John and Jane (Kerry and Fonda, Tom Hayden mentions Kerry's 2001 Meet the Press interview)

the Washington Times ^ | 10 Mar 2004 | Greg Pierce

[weegee]

Sen. John Kerry should not try to distance himself from Jane Fonda, who "was neither wrong nor unconscionable in what she said and did in North Vietnam," says Tom Hayden, one of Miss Fonda's ex-husbands.

Miss Fonda became notorious as "Hanoi Jane" for her 1972 propaganda trip to Hanoi. Last month she blamed "a narrow, extremely conservative, right-wing segment" for publicizing a photo of her and Mr. Kerry at a 1970 antiwar rally as part of an "attempt to smear" the presumptive Democratic presidential nominee.

[weegee]

"Sen. John Kerry should not try to distance himself from Jane Fonda, who "was neither wrong nor unconscionable in what she said and did in North Vietnam..."

It was an act of treason to provide aid and comfort to the enemy during wartime by posing for photos on an antiaircraft gun, Mr. Hayden. Even she admits today that was the wrong thing to do. Doofus.

[Interesting Times]

"The attempted smearing of Kerry through the Fonda 'connection' is a Republican attempt to suppress an honest reopening of our unfinished exploration of the Vietnam era," writes Mr. Hayden, who was a California state legislator for 18 years.

"Actually, it's a grass-roots attempt to expose the lies of Hayden, Fonda, Kerry, and others that led to a totalitarian Vietnam and genocide throughout Southeast Asia," writes Mr. Times, who has been a freeper for 5 1/2 years.

[weegee]

Mr. Hayden, who led the radical Students for a Democratic Society in its most militant protests of the '60s, cites a 2001 "Meet the Press" appearance where Mr. Kerry said that he had committed "atrocities" during his five-month combat tour in Vietnam.

Actually John Kerry retracted the claims of genocide in that 2001 interview. He blamed such talk on the words of an angry young (lying) man.

Kerry speaks about HIS War Crimes

MR. RUSSERT: Thirty years later, you stand by that?

SEN. KERRY: I don't stand by the genocide. I think those were the words of an angry young man. We did not try to do that. But I do stand by the description-I don't even believe there is a purpose served in the word "war criminal." I really don't. But I stand by the rest of what happened over there, Tim.

[weegee]

Here's a crosslink to the full Tom Hayden's Nation article cited in the above Washington Times piece:

You Gotta Love Her

[Salvation]

Pictures here -- What You Don't Know about John Kerry

And more pictures here -- THE KERRY DOSSIER (post here anything you've uncovered on Kerry)

[claudiustg]

---SEN. KERRY: I don't stand by the genocide. I think those were the words of an angry young man. We did not try to do that. But I do stand by the description-I don't even believe there is a purpose served in the word "war criminal."---

Old Meeley Mouth speaks. Soon he'll teach us the meaning of Vietnam! I know I can hardly wait.

[weegee]

Check out that Nation article link. John Kerry lets Tom Hayden do the talking for him to tell us what "Vietnam" meant. Strong barf alert on that article. The thread is worth reading too.

[Savage Beast]

"I think those were the words of an angry young man."

And now we are to hear the words of an angry old man?

[Jimmy Valentine]

"Mr. Hayden, who led the radical Students for a Democratic Society"

SDS was funded by the Communist Party, lest we forget.

Regards,

[samtheman]

I wonder how many retired pilots look at that photo of Jane with the enemy and wish they'd been there in the sky that day to drop some napalm on the scene.

[Milligan]

Jane was very busy with F*** the Army Shows. Entertain the troops and make them desert!

http://lists.village.virginia.edu/sixties/HTML_docs/Texts/Narrative/Gardner_Hollywood_2.html

[weegee]

Thanks for the F-T-A link (by one of the writers). That famous color photo of Jane Fonda and John Kerry may have been shot at an FTA event as Donald Sutherland was reportedly there that day (or maybe Donald was at the rally that Jane was at in the black and white photo that was merged with a black and white photo of Kerry).

The movie is suppressed (and has been since one week after it was released and Jane Fonda decided to become Hanoi Jane) but bootlegs exist. I don't know how likely it is for John Kerry to be in this movie. That was written in 1999 before anyone would have cared if Kerry appeared in it.

[scan58]

Here's a little tid-bit David Horowitz (one who knows) wrote about Mr. Hayden in 1997:

Hayden and I were deadly serious about our revolutionary agendas. During the Vietnam War, Tom traveled many times to North Vietnam, Czechoslovakia and Paris to meet communist North Vietnamese and Viet Cong leaders. He came back from Hanoi proclaiming he had seen "rice roots democracy at work." According to people who were present at the time, including Sol Stern, later an aide to Manhattan Borough President Andrew Stein, Hayden offered tips on conducting psychological warfare against the U.S.

