help us focus on our best potential primary nominee and one that can defeat Hillary, et al, in the general.
Here's a starter list and it's open for discussion, cutting, consolidation, expansion and detailing:
Would a conservative platform focusing on victory in the war, national security, national defense, securing the borders, deporting illegal aliens, sound fiscal policy and defense of life, liberty, property and individual rights be a winner over Hillary's treasonous platform of surrender, weakness, open borders, socialist fiscal policies, "abortion rights," "gay rights," global warming, continued government abuses and subversion of our rights to freedom of religion, freedom of speech, right to keep and bear arms and private property rights?
Expanding on one issue, for example, I'm pushing for increased border security. I used to be in favor of some sort of temporary worker program, but not one that has a fast track to citizenship. I'm now coming around to the point of view held by the majority of Americans regardless of political party affiliation and that is we MUST secure the borders immediately. It's obvious that this war against Islamic fascism is going to grind on even after we put down the nasty business in Iraq. We must secure the borders against terrorist intrusion and infiltration. We must tightly control ALL immigration to the US.
It's also becoming more and more obvious that Americans are not happy with illegals taking jobs in an ever growing number of industries. They're no longer just doing field labor and or menial low paying tasks. They're creeping up the uskilled labor and union scale, only they're competing unfairly by accepting low wages and under the table payments.
We also need to seal the borders against drug smugglers, weapons smugglers, criminals, terrorists, etc. Catch them, try them and lock them up.
Americans are also tired of footing the bills for illegal alien health care, education, welfare, auto accidents, crime, disease, etc.
It's way past time to call a halt to this nonsense. I say we catch them at the borders and deport them. If we catch them again, place them in a work camp. If they want to work, fine, let them work in a work camp for their keep. Nothing more. And no illegal families or children or anchor babies. If it takes additional laws on the books, fine let's get it done. If it takes a constitutional amendment to stop the anchor babies, let's get the process started.
We should also catch and deport them when they show up at the DMV, voter registration or voting booth, unemployment line, bank, building permit office, welfare department, social security office, hospitals, free clinics, schools, jails, auto accident or traffic stops, etc. If they can't speak English and they don't have valid identification, then we need to hold them or call in the INS.
If we're going to secure the nation we must secure the borders, control immigration and stop pandering to the illegals or their enablers. Employers who willingly and knowingly hire illegals should be punished. If they pay their workers under the table and fail to withhold taxes or social security, they should be dealt with as felons.
So, we win the war, secure the nation, build our defenses, return to a sound fiscal policy, cut spending and taxes, and defend our rights.
How many states would go for this platform as opposed to Hillary's that is exactly opposite?
I think we'd even pull in California.
What say you?
First I would not vote for ANY candidate that has been previously elected by a Democrat held State, such as New York OR Massachusetts.
IMHO, we are not only losing control of our country to illegal aliens, we are coming under attack by diseases brought in by these same illegals.
Social Security pays more than $450 billion in benefits each year. If nothing is done, by 2060, the combination of Social Security and Medicare will account for more than 71 percent of the federal budget.---Source: Statement of Thomas R. Saving (PDF), Public Trustee of the Social Security Board of Trustees before the Senate Special Committee on Aging, July 29, 2003.
There's no free lunch in Iraq.
"Winning the war" would require higher taxes to pay for an expanded military and for the cost of a complicated operation at the end of a global supply line.
IMO conservatives have to make a choice here: realistically, "cutting government spending" is not going to come close to paying for this war, and pushing the cost onto the next generation is likely even worse for US security than the current situation.
Increasingly, voters understand this.
And unless candidates - Democratic or Republican - present some sort of workable solution they will increasingly be regarded as part of the problem.
That is because most Americans don't understand the issue. We need to educate them. FYI: We are not anti-immigration, but anti ILLEGAL immigration.
The impact of illegal immigration has far reaching consequences for the future of this country. It transcends partisan politics. We need to be on the right side of this issue. It will pay dividends down the road.
