Posted on 01/18/2005 5:57:53 PM PST by wagglebee
All the South has ever desired was that the Union, as established by our Forefathers, should be preserved, and that the government, as originally organized, should be administered in purity and truth.
--Robert E. Lee
Why do Americans continue to remember their past?
Perhaps it is because it was a time when truth was spoken. Men and women took their stand to give us the freedoms we now enjoy. God bless those in military service, who do their duty around the world for freedom.
The Hall of Fame for great Americans opened in 1900 in New York City. One thousand names were submitted, but only 29 received a majority vote from the electors. General Robert E. Lee, 30 years after his death, was among those honored. A bust of Lee was given to New York University by the United Daughters of the Confederacy.
Let America not forget January 19, 2005, the 198th birthday of General Robert E. Lee.
Robert E. Lee was born at Stratford House, Westmoreland County, Virginia, on January 19, 1807. The winter was cold and fireplaces were little help. Robert's mother, Ann Hill (Carter) Lee, was suffering from a severe cold.
Ann Lee named her son Robert Edward after her two brothers.
Robert E. Lee undoubtedly acquired his love of country from those who had lived during the American Revolution. His father, "Light Horse" Harry, was a hero of the revolution and served as governor of Virginia and as a member of the U.S. House of Representatives. Members of his family also signed the Declaration of Independence.
Lee was educated in the schools of Alexandria, Virginia. In 1825, he received an appointment to West Point Military Academy. He graduated in 1829, second in his class and without a single demerit.
Robert E. Lee wed Mary Anna Randolph Custis in June 1831, two years after his graduation from West Point. Robert and Mary had grown up together. Mary was the daughter of George Washington Parke Custis, the grandson of Martha Washington and the adopted son of George Washington.
Mary was an only child; therefore, she inherited Arlington House, across the Potomac from Washington, where she and Robert raised seven children.
Army promotions were slow. In 1836, Lee was appointed to first lieutenant. In 1838, with the rank of captain, Lee fought valiantly in the War with Mexico and was wounded at the Battle of Chapultepec.
He was appointed superintendent of West Point in 1852 and is considered one of the best superintendents in that institution's history.
President-to-be Abraham Lincoln offered command of the Union Army to Lee in 1861, but Lee refused. He would not raise arms against his native state.
War was in the air. The country was in turmoil of separation. Lee wrestled with his soul. He had served in the United States Army for over 30 years.
After an all-night battle, much of that time on his knees in prayer, Robert Edward Lee reached his decision. He reluctantly resigned his commission and headed home to Virginia.
Arlington House would be occupied by the Federals, who would turn the estate into a war cemetery. Today it is one of our country's most cherished memorials, Arlington National Cemetery.
President John F. Kennedy visited Arlington shortly before he was assassinated in 1963 and said he wanted to be buried there. And he is, in front of Robert E. Lee's home.
Lee served as adviser to Confederate President Jefferson Davis and then commanded the legendary Army of Northern Virginia. The exploits of Lee's army fill thousands of books today.
After four terrible years of death and destruction, General Robert E. Lee met General Ulysses S. Grant at Appomattox, Virginia, and ended their battles. He told his disheartened comrades, "Go home and be good Americans."
Lee was called Marse Robert, Uncle Robert and Marble Man. He was loved by the people of the South and adopted by the folks from the North.
Robert E. Lee was a man of honor, proud of his name and heritage. After the War Between the States, he was offered $50,000 for the use of his name. His reply was "Sirs, my name is the heritage of my parents. It is all I have and it is not for sale."
In the fall of 1865, Lee was offered and accepted the presidency of troubled Washington College in Lexington, Virginia. The school was renamed Washington and Lee in his honor.
Robert E. Lee died of a heart attack at 9:30 on the morning of October 12, 1870, at Washington-Lee College. His last words were "Strike the tent." He was 63 years of age.
He is buried in a chapel on the school grounds with his family and near his favorite horse, Traveller.
A prolific letter writer, Lee wrote his most famous quote to son Custis in 1852: "Duty is the sublimest word in our language."
On this 198th anniversary let us ponder the words he wrote to Annette Carter in 1868: "I grieve for posterity, for American principles and American liberty."
Winston Churchill called Lee "one of the noblest Americans who ever lived." Lee's life was one of service and self-sacrifice. His motto was "Duty, Honor, Country."
God Bless America!
LOL! The only BS is that comment. The British NEVER recognized the Confederacy. NO country did.