He arranged trips to Hanoi for Americans perceived as friendly to the Communists and blocked entry to those seen as unfriendly, like the sociologist Christopher Jencks. He attacked as "propaganda" stories of torture and labeled American POWs returning home with such stories as "liars." Even after America withdrew its troops from Indochina, Hayden lobbied Congress to end all aid to the anti-Communist regimes in Vietnam and Cambodia. When the cutoff came, the regimes fell and the Communists conquered South Vietnam and Cambodia and slaughtered 2.5 million people. When anti-war activist Joan Baez protested the human rights violations of the North Vietnamese victors, Hayden called her a tool of the CIA.

On the domestic front, Hayden advocated urban rebellions and called for the creation of "guerrilla focos" to resist police and other law enforcement agencies. For a while he led a Berkeley commune called the "Red Family," whose "Minister of Defense" trained commune members at firing ranges and instructed high school students in the use of explosives. He was also an outspoken supporter of the violence-prone Black Panther Party.

It makes me almost ill when I think this man (who may, to this day, still spell it "amerikkka") was/is actually active in American politics.

[secretagent]

Important quote by Horowitz. Source?

[scan58]

HERE

[secretagent]

Thanks.

For the archives - the rest of the article:

Why do these facts still seem important? It is not that
I think a man cannot learn from his mistakes, or
change his mind. Far from it. I myself have recently
published a memoir recounting my own activities in
the radical Left, a past that I now regret. I find this
history relevant not just because Hayden is now
proposing himself as the chief executive of one of
America's most important cities, but because he has
never been fully candid about this past. He has not
owned up to the extent of his dealings with America's
former enemies or to the true agenda of the Red
Family commune, which was little more than a
left-wing militia. He has remained silent about the
criminal activities -- which included murder -- of the
Black Panther Party, whose cause he promoted at the
time.

To be fair, Hayden has admitted to some second
thoughts. In an abstract way, he now understands that
the democratic process is better than the totalitarian
one. He now claims to embrace more modest
ambitions about what can be accomplished in the
political arena. Yet, in all these years, he has not found
the courage to be candid about what he actually did.

His silence on these matters has been coupled of late
with an ongoing attack on the FBI, the CIA and other
authorities responsible for the public's security and
safety. In his 450-page memoir, published only a few
years ago, Hayden included many pages of his FBI
dossier, along with his sarcastic comments suggesting
that the agents who kept an eye on him were no
different from the agents of a police state trying to
suppress unpopular ideas. Just last week Hayden,
along with American communist Angela Davis and
other '60s leftovers, led a march on Los Angeles City
Hall organized by something calling itself the "Crack
the CIA Coalition." Among its demands were
"Dismantle the CIA" and "Stop the media cover-up
of CIA drug involvement," a reference to a San Jose
Mercury News story discredited by the Los Angeles
Times, the New York Times and the Washington Post
that claimed the CIA had flooded Los Angeles'
inner-city communities with crack cocaine.

This sowing of suspicion of legal authority is troubling
in a man who proposes himself as the leader of a city
like Los Angeles, which has many political, racial and
economic fault lines, and in which there are visible
tensions between its diverse communities. At worst, it
fuels the racial paranoia of elements in the inner-city
community who are convinced that there is a
government plot to eliminate their leaders, not to
mention their community itself.

It is only five years since a mob in South Central,
inspired by this deep suspicion and distrust of public
authority, went on a rampage that killed 58 people,
burned 2,000 businesses and destroyed a large section
of the city. Its citizens cannot afford to have as their
chief public official a man who inspires such distrust,
and who actively sows suspicion about the institutions
of civil law and authority. We cannot afford "the fire
next time."
March 3, 1997

[secretagent]

It was an act of treason to provide aid and comfort to the enemy during wartime by posing for photos on an antiaircraft gun, Mr. Hayden. Even she admits today that was the wrong thing to do. Doofus.

But what, specifically, does she admit to having wrong?

Jane Fonda states, "I will go to my grave regretting the photograph of me in an antiaircraft carrier, which looks like I was trying to shoot at American planes. That had nothing to do with the context that photograph was taken in. But it hurt so many soldiers. It galvanized such hostility. It was the most horrible thing I could possibly have done. It was just thoughtless. I wasn't thinking. I was just so bowled over by the whole experience that I didn't realize what it would look like."

Here Fonda apologizes for not realizing how it would appear, not for what she did. She doesn't retract the content of any of her speeches. She doesn't admit that communism was wrong.

She just doesn't want to be unpopular - "It galvanized such hostility".

http://www.freerepublic.com/forum/a396929152196.htm