I noted you sorta kinda referred to Rudy JulieAnnie as "IT", since "It's" into cross-dressing, I'll sorta kinda concur....;-)
Because the majority of American voters are dumb S.O.B.'s and believe anything politicians and the media tell them.
Bilbray for one. Has it hurt the electability of Tancredo or the 203 Reps who voted for the House enforcement first bill?
I couldn't agree with you more. I suspect the the only chance Rudy has at the nomination is if Tancredo and Newt split the conservative vote with Hunter while a McCain and Romney withdrawal throws the RINO vote to Rudy.
I find it very odd the level of pro-rudy nonsense that is posted here given that only 13% of the visitors supported him. Add to that the slow drift to the left in every FR poll after roughly week 2 for the past few months and I think perhaps we are being Freeped.
Thanks Jim. I am bookmarking this & will monitor it. I have really done little to get into the current candidates other than skim/reading all here at FR & it seems for everyone with a banner for one person, there is another saying "no way Jose"..
Part of me regrets that so many good decent people are eliminated because they aren't a "name" or cannot possibly get funding because the do not have a "name". So we are stuck with a lot of "names" with various baggage.
The ones maybe the most appealing are then discounted by many as "un-winnable"...(is that a word? it is a concept)
sigh
The political mental giant at FR I am not, but appreciate all the input from everyone to help me learn.
Name those who lost because of their stand on illegal immigration. If you say Hayworth, you are wrong.
I'm with ASA Vet: Thanks to Jim Robinson for reminding that this is a conservative site. I have seen a lot of posts lately that made me wonder.
Thirty to thirty-five years ago, I was a conservative DemocRat, until it was impossible to be conservative in that party.
I have been a conservative Republican since then, but if it becomes impossible to be a conservative in that party, well, there are other options.
However, I think the 2006 elections show what happens to the Republican party when conservatives stay home or vote elsewhere. Hint: Remember 50 years of 'Rat domination of the House and Senate.
exactly right.
Roe versus Wade must be overturned, Abortion decided state by state. McCain even now realizes that. The 10 points should have it prominate on the list.
IMO it's not Muslim Russia and Europe, it's Muslim Europe and Russia. Part of a new ME policy should be rapprochement with Christian Russia. Our present policy in the Balkans and on Chechnya, should be reversed. It has forced Russia to make bad choices that can be reversed.
High on the list should be straight talk on this being a religious war. Islamists Mullahs, for 1400 years have preached a mission statement , now embedded in their textbooks, that is now The major problem
The problem is this: President Bush needs to ramp up the war on terror and set the troops free in Iraq (and elsewhere to WIN this thing instead of having them fight with one or both hands tied behind their backs due to unrealistic "rules of engagement". We need to find and kill that little turd Muktar Alsader; something we should have done YEARS ago when he was a small problem.
The president needs to act upon plans already in place to strike Iran's nuclear facilities and Iran itself in order to stop Mad president Tom's apocalyptic plans to destroy America, Israel and the West, control the Middle East and it's oil and bring about the return of the Maddi from the well. Iran needs to be immediately stopped from medaling in Iraq and the West.
The President should NOT be playing Clinton 2 when it comes to North Korea. We should not be giving one cent's worth of ANY aid to that human piece of excrement lill Kim. His word and the word/promises of his so-called "government" isn't worth the toilet paper it is written on. Even so, instead of bringing his evil regime to it's knees and collapse as we did with Russia, we are planning on giving him FOUR TIMES MORE goodies than Clown Clintoon did to get him to "promise" to behave, "play nice" and merely "put his nuke program on hold".
The illegal alien and unsecured boarder problems are President Bush's fault. He could stop the influx of illegals in two to four months if he genuinely secured our boarders by calling out the National Guard and setting them free to stop, arrest or shoot those crossing the boarders. But he staunchly refuses to do so because he and his business buds want cheap labor with the real costs ending up on the backs of honest taxpaying American citizens.