They joined and left two governments independently and unilaterally. Justice Grier did not rule their secession illegal as I documented, and that decision also notes that numerous nations recognized the independence of the Confederate states when 'the Queen of England issued her proclamation of neutrality, "recognizing hostilities as existing between the Government of the United States of America and certain States styling themselves the Confederate States of America."
Thus, contradicting your own "BS" in the same post.
If it was, as you claim, a civil war, you must PROVE that the confederacy did NOT have a government which conducted the war.
No...you must prove that Government was legitimate. States have governments as well. So do counties. If the County of New York tried to secede that would find it very difficult to do this. If Georgia has right to leave the United States, what is stopping every county and city from leaving Georgia?
Hint: I'll make this VERY easy. Justice Robert C. Grier, speaking for the court, refers to the 'organization of a government by the seceding States'. 539
Hint, organizing of a government means nothing. The Irish Republican Army had a provisional government too.
I'll give you a second hint - The opinions of Justices are constantly overturned by other justices. It is your OPINIO (along with many who think like you) that the south had the right to secede. It is my opinion (along with many who think like me) that they did not. Both side have itlelectual arguments, both sides quote law, lawyers, judges. In the end, the argument was closed at Appomattox. You can argue the point all day, but it does not change the fact that the South was crushed in its attempt to secede and the United States of America was preserved (Glory Hallelujah!). God's will be done.
I recall that Ireland won independence from Britain, formed the Irish Free State, later the Republic of Ireland (Eire) and that Eamonn de Valera (IRA) was the President back when.
The south is only a portion of that "Red Zone" buckaroo.
In addition, that map would have looked a lot different with we "Blue Zone" conservatives who volunteered time & money and dedication in helping to get the President re-elected.
Thanks for writing us all off splitter.
de Valera was, like Confederates, a splitter. He left and took his ball when things did not go his way. He was the cause of the Irish Civil War (which is what it is called - even though there were arguably THREE governments involved). He was elected later.
Ireland is still NOT whole. The provisional government is an example of what the South tried to do. It did not succeed in its goal. There are also numerous other examples from WWII & the Cold war if you prefer.
Would you care to explain the reason we have the 2nd Amendment?
[NJ Neocon #544] You recall incorrectly. de Valera was, like Confederates, a splitter. He left and took his ball when things did not go his way. He was the cause of the Irish Civil War (which is what it is called - even though there were arguably THREE governments involved). He was elected later.
Ireland is still NOT whole. The provisional government is an example of what the South tried to do. It did not succeed in its goal. There are also numerous other examples from WWII & the Cold war if you prefer.
WHAT do you allege that I recalled incorrectly?
I recalled that Ireland won independence from Britain. Do you deny it?
I recalled that the Irish formed the Irish Free State, later the Republic of Ireland (Eire). Do you deny it?
I recalled that Eamonn de Valera was the President back when. Do you deny that Eamonn de Valera was the President back when? American-born de Valera was also the Prime Minister back when.
The direct cause of the Irish Civil War was the agreement to partition Ireland, leaving part of Ulster under the British. "[Michael Collins] and Griffith were the leaders of the team that negotiated the treaty that gave near independence to the 26 counties, while partitioning off 6 counties." "[T]he opposition, led by De Valera, objected strenuously to a provision that virtually guaranteed a separate government in Northern Ireland and to an article that required members of the Dáil to swear allegiance to the British sovereign...."
The war against Britain was the Irish Rebellion (or Irish Revolution). The war between various factions of Ireland after the partitioning which left part of Ulster under British control was called the Irish Civil War.
LINK [Excerpts]
In January 1919 the Sinn Féin members of Parliament assembled in Dublin as the Dáil Éireann, or national assembly. Proclaiming the independence of Ireland, the Dáil forthwith formed a government, with Eamon De Valera as president.Partly as a result of the failure of the government to cope with domestic difficulties brought on by the world economic crisis of the early 1930s, Cosgrave's party lost several seats to the Republicans in the elections of February 1932. De Valera thereupon became head of the government. Legislation that he sponsored in the following April included provisions for the abrogation of the oath of allegiance to the British crown.
The 5-year term of office of the Dáil expired in June 1937. In the subsequent election the Republican party won a plurality of the seats in the Dáil. The new constitution, which abolished the Irish Free State and established Éire as a 'Sovereign independent democratic state,' was approved by the voters in a plebiscite conducted simultaneously with the election. This document provided for a new senate of 60 members. Although the constitution specifically applied to all Ireland, it provided that the laws of Éire should be executed, pending unification with Northern Ireland, only within the territory of the republic. The constitution contained no references to the British sovereign or to the Commonwealth of Nations. A subsequent statement by De Valera indicated, however, that Éire's relations with Great Britain would be governed by the External Relations Act of 1936. In 1938 the Irish writer and patriot Douglas Hyde became the first president of Éire, and De Valera became prime minister.
Éire maintained neutrality in World War II, although many thousands of Irish citizens joined the Allied forces or worked in British war industry. In the immediate post-war era, the economic dislocations in Great Britain and Europe subjected the economy of Éire to severe strains, resulting in a period of rapid inflation and, indirectly, in the defeat of Fianna Fáil in the elections of February 1948. De Valera was defeated in the Dáil for the prime ministry by John Aloysius Costello, candidate of a six-party coalition opposed to Fianna Fáil. Costello, a former attorney general, called for lower prices and taxes, the expansion of industrial production, and closer commercial relations with Great Britain.
The warfare against the British continued until July 10, 1921, when a truce was arranged. Subsequent negotiations led to the signing, in December 1921, of a peace treaty by representatives of the second Dáil Éireann and the British government. By the terms of the treaty, all of Ireland except the six counties constituting Northern Ireland was to receive dominion status identical with that of Canada. After considerable debate, in which the opposition, led by De Valera, objected strenuously to a provision that virtually guaranteed a separate government in Northern Ireland and to an article that required members of the Dáil to swear allegiance to the British sovereign, the Dáil ratified the treaty on January 15, 1922, by a vote of 64 to 57. Ratification brought into being the Irish Free State, with Arthur Griffith as president and Michael Collins, who was another prominent member of Sinn Féin, as chairman of the provisional government.
After de Valera left for America (June 1919) on an 18 month fund raising tour, Collins became the dominant figure in the revolution (although Cathal Brugha, the IRA's Commander-in-Chief, disliked him intensely). At various times, Collins held positions as (1) President of the Supreme Council of the IRB, (2) A leader, but not Commander-in-Chief of the IRA, (3) Sinn Féin member of the Dail, (4) Commander-in-Chief of the Free State Army, (5) Minister of Finance in the 1919 Provisional Government of the RoI, and (6) Cabinet member in the first post-treaty government. He is best know for his brilliant work during the Anglo-Irish war in setting up the IRA's extremely effective intelligence and counter-intelligence unit that time and time again saved the IRA forces to fight another day. He and Griffith were the leaders of the team that negotiated the treaty that gave near independence to the 26 counties, while partitioning off 6 counties. During the post-treaty war, he was ambushed and killed by anti-treaty guerillas. Had he lived, he certainly would have competed with de Valera for political dominance in the Irish state.
We are talking past each other and splitting hairs on this. I see us essentially saying the same thing but declaring it means different things.
No. You said I recalled incorrectly. I was correct. You were, once again, pulling it out your butt. Now you are just trying to weasel out of it.
The provisional government of Ireland led to the Irish Free State. Eamonn de Valera was head of the provisional government and later elected head of the government of the Irish Free State. When it became the Republic of Ireland, that same Eamonn de Valera became Prime Minister.
The partitioning agreement was entered into by Michael Collins, not Eamonn de Valera.
The war for Irish independence from Britain was NOT known as the Irish Civil War. That came later. The war for independence was the Irish Rebellion or Irish Revolution.
We are most definitely NOT saying the same thing.
Your claims of "back when" implied he was always the president of Ireland. He was the provisional president, he quite just like the whining Confederate leaders, and his leaving and his facton's opposition caused the Irish Civil War (with the Brits backing NOT de Valera, but the Free State).
A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
So that the people would be equipped to be in a well regulated militia
Let’s review.
[quote from Jacob Hoke, Chambersburg resident, my post 453]: The three gentlemen from whom I have quoted - Early, Imboden, and Slingluff, - refer to the humane manner in which General Lee conducted his campaign in Pennsylvania in 1863, and claim that no wanton destruction of private property was made. This is freely admitted. With the exception of the railroad buildings in Chambersburg, and one or two buildings on the field of Gettysburg, no houses or barns were destroyed. Private property was taken for the use of the army, but, except in a few cases by stragglers, the regulations of seizure laid down by General Lee in general orders No. 72, and issued specially for the Pennsylvania campaign, were strictly observed.
Other than the houses and barns mentioned by the Chambersburg resident Hoke, where were any houses and barns destroyed in Lee's invasion? If not, then Hoke's statement that no houses or barns were destroyed in Lee’s invasion other than the ones he mentioned was accurate.
Hoke had cited descriptions by Early, Imboden, and Slingluff of the destruction of houses by Union General Hunter. Were they wrong in their descriptions of what Hunter did?