Lack of energy independence ane our reliance on the Middle East is also Mr. Bush's fault. Energy is a vital national/defense issue. By executive order he coulr order drilling in Alaska and other areas. Relax the regs for new nuclear facilities and construction which is desperately needed. As for oil, we are spending BILLIONS of dollars saving the Iraqu's butts, they should be made to pony up and help us with oil. Who cares what the "blood for oil" kooks say; the fact of the matter is we will not survive as a nation running on electric cars that go 50 to 100 miles and die for lack of juice, bio deisel or ethanol.
It is President Bush's and the conservative Republican's fault the democrats have been winning the propaganda war here in the USA. They lie to the American people on a daily basis about EVERYTHING and no one on our side calls them on ANY of it! There have also been massive security leaks in the war on terror: These people are TRAITORS, who, if this were WW2, would have been imprisoned or put to death for the antics they are pulling. But NOTHING is happening, nothing is done to punish them, because the people in power on our side REFUSE to deal with ANY of them. With the result they keep on doing what they have been doing and getting away with it.
I could go on but why bother; Americans want to act like September 11th never happened. They want to live in a September 10th world while Islamofascists and their Islamic States along with communist China, Venezuela, North Korea, etc... plot our destruction and demise.
Sadly; hundreds of thousands if not millions of Americans are going to have to die before the public and the politicians take any of this seriously and even then the media will blame America when it is attacked. It will be our fault; "if only we had been more understanding of Islam." "If only we had sought to 'dialog'/understand them." You get the picture.
Until then, the Islamic terrorists will continue to attack us like they did last week in a Utah mall and the press will continue to gloss over the facts and not mention that Islam is behind the attacks and that the attackers are Muslums, not extremists but Muslims doing exactly what their so-called blood thirsty, Satan worshipping "religion" tells them to do to all of us "infidels" in order to gain entrance to perpetual eroticland where they will have super human erections, 72 perpetual virgins and lots of sleek young men to fulfill their every perverted sexual fantasies... forever.
Instead, the press, along with our politicians will continue to say that the ongoing and increasing attacks are merely "isolated incidents" that have nothing to do with Islam.
Forgive me for the rant but platforms are only good if you have MEN with the guts, fortitude and resolve to put them into place and practice without compromise, no matter what the cost. Frankly, I do not see ANY Republican on the political horizon willing to do that and even if there were, given the feckless cowardice of the American public and their delusional desire to continue believing/living in a September 10th fantasy land when we are in fact living in a post September 11th world that is filled with people (and nation states) within and without our nation who are bent on our conversion, enslavement death and destruction.
The Republicans do not stand a chance of getting elected, unless President Bush and our party finally steps up to the plate, play political hardball and begins to do what he and they should have been doing all along since September 11th; putting the country on a genuine war footing and doing what ever it takes, what ever it costs, no matter how difficult, to win! Only then; when the American people can see that BECAUSE OF OUR POLICIES AND STAUNCHLY FOLLOWING AND IMPLEMENTING A STRONG CONSERVATIVE PLATFORM, we are winning the war on terror, controlling the borders and illegal immigration, getting our energy interests under control, in order to preserve the present and future life of the nation, that treason will not be tolerated and those who actively betray the nation are severely punished, only then will the American people recognize the truth and turn to presidential and state candidates that espouse the platform you have presented. In my opinion; unless and until that takes place we cannot and will not win.
He did do help patch some things that he had to. Some of the major issues in the recall. We'll have to ask his wife and her relatives why he is so liberal now.
I couldn't have said it better.
In 1950, there were 16 workers paying Social Security taxes for every retired person receiving benefits. Today there are 3.3. By 2030, there will be only 2. 48 million Americans receive Social Security benefits, including 33 million retirees, 7 million survivors, and 8 million disabled workers. By 2030, there will be 70 million Americans of retirement age--twice as many as today.
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