Lee's troops behaved much better in the North than Northern troops in the South. If you’ve forgotten, I’ve documented some of the Northern behavior in my posts:
395, newspaper account of destruction by Sherman’s troops
400, Hunter’s destruction of houses in Virginia
432, Various accounts of destruction by Northern troops
450, Hunter’s orders contrasted with Lee’s orders
453, Behavior of Sherman’s troops as related by Union commanders
468, More accounts by Union generals of pillage and house burning in GA & SC
472, Murder, pillage, and/or house burning in MO, GA, SC, and FL.
477, Lincoln letter to Grant suggesting halt to house burning
Lee's troops behaved much better in the North than Northern troops in the South.
The fact that the destruction visited on the North was far less than that visited on the South is indeniable. Lee and his army spent very little time in the North. And in many cases, such as in Georgia and in the Valley, the destruction of goods and facilities that benefitted the confederate war effort was done to deny those resources to Lee's army. But the claim that the individual actions of the soldiers was 'much better' is debatable.
Read up on the Federalist Papers. The militia ain't the National Guard BTW.
The iron mill was destroyed by the orders of General Early. That was a military target. It was only a side benefit that it was owned by Thaddeus Stevens.
Can you point to one where the court held that the Confederacy did not form a government? But I do agree, the courts are not infallible. The court, in a near unanimous opinion authored by a Yankee justice, held that segregation was legal. It did so based on an 1848 (IIRC) Massachusett law. The lone dissenter was Southern.
The courts have gave us legalized abortion, somehow discovering a right which eluded millions for almost 200 years. Today's court ruled 6-2 that a search is not a search when performed by a dog, and even the dissenters added clauses for bomb-sniffing dogs. I despise the thought of a living, evolving Constitution. If any change is necessary, amend it. In the past few days we have this same court refuse to hear a Florida case involving the Guarantee clause - a republican form of government is NOT one where the judiciary ignores the law.
Furthermore, the courts, state and federal, are not the ultimate arbiters of such decisions, they are penultimate. The federal courts are creatures of the people, and at all times amenable by them. Our founding fathers fought for the freedom to govern themselves, to free themselves from the clutches of tyrannical despots.
'They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety' - Benjamin Franklin
'If you love wealth more than liberty, the tranquility of servitude better than the animating contest of freedom, depart from us in peace. We ask not your counsel nor your arms. Crouch down and lick the hand that feeds you. May your chains rest lightly upon you and may posterity forget that you were our countrymen.' - Samuel Adams
Splitting hairs, aren't we. Next you'll say that the houses were looted and the property taken for the use of the army.
Regarding a "Republic". See my tagline.
The fact is, the reason the South Seceded is they refused to abide by the rules of the Republic. They saw the writing on the wall. With every free state added the congress would become more and more against slavery and before long the South would lose its "peculiar institution". So, they tried to leave in order to preserve it.
Just correcting your sloppy posting that referred to the "destruction of the iron smelter and the houses of the workers."
I think history proves that it's the other way around. Numerous northern states refused to honour certain parts of their agreement, just as Congress and Lincoln refused to abide by a certain Supreme Court decision. Thus the Confederate states were faced with the prospect of remaining in a union with states that would not abide by their agreement, they exercised their constitutional powers, convened conventions of the people of the state, and voted to leave and resume their delegated powers.
Once the states departed, Congress did not declare war on them. They did not invade the states to drag them back into the union by force. Diplomatically, the Confederate states attempted to resolve all issues peacfully, but their efforts were repeatedly rebuffed by Lincoln. The Confederate Congress enacted a tariff of about 10%, a HUGE decrease from the Morrill tariff rates of well over 40%. Then, and only then, did the North understand that the South's $300,000,000+ exports (foreign and previously domestic) would raise huge sums for the Confederacy, while the North would no longer be guaranteed protection via tariff, and lose millions in revenue.
Which explains Lincoln's stated use of force to collect the tariff unless the Confederate states rejoined the union. A tryant, by any other name, is still a tryant.
... and before long the South would lose its "peculiar institution". So, they tried to leave in order to preserve it.
Nonsense, if slavery was all they desired, all they had to do was remain IN the union and accept the North's - and Lincoln's - offer of Constitutionally permanent slavery. If slavery was what the Confederate states desired - their was no need to leave.
Horse hockey. Slavery was the only reason the south seceded. it is in the declarations of secession of the states.
Lincoln's election scared them into thinking the time was at hand and the advancing free-state additions would eventually causes them to lose political power in this area.
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